Look at Ray Ray Run

The minimum is like 550k, no? They don't have 20 minimum player salaries on their roster. I'll throw their salaries into a sheet and see where they are with their currently constructed roster.

Last three years, Mazara is .655 vs lefties compared to Engels .679. Not much difference there.

Can we stop pretending that Adam Engel is an 840 OPS player vs lefties? Sure, last year in 80 at bats he was. In his three years of big league time, he has a 679 OPS vs lefties compared to a .567 vs righties. Adam Engel isn't suddenly an 840 OPS player.

It's actually nothing like buying high.

All talent doesn't reach their ceilings, but that prospect list is not only telling but also impressive. The industry in general has gotten so much better at evaluating prospects and projecting them. The fact that every player under 21 on that list has a quality big league career ahead of them is impressive, and also promising.

Yeah, and people would have argued trading for Austin Meadows was a horrible idea last year. You need to be ahead of the curve, not reactionary, in this business. I get questioning the Sox ability to be a trend setter, but a good organization goes out and finds an Austin Meadows when his prospect status is down after not developing in a linear fashion. I'm not saying he's Austin Meadows, and again the Sox clearly can't evaluate big league talent anywhere near where the Rays are right now so I get the concern, but give the guy a chance before you say he's complete trash.

Yeah, and Giolito (I was one). I thought Giolito was so far gone, that no talent could save him. Man how I was wrong. Talent can really overcome so much when it comes to struggles and etc.

If you hate the White Sox, you can argue very move they make is bad obviously. It's ironic because them trading for Mazara leads to people saying "I don't trust how they value players!" Yet if they signed someone for 100 million, those same people would be celebrating their ability to evaluate and sign talent.

Those guys had a baseball card full of shitty stats until last year as well too. Not sure what to tell you. They certainly beat the odds with Moncada and Giolito. An old ass prospect list? LOL, the guys on that list with a similar age as Mazara either weren't productive last year, or it was their first year of production. 2016 isn't an old ass prospect list for a 24 year old. My lord.

Of the top 20 who were Mazara's age or younger, here is how that breaks down: Urias - still hasn't taken off yet, but still talented. Gio - First good year last year Yoan - First good year last year Arcia and Crawford - Still waiting to see more from both Brendan Rogers - Terrible big league numbers but still top prospect Alex Reyes - Still looking for his first good year Devers - First good year was last year (in fact, Devers was a 1 WAR player the same time as Mazara pretty much) Austin Meadows - first good year last year Mazara isn't exactly out of hope. Most of these guys had their first productive year last year; Mazara could easily be that guy this year.

Castellanos was 10% better so they're not really the exact same.

Top 20 prospects from Mazara's last year as a prospect: 2016 MLB Pipeline Prospect Rankings Top NEXT Major Leaguers Has not played in MLB Active Players 1st Round Draft Picks Currently Active on this Team MLB Rank Tm Rank Player Name Pos Team Name Ht Wt B-T BornDate Age Place HiLvl Stat Years MLB Years Draft Information Status Current Org (Level) Debut 1 1 Corey Seager SS Los Angeles Dodgers 6-4 205 L-R 1994-04-27 22 Kannapolis,North Carolina MLB 2012-2019 2015-2019 2012- 1- 18-LAN Active Los Angeles Dodgers (MLB) 2015-09-03 2 1 Byron Buxton OF Minnesota Twins 6-2 190 R-R 1993-12-18 22 Baxley,Georgia MLB 2012-2019 2015-2019 2012- 1- 2-MIN Active Minnesota Twins (MLB) 2015-06-14 3 1 Lucas Giolito P Washington Nationals 6-6 230 R-R 1994-07-14 21 Santa Monica,California MLB 2012-2019 2016-2019 2012- 1- 16-WAS Active Chicago White Sox (MLB) 2016-06-28 4 2 Julio Urias P Los Angeles Dodgers 5-11 160 L-L 1996-08-12 19 Culiacan,Mexico MLB 2013-2019 2016-2019 2012- UDFA-LAN Active Los Angeles Dodgers (MLB) 2016-05-27 5 1 JP Crawford SS Philadelphia Phillies 6-2 180 L-R 1995-01-11 21 Lakewood,California MLB 2013-2019 2017-2019 2013- 1- 16-PHI Active Seattle Mariners (MLB) 2017-09-05 6 1 Orlando Arcia SS Milwaukee Brewers 6-0 165 R-R 1994-08-04 21 Anaco,Venezuela MLB 2011-2019 2016-2019 2010- UDFA-MIL Active Milwaukee Brewers (MLB) 2016-08-02 7 1 Yoan Moncada IF Boston Red Sox 6-2 205 B-R 1995-05-27 21 Abreus,Cuba MLB 2015-2019 2016-2019 2015- UDFA-BOS Active Chicago White Sox (MLB) 2016-09-02 8 1 Dansby Swanson SS Atlanta Braves 6-0 170 R-R 1994-02-11 22 Marietta,Georgia MLB 2013-2019 2016-2019 2015- 1- 1-ARI Active Atlanta Braves (MLB) 2016-08-17 9 1 Joey Gallo 3B Texas Rangers 6-5 205 L-R 1993-11-19 22 Las Vegas,Nevada MLB 2012-2019 2015-2019 2012- 1- 39-TEX Active Texas Rangers (MLB) 2015-06-02 10 1 Tyler Glasnow P Pittsburgh Pirates 6-7 200 L-R 1993-08-23 22 Newhall,California MLB 2012-2019 2016-2019 2011- 5- 152-PIT Active Tampa Bay Rays (MLB) 2016-07-07 11 2 Trea Turner SS Washington Nationals 6-2 160 R-R 1993-06-30 23 Lake Worth,Florida MLB 2012-2019 2015-2019 2014- 1- 13-SDN Active Washington Nationals (MLB) 2015-08-21 12 1 Brendan Rodgers SS Colorado Rockies 6-0 180 R-R 1996-08-09 19 Lake Mary,Florida AAA 2015-2019 2019-2019 2015- 1- 3-COL Active Colorado Rockies (MLB) 2019-05-17 13 1 Alex Reyes P St. Louis Cardinals 6-3 185 R-R 1994-08-29 21 Elizabeth,New Jersey MLB 2013-2019 2016-2019 2012- UDFA-SLN Minors St. Louis Cardinals (AAA) 2016-08-09 14 1 Blake Snell P Tampa Bay Rays 6-4 180 L-L 1992-12-04 23 Seattle,Washington MLB 2011-2019 2016-2019 2011- 1- 52-TBA Active Tampa Bay Rays (MLB) 2016-04-23 15 1 Steven Matz P New York Mets 6-2 192 R-L 1991-05-29 25 Stony Brook,New York MLB 2012-2019 2015-2019 2009- 2- 72-NYN Active New York Mets (MLB) 2015-06-28 16 4 Lewis Brinson OF Texas Rangers 6-3 170 R-R 1994-05-08 22 Tamarac,Florida MLB 2012-2019 2017-2019 2012- 1- 29-TEX Active Miami Marlins (MLB) 2017-06-11 17 2 Rafael Devers 3B Boston Red Sox 6-0 195 L-R 1996-10-24 19 Sanchez,Dom Rep MLB 2014-2019 2017-2019 2013- UDFA-BOS Active Boston Red Sox (MLB) 2017-07-25 18 2 Nomar Mazara RF-OF Texas Rangers 6-4 195 L-L 1995-04-26 21 Santo Domingo,Dom Rep MLB 2012-2019 2016-2019 2011- UDFA-TEX Active Texas Rangers (MLB) 2016-04-10 19 2 Jose Berrios P Minnesota Twins 6-0 190 R-R 1994-05-27 22 Bayamon,Puerto Rico MLB 2012-2019 2016-2019 2012- 1- 32-MIN Active Minnesota Twins (MLB) 2016-04-27 20 2 Austin Meadows OF Pittsburgh Pirates 6-2 195 L-L 1995-05-03 21 Atlanta,Georgia MLB 2013-2019 2018-2019 2013- 1- 9-PIT Active Tampa Bay Rays (MLB) 2018-05-18

