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When did Baltimore stop drawing fans? Last two nights looked like lousy crowds on mlb.com.

Good win which begs some questions .. --Is Beckham getting good again? -- Is DeAza getting good again like his first season or so? -- Is Flowers capable of getting a hit a game? -- Is Bella worthy of our praise? Some of our most despised players by fans had a pretty good game. That stat somebody cited about Q and all those quality starts is impressive. If Danks became the old Danks and we acquire two excellent righty pitchers to go with the three lefties, the Sox might have a good rotation.

QUOTE (Bigsoxhurt35 @ Jun 25, 2014 -> 03:14 AM) Next save situation should be Webb. Why? It's not like Webb is effective. At least Bella is good sometimes and horrific others. Might as well leave him there even though he's not reliable.

That was a nice DP. Always good to win a game on the road.

At any rate, this is another deal where there are a lot of excuses. There need to be solutions as our country is barbaric on this issue. No more men and women should be spending their last moments screaming on their deathbeds because they can't get health care. The fact this isn't causing more outrage nationally is disturbing to me. Also should really help morale of the troops seeing how we're treating them when they get injured.

Interesting thread. I only put Alexei. The rest of the guys are some of the dead weight on the team IMO. I could see keeping Danks as well.

QUOTE (chitownsportsfan @ Jun 24, 2014 -> 05:19 AM) So, when does Robin's job start to come into question? I'd evaluate in the off-season but what do others think? Probably never. Seriously. He's the guinea pig, so to speak, having to manage the team during the years the roster gives it absolutely no chance of competing. If the roster ever becomes contender-worthy, he'll probably be able to get it to .500 at the minimum which would be enough for him to keep his job, IMO. I'd suspect he'll be our manager at least the next 20 years. He doesn't seem like the kind of guy who wants to retire young and golf every day while counting the money he earned as a player. He's made some questionable decisions, but don't all managers? We can quibble about his bullpen calls, but the man has one lefty in that pen to work with and that lefty stinks. I doubt he'll ever be fired. p.s. In a perfect world, Buehrle and Peavy would be starting for the MAJOR MARKET team still. I realize Peavy is having an off year thus far.

QUOTE (caulfield12 @ Jun 24, 2014 -> 05:11 AM) If the payroll continues to be low, they'll still be profitable...but it's going to be a vicious circle in terms of losing more and more season ticket holders, sponsors falling to the wayside/advertising rate declines for broadcasts. The Royals, Pirates and Blue Jays have gone through nearly 20 year stretches without making the playoffs, for example. Of course, the White Sox would survive, but it would be very bleak...like the mid to late 80's and late 90's. Thankfully, we have two superstars and potentially another to build around in Rodon. Putnam has been one of the more pleasant surprises this entire season, along with Noesi (compared to expectations), Abreu (if you can call him a surprise) and Alexei's play the first 2 months. As far as the article fathom linked to, they mentioned adding veteran bullpen pieces, but that's exactly what Hahn did do this offseason. We brought in Belisario and Downs, and kept Lindstrom. And of course Nate Jones went down to injury. One of the things that KW was most criticized for was overspending on Dotel and Linebrink before 2008 when middle reliever values were at a peak, fwiw. We're not going to be winning more than 75-80 games with Addison Reed anyway, but a 7/11 save conversion rate just won't cut it, even if one of those was caused by lapses behind him defensively. When I looked up the stat of total blown saves, we're right in the middle of the major leagues, after starting out terribly the first 2-3 weeks. That said, there obviously haven't been as many opportunities to blow saves when you've lost 7 in a row on the road, 8 consecutive to AL Central opponents, and every single Saturday game this season. (Of course, traditionally, the Fireworks night games on Saturdays were the most well-attended in the last 20-30 years, and it's going to get to the point where fans don't want to even go to those games except because of the nice summer weather or fireworks show, expecting/dreading/predicting another Sox loss). Of course, down there in Kansas City, if they don't make the playoffs and inevitably lose Shields, where they just had the optimism/confidence at an all-time high in the middle of that Tigers' 4 game series, it's going to be hard to recover that enthusiasm again anytime soon....with Butler also halfway out the door, there's just not enough offense unless Perez becomes a legit 25 homer guy or Moustakas returns to the form of two seasons ago. Yep, yep, yep. Can't argue a word. I do wish we had Reed though. Made no sense to trade an adequate to decent closer not yet ready to implode for a couple more seasons when Sox had nothing to replace him with. Nate was not the answer as closer, either. I'll never believe that.

