GreenSox

QUOTE (Buehrle>Wood @ Oct 24, 2014 -> 06:01 PM) Danks is an elite fielder. No he is not.

Surprised we waived him. He played pretty well for us....certainly better than Wise or Danks in that position of 4th outfielder. Should have waived Danks instead - he's awful.

QUOTE (Dick Allen @ Oct 24, 2014 -> 01:19 PM) Why is it when Maddon lost 101 and 96 games his first 2 years, that is considered solid, but when Robin had a couple of years like that, he is a dope? Because Maddon has had multiple playoff teams and a world series appearance, with an organization light on spending. That is why. Williams hired 2 house horses as manager. Doesn't seem like anything Williams would do.

Jason Heyward had an OPS of .735 last year and is signed for 1 more year. The idea that it takes multiple top prospects to get his services for a year is crazy. The only thing sillier is that the Sox should be the team to do it. The Sox have had 3 90 win seasons (and 3 playoff berths) in the last 20 year using that approach.

QUOTE (witesoxfan @ Oct 23, 2014 -> 05:00 PM) That's the thing though - he is 26 and is an All-Star caliber player who could easily improve into one of the most valuable players in the league. He could also continue putting up Markakis-esque numbers, but as long as it comes with elite defense, he's still incredibly valuable. If the Braves to make him available, there are going to be a lot of suitors. Sometimes you have to overpay to get the guy you want. As the Sox know all too well. It has worked splendidly. 73 win teams don't trade prospects, much less top prospects, for a rent (esp for a rent of a player coming off of a mediocre season like Heyward). 90 win teams do it sparingly and usually in July. WE have payroll? Sign free agents. Or get some long term deals set for the good players we have. I see a lot of sentiment to trading Montas and/or Danish.... When 60% of the Sox rotation is Carroll, Danks and Noesi and when the bullpen was bottom 5. Teams like St Louis and San Francisco develop their own players for the most part. You can't force things. You need a foundation...and it's getting there.

Yea, let's trade our top 2 or 3 prospects. That practice has served us so well. Maybe we can get another Swisher for two them. Or maybe an Edwin Jackson!! Build an organization, please. If St Louis is pushing Taveras out, then get him at a bargain price.

I hope they look at Headley.

QUOTE (Chilihead90 @ Oct 20, 2014 -> 01:36 AM) Well, the Price trade isn't a great example because pretty much everyone agrees universally that the Rays got a horrible deal there. Some rumored returns for Price included Joc Pederson, Tavares + Shelby Miller + 1st RD pick, 2 of Aaron Sanchez, Daniel Norris, and Dalton Pompey. Basically, packages MUCH better than what they actually got. That's a massive overpay - no one pays that price anymore. And if it was true, why didn't they take it?

QUOTE (Chilihead90 @ Oct 19, 2014 -> 09:18 PM) I think you are misunderstanding the conversation. I don't WANT Zobrist. I mean I do, but I don't want to have to trade for him because of what I expressed I am assuming it would cost to acquire him. I'd take him for a lot less, but I don't think a lot less would be enough. I would not give up Montas, Sanchez, and Beck for him, I am just speculating what the asking price may be. Well for Price they got a promising starter and, what, a Semien? And that was for more years and in the July seller's market. So I don't see the price as sky high. I wouldn't do it anyway as the Sox have other needs and don't have the prospects for 1 year contracts. Anyway, what I would do is try to trade Viciedo for Domonic Brown. Similar players, change of scenery, Viciedo's 2 years younger. Sign a league-average right handed starter; preferably one without a QO Sign one of the relievers. Not a closer though. Maybe sign Headley; I like his D Trade Gillaspie for a LF. I lean to the sign Headley and trade Gillaspie because we need better IF defense and I don't see any really interesting LF. I'd like to get Michael Saunders out of Seattle (I used to hate him; now I like him). Maybe take a big swing and trade Alexei for him and one of their relievers? Flowers handled the position really well this year, with few days off. I'd stay put there for now.

QUOTE (thxfrthmmrs @ Oct 19, 2014 -> 03:08 PM) Someone should troll that Red Sox fanboy who wrote the Sale to Red Sox piece. We speculate that Viciedo and Danks should get it done for Cespedes. It's not like a year of Cespedes is worth a ton anyway.

QUOTE (Dick Allen @ Oct 19, 2014 -> 01:57 PM) I agree. If you must follow a model, wouldn't the Giants be the one to follow? They play good D and the pen is good, which appear to be recurring themes. I think the main thing they've done is produce talented players on a regular basis from their farm system: Cain - 2006 Lincecum - 2007 Sandoval - 2008 Posey - 2009 Bumgarner - 2010 Belt - 2011 Crawford - 2011/2012 They've made some good signings of mid-tier free agents to eat innings and as bench bats.

QUOTE (Chilihead90 @ Oct 18, 2014 -> 11:39 AM) Would you not give up 3 prospects who may not even be listed as top 100 prospects for one of those guys for 1 year coming off an MVP season, even at age 33? I think because it's Ben Zobrist and not one of those names above, we feel we don't trust it. You're right, I don't trust it. And even if I did, I wouldn't do it. That's a clown move for a 74 win team to trade good prospects for 1 year of a good player who's in his mid 30s and experiencing decline in production. this org is also still thin on pitching. It's getting better, quickly, but it's still thin. And, yes let's be that organization that values its prospects and demands fair return for them, versus an organization that trades them for middle relievers and mediocre veterans.

QUOTE (bmags @ Oct 18, 2014 -> 01:39 PM) Well frankly we are due for striking gold on a flyer free agent because Hahn has been terrible on those so far. I hope it's just bad luck. