What?

 

 

You asked for a list of All-Stars and Silver Sluggers, all of them fit that category except perhaps Rowand.

 

And I purposely excluded Griffey, Jr., and Vizquel, too.

 

Oh, and Alex Rios was a 2 time All-Star with the Blue Jays. Not to mention Jake Peavy, Cy Young/All-Star.

Edited April 7, 201213 yr by caulfield12

You asked for a list of All-Stars and Silver Sluggers, all of them fit that category except perhaps Rowand.

 

And I purposely excluded Griffey, Jr., and Vizquel, too.

 

Oh, and Alex Rios was a 2 time All-Star with the Blue Jays. Not to mention Jake Peavy, Cy Young/All-Star.

 

Thomas, Ordonez, and Lee were not on any of the '06-'11 teams.

Thomas, Ordonez, and Lee were not on any of the '06-'11 teams.

 

 

Wow, KW was so smart to trade Santos, he already blew another save today.

 

Still waiting for your Alexei Ramirez/Lillibridge plan to be expanded upon.

 

 

 

There's no reason we can't finish ahead of the Indians (thanks to the ill-advised Jimenez trade) and Twins. The Royals look like they might be tough to beat for 2nd.

Edited April 7, 201213 yr by caulfield12

Wow, KW was so smart to trade Santos, he already blew another save today.

 

Still waiting for your Alexei Ramirez/Lillibridge plan to be expanded upon.

 

Lillibridge gets first shot at SS, if he can't play there find someone else.

Wow, KW was so smart to trade Santos, he already blew another save today.

 

Still waiting for your Alexei Ramirez/Lillibridge plan to be expanded upon.

 

 

 

There's no reason we can't finish ahead of the Indians (thanks to the ill-advised Jimenez trade) and Twins. The Royals look like they might be tough to beat for 2nd.

 

You had the Sox possibly contending with the Tigers during spring training. You are all over the road my friend.

You had the Sox possibly contending with the Tigers during spring training. You are all over the road my friend.

 

 

Everybody picked the D-Backs last in the NL West coming into 2011.

 

We'll surprise a lot of folks, but we don't have the offensive firepower to compete with them.

 

That was also predicated on something bizarre happening, like multiple injuries to their pitching staff, particularly Verlander.

 

 

 

Let's just put it this way. Their 9th place hitter, Ryan Raburn, was among all the MLB leaders in ST homers. He could easily put up 18-22 homers with everyday play at 2B. That would put him 3rd on the White Sox, unless Ramirez/Rios/Viciedo can top him.

 

 

 

Marty, Prince and Miggy alone today hit 4 homers. They're a good team.

Marty, Prince and Miggy alone today hit 4 homers. They're a good team.

 

 

And Alex Avila has quietly become, mostly because of his offense, the best overall catcher in the American League.

 

 

If the Sox lose 100 games this year but Vicideo, Morel, and Beckham show promise in the 2nd half, and Sale gets to 150 innings while healthy, and Peavy and Dunn and Rios are traded, that is a successful year.

 

Sure, and JR will reward the front office and Scouts with nice bonuses. They lose 100 games with a team that KW is 100% responsible for, he's gone.

Sure, and JR will reward the front office and Scouts with nice bonuses. They lose 100 games with a team that KW is 100% responsible for, he's gone.

If he gets fired this year, it would reflect very, very badly on ownership, IMO.

If he gets fired this year, it would reflect very, very badly on ownership, IMO.

 

After a 100 loss season!? One year removed from a season that you said was a different manager away from being a playoff team? The majority of fans here believe this is a .500 team. They go out and are a .333 team, they will lose fan support left and right, and JR will be forced to end the Williams era. It will reflect very badly on management if he doesn't fire his GM.

After a 100 loss season!? One year removed from a season that you said was a different manager away from being a playoff team? The majority of fans here believe this is a .500 team. They go out and are a .333 team, they will lose fan support left and right, and JR will be forced to end the Williams era. It will reflect very badly on management if he doesn't fire his GM.

Yes.

 

If Kenny Williams was told to cut payroll by $25 million this year, and there is any chance he would be given only 1 year to see the rebuilding process through, that would reflect very bad on ownership.

 

Very few teams can cut that kind of payroll while playing for "That year". You can't demand those 2 things and be a fair owner. Firing the GM for not winning enough games after forcing that level of payroll cut would just be ridiculous. You can't ask him to plan for the long term and then fire him based on short term performance.

 

If they were going to fire him, then it should have been after last season. If he's retained for this year, then you need at the very least 2 years of evaluation to see where the rebuilding process will go. 3 would be much more sensible.

I disagree with his conclusion that they won't be contending with the Tigers in September, but there's no denying that Williams is on the spot.

Only an employee of Reinsdorf could possibly believe this slop will be in contention in September.

 

Yes.

 

If Kenny Williams was told to cut payroll by $25 million this year, and there is any chance he would be given only 1 year to see the rebuilding process through, that would reflect very bad on ownership.

 

Very few teams can cut that kind of payroll while playing for "That year". You can't demand those 2 things and be a fair owner. Firing the GM for not winning enough games after forcing that level of payroll cut would just be ridiculous. You can't ask him to plan for the long term and then fire him based on short term performance.