In their last 185 MLB games, Tim has a 4.5 WAR and Correa has a 4.8 WAR. Tim is cost controlled and has stayed healthier. I'll take Tim + the prospect over Correa.

Being called up at 21 years old does not happen very often. Guys called up as young as Mazara have a high frequency of becoming very good big leaguers. It doesn't mean they all do as there are certainly young flameouts and he may be one, but history is on Mazara's side if you analyze him this way.

I care what his true talent level is, because that's a ceiling of untapped potential that he may never get to, but if he does he's a huge bargain for the next two years. That's the gamble you take. If you trust the offense - Eloy, Yoan, Robert, TA, Yaz and on... you really don't need to sacrifice your entire defense (Castellanos) just to add another bat.

Sure, they're nothing alike in trajectory because by the time Dickerson warranted a call-up he was a whole 3 seasons older than Mazara.

How is it a bad example? He was a 1.1 WAR player through 140+ games played.

Do you think Hahn's prospect trading and trading for prospects has been a massive failure? I certainly don't. If you are going to point to Tatis, that's laughable. Every team in baseball has been snake bit by a deal like that in their existence. Friedman traded the ROY superstar for Josh Fields. Shit happens. The Sox MiLB evaluations really haven't been bad. Their MLB evaluations have been bad though.

The problem is, you've drawn conclusions on Mazara's career based on his performance as a 21-24 year old big leaguer. I don't trust their big league scouting for position players, so I am hesitant, but people really need to stop acting like Mazara's true talent ceiling is that of a 1 WAR outfielder.

I mean, when Dickerson was 26 he was a .6 WAR player, when he was 27 he was a 1.1 WAR season. Guys get better.

I definitely see this angle as well. The Sox absolutely don't deserve the benefit of the doubt on this, but if it was an organization we respected (lol) I think we'd see this as writing on the wall for a pivot to another area of spending.

You'd trade Tim Anderson's contract and 5 years of great control + a prospect for 2 years of Carlos Correa?

Hard to call a 25 year old a reclamation project. Fans love the 23-24 year old prospect, but they hate the future for a 24/25 year old big leaguer. That's just the irrational nature of being a fan and loving your young guys. No one can possibly argue that the ceiling for Steele Walker is higher than the ceiling for Nomar Mazara.

I just can't get up in arms about the pitching situation. They went after their guy and offered him more money. They didn't get him. I think the team obviously needed to have a plan B and if they didn't, that's horrible management and they should be lambasted. But missing on Wheeler doesn't mean they should overreact and sign Bumgarner for 100 million.

This would be one of the main reasons you'd pivot to Mazara IMO; to allocate your funds to a better player at another position than overpaying for Ozuna/Castellanos.