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JUSTgottaBELIEVE

The Makings of a Juggernaut?

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24 minutes ago, mqr said:

One thing that’s been huge, is that they didn’t try to build a team to take advantage of a weird ball. 
 

Now the ball is different, and they’re reaping the benefits of having a ton of line-drive guys. 

Yes.  You can contrast this with the Twins who built the ultimate juiced-ball offense that paid dividends in 2019 (sort of), but will never be replicated now.

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Posted (edited)
59 minutes ago, southsider2k5 said:

Nothing. They came close, we Crede'd them, end of story 

Other teams should no, you never go full crede. Kills you every time.

Think people forget he dropped two bombs that game.

Edited by Look at Ray Ray Run

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Posted (edited)
1 hour ago, 35thstreetswarm said:

Or you could say that their eating into our lead so dramatically showed we weren't that good a team.

Sweeping them at the end of the season, and winning the division, didn't prove anything either because the Indians weren't that good to begin with.  I mean, they didn't even make the playoffs.  And we *should* have swept them.  

...

2006 showed who we really were as a team.

This is easy!

The almost willful ignorance here is astounding.

Doesn't really matter. Whatever team ends up being hotter usually wins. Cleveland and Minny quite often end up looking like the "weaker" team on paper yet end up kicking our asses, sometimes all season long. I'm glad so far it's been the opposite but it's still too early to really try to reach for "gotcha" moments (which is silly because it's the thought process that determines how logical something is, NOT the results).

Do I think we are a better team? Yes. Has that been proven without a shadow of a doubt yet? Absolutely not. Does it even matter? Possibly not. 

TL;DR: It's way too early to say yet.

Edited by RagahRagah
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1 hour ago, southsider2k5 said:

Nothing. They came close, we Crede'd them, end of story

We ended up winning therefore there is nothing to ever learn from such an experience.

Wow. Tunnel vision like a motherfucker. 

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1 hour ago, BFirebird said:

Thats a great call.  Not necessarily more talented (the A's did have Giambi, Chavez, Tejada, Dye, Damon, Hudson, Mulder, Zito).  Hopefully the main difference will be we have some of our guys locked up already - and hopefully can sign a few more.  Interestingly enough, Menechino was on some of those A's teams in the early 2000s.

Yea, those peak A’s teams were pretty stacked

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54 minutes ago, RagahRagah said:

We ended up winning therefore there is nothing to ever learn from such an experience.

Wow. Tunnel vision like a motherfucker. 

For a franchise that is the ultimate in "close but not quite" seasons, I am not sure what other purpose you want a season to serve than to win.  I have heard of moral victories, but a moral loss?  That is a new one for me.

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1 minute ago, southsider2k5 said:

For a franchise that is the ultimate in "close but not quite" seasons, I am not sure what other purpose you want a season to serve than to win.  I have heard of moral victories, but a moral loss?  That is a new one for me.

The simple point was just to learn to wait before making conclusions, which is a pretty common sense concept that is abandoned far too often on Soxtalk. 2005 has been in the books for over a decade. Only a fraction of this season is so far.

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1 minute ago, RagahRagah said:

The simple point was just to learn to wait before making conclusions, which is a pretty common sense concept that is abandoned far too often on Soxtalk. 2005 has been in the books for over a decade. Only a fraction of this season is so far.

We were world champs, but the season was a failure because Cleveland almost caught us during the regular season, even though we swept them when it matters most. 

Got it.

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1 hour ago, Look at Ray Ray Run said:

Other teams should no, you never go full crede. Kills you every time.

Think people forget he dropped two bombs that game.

I really wish I could've heard Hawk call the 2005 World Series and playoffs .

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6 minutes ago, RagahRagah said:

The simple point was just to learn to wait before making conclusions, which is a pretty common sense concept that is abandoned far too often on Soxtalk. 2005 has been in the books for over a decade. Only a fraction of this season is so far.

...and yet you didn’t wait to come to the conclusion—even earlier in the season—that the Sox should *not* be the favorite to win this division. Bad times call for conclusions.  Good times call for “wait and see.” Got it.