 

If they were going to fire him, then it should have been after last season. If he's retained for this year, then you need at the very least 2 years of evaluation to see where the rebuilding process will go. 3 would be much more sensible.

 

Kenny Williams didn't deserve to be retained this year. You can't retain a GM for a rebuilding that is responsible for the worst farm system in MLB.

I'll never understand the hatred Cowley generates on Soxtalk.

 

 

Me either.

Sox fans just have a hard time dealing with certain realities.

 

They are content to having a second rate organization in no worse than the third largest baseball market in the known universe.

 

I'm not.

 

And I don't want to hear about 2005.

A bunch of marginal players had career years and they won.

They have one hall of fame candidate from that team - and he didn't even play in the series.

They haven't come anywhere to being that good since.

Where I come from that's one-hit wonder.

 

So between Michael Jordan whom he inherited (and b****ed about paying) and 2005, Reinsdorf is the greatest thing since sliced bread.

Edited April 8, 201213 yr by mcgrad70

Kenny Williams didn't deserve to be retained this year. You can't retain a GM for a rebuilding that is responsible for the worst farm system in MLB.

The only reason I ever could come up with for why Kenny was retained this year was that JR told him to do bigger moves like Dunn, in order to give Ozzie a chance to save his job.

Me either.

Sox fans just have a hard time dealing with certain realities.

 

They are content to having a second rate organization in no worse than the third largest baseball market in the known universe.

 

I'm not.

 

And I don't want to hear about 2005.

A bunch of marginal players had career years and they won.

They have one hall of fame candidate from that team - and he didn't even play in the series.

They haven't come anywhere to being that good since.

Where I come from that's one-hit wonder.

 

So between Michael Jordan whom he inherited (and b****ed about paying) and 2005, Reinsdorf is the greatest thing since sliced bread.

Once Cowley puts at least some blame on Ozzie and admit Oney acted like the spoiled doucebag he is, maybe I take some of what he says seriously. Its obvious he has a vendetta and thats not how professional journalists operarate.

 

The only reason I ever could come up with for why Kenny was retained this year was that JR told him to do bigger moves like Dunn, in order to give Ozzie a chance to save his job.

 

Or the organization believes last year was Guillen's doing. And they may be right.

Or the organization believes last year was Guillen's doing. And they may be right.

If that was the only explanation...then it doesn't make sense to cut back on salary so much and bring in a rookie manager...unless you're committed to a multi-year recovery process

If that was the only explanation...then it doesn't make sense to cut back on salary so much and bring in a rookie manager...unless you're committed to a multi-year recovery process

 

The payroll cut is the result of the drop in attendance that will occur.

The payroll cut is the result of the drop in attendance that will occur.

That drop already occurred.

 

But that also means that there is once again room for revenue growth if you can put a winning roster together.

Me either.

Sox fans just have a hard time dealing with certain realities.

 

They are content to having a second rate organization in no worse than the third largest baseball market in the known universe.

 

I'm not.

 

And I don't want to hear about 2005.

A bunch of marginal players had career years and they won.

They have one hall of fame candidate from that team - and he didn't even play in the series.

They haven't come anywhere to being that good since.

Where I come from that's one-hit wonder.

 

So between Michael Jordan whom he inherited (and b****ed about paying) and 2005, Reinsdorf is the greatest thing since sliced bread.

you seem like a sad person

That drop already occurred.

 

But that also means that there is once again room for revenue growth if you can put a winning roster together.

 

How many games do they have to win to draw 2 million this year. I say 90.

Yes.

 

If Kenny Williams was told to cut payroll by $25 million this year, and there is any chance he would be given only 1 year to see the rebuilding process through, that would reflect very bad on ownership.

 

Very few teams can cut that kind of payroll while playing for "That year". You can't demand those 2 things and be a fair owner. Firing the GM for not winning enough games after forcing that level of payroll cut would just be ridiculous. You can't ask him to plan for the long term and then fire him based on short term performance.

 

If they were going to fire him, then it should have been after last season. If he's retained for this year, then you need at the very least 2 years of evaluation to see where the rebuilding process will go. 3 would be much more sensible.

 

But really 100 loses? Are you still standing by that number? In 110 years of White Sox baseball that has happened maybe three times. And not in 40+ years. I think 90 loses and he's fine with some glimmer of hope. But 100 loses, there better be some really good reasons why they would play that poorly without some heads rolling. That would probably mean they are the worst team in baseball. And even with the trimming of the payroll, they still are higher than a lot of teams. You are talking historic worst season, not just a bad season. Wouldn't it be the worst season during JRs ownership?

 

I agree that there needs to be some glimmer of improvement, but I doubt he can withstand a 100 loss season. 72-90 looks bad enough but 62-100 and keeps his job? I'm not certain you can lose 100 games and show improvement.

 

But I doubt this team will lose 100 games, so the debate is kind of silly.

Kenny Williams didn't deserve to be retained this year. You can't retain a GM for a rebuilding that is responsible for the worst farm system in MLB.

 

I love the irony of you jumping on someone for being all over the place.