QUOTE (fathom @ Jun 24, 2014 -> 04:21 AM) The injuries have absolutely caught up with the Sox. Severe regression after a hot start to Flowers, Alexei and Viciedo hasn't helped. Great post. I'm not a big fan of Lindstrom and/or Nate, but both arguably are better than the hacks remaining in our bullpen. Downs, Bella, even Webb, who I also am not a big fan of. I haven't seen a ton of Putnam in games I've watched. Losing A. Garcia's bat is a killer because of the reason you mentioned. Also Eaton was out a while meaning we had to play yet another player who isn't big-league caliber for a while. Still, I'd think a big market team like Chicago could build a better roster. This is our second year finishing last. Wonder how many years we are going to be cellar-dwellers in this 'rebuild.' The Sox can't call it a 'retool' anymore. Not when you're finishing dead last.

How dare we treat our veterans this way. One armed services veteran of the United States of America who needed treatment was SCREAMING on his deathbed in his own home, not in a hospital where he DESERVED to be. We are not taking care of our own people. Yet we care about so much bulls*** in this country that doesn't matter!! Thanks to CNN for exposing this, hopefully it doesn't get buried by the rest of the nation's press but it probably will. This is an ATROCITY against Americans who have served!! These men and women need healthcare NOW! If you have time, please watch this piece. It is HEART WRENCHING. Wake up, Obama!!!! We must do better than this. http://www.cnn.com/2014/06/23/us/phoenix-v....html?hpt=hp_c2

QUOTE (StrangeSox @ Jun 15, 2014 -> 04:16 AM) sure you can I know there's freedom of speech, but it's tough sledding when a public figure says they want somebody dead.

QUOTE (southsider2k5 @ Jun 24, 2014 -> 03:01 AM) Beckham sucks... except for when his trade value is talked about. Same with DeAza. I figure Beckham will bring somebody like Hochevar, another top draft pick who is a bust. Yes I realize Hoch is injured. It would be nice if the baseball beat writers could write stories where unnamed scouts tell us what the baseball world thinks of our own Beckham. Is he as bad as many of us believe? Is he worthless in terms of trade value as many of us believe? Or will he bring a Keppinger-like return?

So if we sign this guy it's one less hole. We'll have him, A. Garcia and Eaton in the outfield with DeAza or Danks as the fourth outfielder. Viciedo has to be let go or traded for scraps. The key is to sign this guy as soon as we're allowed to. Abreu is working out; add this young man and at least our outfield is set.

QUOTE (fathom @ Jun 24, 2014 -> 03:58 AM) I have a feeling next year is going to be a very, very different team on the field. You look at the 25 man roster, and it seems like a lot of guys who are on the roster only due to injury/ineffectiveness (Noesi, Rienzo, Carroll, Sierra) or it's their last year to show what they can do/contract expires (ADA, Flowers, Dunn, Konerko). I'm excited to see more "core" guys added between now and the start of next season. It's embarrassing that a big market franchise like Chicago is in this position with so many horrible players considering you can, uh, sign free agents if you wish. To have Bella as a major league closer is an embarrassment to the game. The Sox are a last place team. It was a pure miracle these guys were over .500 for a couple months. Our front office has a ton of work to do. It doesn't help that Garcia is out for the year, of course. We probably should be thankful as fans there was average to decent baseball for about eight weeks.

How the hell is the Sox collection of talent supposed to win one on the road vs. Balt after losing four to a hellhole team like Minnesota? Answer. Sox can't. So pencil in 3 losses. I assume it's a 3 game series. Of course Sale might shut out anybody so I guess one win is possible.

