This morning on the "Kap and Haugh" show David Haugh said that Ventura and Molitor have something in common: They are both managing in the shadow of Ron Gardenhire.

 

I thought this was interesting. I'm not one of these people blaming Ventura and I generally think he's fine. I don't think Gardy is a fit though. He would lose his mind dealing with Chicago media every day and he has absolutely no interest in using analytics/metrics. Doesn't seem like a Rick Hahn move. Most likely just dump speculation on Haugh's part. Thoughts?

This morning on the "Kap and Haugh" show David Haugh said that Ventura and Molitor have something in common: They are both managing in the shadow of Ron Gardenhire.

 

I thought this was interesting. I'm not one of these people blaming Ventura and I generally think he's fine. I don't think Gardy is a fit though. He would lose his mind dealing with Chicago media every day and he has absolutely no interest in using analytics/metrics. Doesn't seem like a Rick Hahn move. Most likely just dump speculation on Haugh's part. Thoughts?

 

This is very true. Part of Ozzie's downfall was Gardenhire's Twins kicking our ass every time.

This morning on the "Kap and Haugh" show David Haugh said that Ventura and Molitor have something in common: They are both managing in the shadow of Ron Gardenhire.

 

I thought this was interesting. I'm not one of these people blaming Ventura and I generally think he's fine. I don't think Gardy is a fit though. He would lose his mind dealing with Chicago media every day and he has absolutely no interest in using analytics/metrics. Doesn't seem like a Rick Hahn move. Most likely just dump speculation on Haugh's part. Thoughts?

Sloppy speculation, I don't see it happening. I don't see Robin getting fired to begin with unless things get very, very ugly.

Honestly, maybe Ventura does need a little pressure on him. He's had the easiest job in baseball the last 3 years in terms of lack of pressure.

Thoughts?

My thought is that if the braintrust's idea of a different manger is Gardenhire, I'll take Ventura.

 

If it was Robin's fault the team sucked the last 2 years, how do you look at Garenhire's last 4 years and say he is an upgrade?

Lets wait till the end of the season and discuss Robin (or at least halfway through the season). This year he's been given a team that should contend (Note: I said contend, I didn't say they should win the division or make the playoffs but anything less than being in the thick of things would be a dissapointed). If halfway through we are way out of things, than lets start talking about it.

How bad would things have to get this year, though?

 

Flavums' 9-18 through the first 27?

 

10 gb before the end of April?

f*** ron gardenhire

How would a good manager make our pitchers have quality starts? He's nothing but an easy scapegoat.

I think he's terrible, but again, it's a hard argument to win.

 

That said, for the people that don't want a managerial change (now or if things get really bad), what is it about Robin Ventura that makes him a good and qualified manager? It surprises me that he has so many people's support when all he's done is get hired for being the anti-Ozzie, blowing a division lead in 2012, and losing 188 games the last two seasons.

 

I cannot prove that Ventura is to blame for all of this, but if there was ever a manager to replace for the sake of replacing, Robin Ventura is that guy.

I think he's terrible, but again, it's a hard argument to win.

 

That said, for the people that don't want a managerial change (now or if things get really bad), what is it about Robin Ventura that makes him a good and qualified manager? It surprises me that he has so many people's support when all he's done is get hired for being the anti-Ozzie, blowing a division lead in 2012, and losing 188 games the last two seasons.

 

I cannot prove that Ventura is to blame for all of this, but if there was ever a manager to replace for the sake of replacing, Robin Ventura is that guy.

Gardenhire lost 188 games the last 2 seasons which is an improvement from the 195 he lost the 2 years before that.

Gardenhire lost 188 games the last 2 seasons which is an improvement from the 195 he lost the 2 years before that.

 

I should have prefaced it that I don't care about Gardenhire either. It could be anyone that Hahn hired on his own.

 

So let's leave Gardenhire out of it and focus on what Ventura brings to the table right now.

I should have prefaced it that I don't care about Gardenhire either. It could be anyone that Hahn hired on his own.

 

So let's leave Gardenhire out of it and focus on what Ventura brings to the table right now.

This is the Ron Gardenhire thread.

This is the Ron Gardenhire thread.

 

I'm not starting another thread about Robin.

 

What is about Ventura's time as manager that deserves anyone's support? He played for the team? He's nice and makes funny jokes once in a while?

 

Again, I cannot prove he's a bad manager, but he's done nothing to prove he's a good manager. It really surprises me that people want him as Sox manager simply because he currently holds the job.

I'm not starting another thread about Robin.