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9 minutes ago, southsider2k5 said:

We were world champs, but the season was a failure because Cleveland almost caught us during the regular season, even though we swept them when it matters most. 

Got it.

No, you definitely do not, "got it." Not at all. And it's quite baffling.

You really must not have actually read and absorbed what you just quoted. 

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Posted (edited)
7 minutes ago, 35thstreetswarm said:

...and yet you didn’t wait to come to the conclusion—even earlier in the season—that the Sox should *not* be the favorite to win this division. Bad times call for conclusions.  Good times call for “wait and see.” Got it.

Second poster in a row who says, "got it" who doesn't at all get it.

History is always a big indicator and basis for where you continue to go. The Sox have a long history of failure, often when they were the "favorites." Being skeptical isn't "negative," it's rational.

The Sox still have a lot to prove.  But NONE of us should be making ANY conclusions, good or bad, about where this team will be at the end of September. Bottom line.

THAT is what I am saying, and it's really wierd how people just seemingly have to insert a narrative into everything so they can be combative about something. Strawmen galore, knock yourself out.

Person wants to try to tease a "gotcha" after a month and a half but I'm the questionable one for going to other way hypothetically? Fucking weird. Biases, I guess.

Edited by RagahRagah
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48 minutes ago, 35thstreetswarm said:

...and yet you didn’t wait to come to the conclusion—even earlier in the season—that the Sox should *not* be the favorite to win this division. Bad times call for conclusions.  Good times call for “wait and see.” Got it.

33 minutes ago, RagahRagah said:

Second poster in a row who says, "got it" who doesn't at all get it.

History is always a big indicator and basis for where you continue to go. The Sox have a long history of failure, often when they were the "favorites." Being skeptical isn't "negative," it's rational.

The Sox still have a lot to prove.  But NONE of us should be making ANY conclusions, good or bad, about where this team will be at the end of September. Bottom line.

THAT is what I am saying, and it's really wierd how people just seemingly have to insert a narrative into everything so they can be combative about something. Strawmen galore, knock yourself out.

Person wants to try to tease a "gotcha" after a month and a half but I'm the questionable one for going to other way hypothetically? Fucking weird. Biases, I guess.

You haven't refuted what I said at all.  The point is you haven't spent this offseason and season cautiously avoiding "conclusions" because it's too early to make them.  To the contrary.  You have stated conclusions galore -- that this was going to be a lost "developmental" season, that you believed a team other than the Sox should be favored to win the division, etc.  You are only now trying to walk them back into this wishy-washy, conclusion-free "wait and see" approach to try to save face in case things keep going well for the Sox. It won't work.

Anyway, I've already exceeded the recommended number of exchanges with you. See you after the next losing streak or injury breathes life force into you. 

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Posted (edited)
48 minutes ago, 35thstreetswarm said:

You haven't refuted what I said at all.  The point is you haven't spent this offseason and season cautiously avoiding "conclusions" because it's too early to make them.  To the contrary.  You have stated conclusions galore -- that this was going to be a lost "developmental" season, that you believed a team other than the Sox should be favored to win the division, etc.  You are only now trying to walk them back into this wishy-washy, conclusion-free "wait and see" approach to try to save face in case things keep going well for the Sox. It won't work.

Anyway, I've already exceeded the recommended number of exchanges with you. See you after the next losing streak or injury breathes life force into you. 

The fact you are claiming anything I have said in this offseason was a conclusion proves either:

A. You don't listen.

B. You are cherry picking my offseason points and ignoring the ones that make this post look like exactly what it is: bullshit.

C. You don't have any idea what "conclusion" means.

 

My skepticism was based on things that were likely by weighing various circumstances we were facing. Nowhere did I ever "conclude" anything at all, including anything specific you listed. I might have thought that was most likely but never stated anything simply *was* anything; there is a difference and I think you know it. And if I had I would gladly state that that was not how it was intended and apologize to you.