QUOTE (IowaSoxFan @ Jun 23, 2014 -> 04:48 PM) Looking at the potential trade pieces and potential destinations: Gordon Beckham - San Francisco, Baltimore, St. Louis, Miami, Washington, Oakland Alexei Ramirez - Detroit, Seattle, Cincinnati De Aza - NYM, Baltimore, Boston, Seattle Viciedo - Boston, Atlanta, Houston, Seattle Dunn - Texas, NYY, Oakland, Milwaukee Quintana - Miami, San Francisco, St. Louis, Toronto, Texas, Seattle, NYY, LAA, Boston, Milwaukee I think given the need for pitching and Quintana's contract status, he could probably bring back the biggest return of ANY pitcher that will be dealt this summer. I doubt that he is moved, but he would certainly have a lot of value and could fill multiple holes on the roster through one deal. Trading Quintana and Lexi would be dumb if we are ever planning to finish outside of last place again. Embarrassing to finish in last 2 years in a row in a market like Chicago. The rest of those guys are our scraps. If anybody wants them, god bless 'em and good luck Hahn in getting anything but L. Garcia types. I guess if you can get 3 great players go ahead and deal Lexi.

I bet there are trades on draft day. Is Cleveland really going to pick No. 1 again rather than trade after last year's disaster pick? If no trades, I see it this way. Cavs - Wiggins Bucks - Parker Sixers - Embiid (still)

QUOTE (Chilihead90 @ Jun 23, 2014 -> 07:01 AM) It's "Wins above REPLACEMENT". If there is some terrible player batting .220 making tons of errors, he is liking going produce negative WAR. So the difference would be from Alexei's positive WAR to the other guy's negative WAR. Because you used Leury as an example, let's extrapolate Alexei's current season and Leury's. Obviously this isn't fair because of the sample sizes, especially for Leury. But I digress...... Alexei's project WAR this year based on a 650 PA-average is..... about 3.6 WAR Leury's projected WAR extrapolated on the same scale to 650 PA-average would be.... about -2 WAR So if you really wanted to see the different between Alexei to Garcia over an entire year based on what you've seen this season, it's about a 5 1/2 to 6 win difference. That takes a 90 win team to an 84 win team, just based off 1 position. That's a very significant change. I was thinking we'd be about 12 games worse with Leury as our ss over Lexi. My eyes tell me that.

QUOTE (caulfield12 @ Jun 22, 2014 -> 08:39 PM) Odds of a .467 team losing 12 consecutive Saturdays? About 1.5 times in 10,000. Would probably increase to 2 times in 10,000 if you readjust for a lower winning percentage assuming we lose again today. Just think if you were a psychic and knew the Sox would lose every Saturday game this year. You'd make a ton of money in Vegas.

QUOTE (Lillian @ Jun 23, 2014 -> 01:37 AM) I don't have a clue whom the Sox could pry loose from Toronto, but 4 of their top 7 prospects, and 9 of their top 20, are RH pitchers. God knows, this organization could certainly use a right handed starter. I think you have identified the likely trading partner. They might be desperate enough to give Beckham a try and send us two of those righty starters for him. On the other hand, they may think Beckham is nothing they want to have.

QUOTE (GreenSox @ Jun 22, 2014 -> 08:57 PM) How so? He's worth a couple of wins a year and is 32. They should be shopping him. This stat about "being worth a couple wins a year" is an example of an advanced stat that bothers me. It makes it sound like the Sox as an organization would only be a loss or two worse w/out Lexi. Let's say the Sox replace him with some stiff who hits .220 and makes a large amount of errors and has not so great range. This is possible cause from what I understand we have no top player "ready" to replace him. You can't tell me the team wouldn't suck much worse than it does now without Lexi. Let's say we put L. Garcia there instead of Lexi. The team becomes a total embarrassment, much worse than this crew which is still a last-place team. Now I'm not saying don't trade Lexi. If the Sox can get a haul for him (not some possible or likely bust named Davidson) maybe they should trade him. But I HATE this stat about how many wins a guy is worth. A simple trade of Lexi for L. Garcia makes this team WAY WORSE than simple two-game margin would suggest.

If you can't throw a guy out at home on a pop to left ... wow. You guys are better fans than me. Can't take it. I'm turning it off and out. Goodbye.

Who's the long reliever today? Bullpen gonna have a busy day before going to face to a talented Baltimore team.

Danks may not go five innings. He's 23 pitches away from being done for the day.

That was close to being an error.