 

What is about Ventura's time as manager that deserves anyone's support? He played for the team? He's nice and makes funny jokes once in a while?

 

Again, I cannot prove he's a bad manager, but he's done nothing to prove he's a good manager. It really surprises me that people want him as Sox manager simply because he currently holds the job.

2012 the were in cmtention until the last week. They weren't supposed to be good. The last 2 years, blaming him is silly. If you have bad players, you lose games. Cox, LaRussa, and Torree all went to the HOF last year. They all have had bad years because of bad players. See what happens this year with Robin. Basing it on 4 games is like judging a prospect after 10 AB.

 

People are freaking out, but when teams don't hit, they look bad, and they have only scored more than 1 once. They will come around.

2012 the were in cmtention until the last week. They weren't supposed to be good. The last 2 years, blaming him is silly. If you have bad players, you lose games. Cox, LaRussa, and Torree all went to the HOF last year. They all have had bad years because of bad players. See what happens this year with Robin. Basing it on 4 games is like judging a prospect after 10 AB.

 

People are freaking out, but when teams don't hit, they look bad, and they have only scored more than 1 once. They will come around.

 

I'm not judging Robin on four games and I don't think they're dead this season.

 

It just surprises me that a lot of Sox fans seem to think all is well with the manager.

 

Let's put it this way....if when Ozzie was replaced, and they hired Mark Parent or Joe McEwing and they had the exact same results over the last 3+ years, would there be this same loyalty to the manager? Or because it's Robin Ventura, give it time...give it more time....

2012 the were in cmtention until the last week. They weren't supposed to be good. The last 2 years, blaming him is silly. If you have bad players, you lose games. Cox, LaRussa, and Torree all went to the HOF last year. They all have had bad years because of bad players. See what happens this year with Robin. Basing it on 4 games is like judging a prospect after 10 AB.

 

People are freaking out, but when teams don't hit, they look bad, and they have only scored more than 1 once. They will come around.

 

Payroll in 2012? Its a little bit of selective revisionism to say there was no talent and that he almost singlehandedly led the Bad News Bears to the postseason miraculously.

 

Those managers all reached the playoffs multiple times and won their share of World Series titles, except Cox, who got Atl to playoffs...what, for 13-14 consecutive seasons?

 

 

Edited April 11, 201511 yr by caulfield12

This morning on the "Kap and Haugh" show David Haugh said that Ventura and Molitor have something in common: They are both managing in the shadow of Ron Gardenhire.

 

I thought this was interesting. I'm not one of these people blaming Ventura and I generally think he's fine. I don't think Gardy is a fit though. He would lose his mind dealing with Chicago media every day and he has absolutely no interest in using analytics/metrics. Doesn't seem like a Rick Hahn move. Most likely just dump speculation on Haugh's part. Thoughts?

 

Does Gardy really have no interest in advanced metrics? If so, I wouldn't want him. You have to use everything in this day and age to give yourself advantages.

 

I'm not blaming Ventura, but do wonder if they wouldn't bring Guillen back if they stumbled and make a change there.

It's hard for me to blame Gardenhire for the last few years. Their GM hasn't made the best of moves including signing Mauer to that huge of a deal. I understand he's a hometown hero, but still.....

Does Gardy really have no interest in advanced metrics? If so, I wouldn't want him. You have to use everything in this day and age to give yourself advantages.

 

I'm not blaming Ventura, but do wonder if they wouldn't bring Guillen back if they stumbled and make a change there.

 

Rumor has it Hahn is a fan of Guillen but Ozzie has burned so many bridges. Maybe a decade from now the smoke will go away.

 

Rumor has it Hahn is a fan of Guillen but Ozzie has burned so many bridges. Maybe a decade from now the smoke will go away.

 

if ozzie could use a sabermetric lineup I'd hire him back. the other stuff is nothing when the club is winning. that said, no more bs like Omar Vizquel etc.

This team has taken the on the personality of their manager.

Get used to emotionless beat downs.

The whole AL Central is our Nolan Ryan.

Give me Ken Macha plz.

Payroll in 2012? Its a little bit of selective revisionism to say there was no talent and that he almost singlehandedly led the Bad News Bears to the postseason miraculously.

 

Those managers all reached the playoffs multiple times and won their share of World Series titles, except Cox, who got Atl to playoffs...what, for 13-14 consecutive seasons?

That is right, bit after 3 years, Ventura has a better record than Cox. Soxtalk would have wanted Cox fired.

 

The team has no offense so it looks lethargic, but they aren't giving away at bats. They orobabky are victims of expectations and are trying top hard.

Edited April 11, 201511 yr by Dick Allen