Edited by RagahRagah
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Posted (edited)

And someone posting a reaction before the post could have possibly been read thoroughly says everything. 

A conclusion is an end result. We aren't there yet and I never made any iron clad claims of any results as doing so would be ridiculous.

Consult a dictionary.

Edited by RagahRagah
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1 hour ago, CaliSoxFanViaSWside said:

I really wish I could've heard Hawk call the 2005 World Series and playoffs .

What an awesome video. Proof that there is a "clutch" gene and hearing Hawk...oh man, the true GOAT.  Can't wait to see videos 15 years from this squad and thinking back to the ring(s) they won!!!! 

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Just now, Chisoxfn said:

What an awesome video. Proof that there is a "clutch" gene and hearing Hawk...oh man, the true GOAT.  Can't wait to see videos 15 years from this squad and thinking back to the ring(s) they won!!!! 

In all honesty, as great as that would have been I think most of us would have been much happier to hear virtually anyone other than Joe Buck call that Series (and every one, honestly).

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2 hours ago, RagahRagah said:

No, you definitely do not, "got it." Not at all. And it's quite baffling.

You really must not have actually read and absorbed what you just quoted. 

You are making up things to get upset about.  That's not a really big deal to me.

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28 minutes ago, southsider2k5 said:

You are making up things to get upset about.  That's not a really big deal to me.

You mischaracterized my argument, so of course I'm going to say so.

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10 minutes ago, RagahRagah said:

You mischaracterized my argument, so of course I'm going to say so.

You are literally telling people not to get excited or happy about this team right now because a Sox team 16 years ago ALMOST lost a divisional lead, but didn't and won the World Series.

 

It's an awful argument.  It's on par with unwritten rules in terms of its uselessness.

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10 minutes ago, southsider2k5 said:

You are literally telling people not to get excited or happy about this team right now because a Sox team 16 years ago ALMOST lost a divisional lead, but didn't and won the World Series.

 

It's an awful argument.  It's on par with unwritten rules in terms of its uselessness.

I'm merely using it as an example to snap people out of a fantasy that where they are standing in mid May means anything. Is thinking it does and trying to reach for a gotcha over that sample size any less ridiculous?

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The standings are not meaningless. As the old adage goes: Can’t win the division in May but you can sure lose it. The Twins dug themselves quite the hole. They need to win games at an insane clip for 120 games to contend for the division.

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7 minutes ago, GermanSoxFan said:

The standings are not meaningless. As the old adage goes: Can’t win the division in May but you can sure lose it. The Twins dug themselves quite the hole. They need to win games at an insane clip for 120 games to contend for the division.

Fair point. We are not at full speed even, but neither are they. Cleveland is still a contender for the division as well, though IMO.

I try to stay optimistic but if you're a White Sox fan and you pay attention you know that our track record supports the skepticism, due to a lot of factors.

Luckily, the injury factor so far is less of a concern for us than usual because fucking EVERYONE is getting injured. 

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15 minutes ago, RagahRagah said:

I'm merely using it as an example to snap people out of a fantasy that where they are standing in mid May means anything. Is thinking it does and trying to reach for a gotcha over that sample size any less ridiculous?

If you were self-aware you'd realize that trying to gotcha people with 2005 as a bad thing is absolutely ridiculous.

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Let’s talk something realistic.

What would you be willing to give up to add Max Scherzer to be our version (see Astros) of Verlander down the stretch and into the postseason?

Because having a guy who has done it (Keuchel can’t be trusted, Lynn will be there for sure if healthy) is worth its weight in gold.

Of course, as of today, Cease/Kopech/Rodon all look like legit threats to start post season games with Lynn...Giolito has lots of time to right the ship, but how many are still left standing ay the end of the season?

You can even go to a six man rotation or put Kopech in the pen (mostly) to preserve/protect his arm from going beyond 120 ip.

It likely won’t happen, Hahn is nothing if not risk-averse compared to KW, but imagine this team and adding Scherzer, Robert and Eloy to it.

Does TLR have any connection to Scherzer?

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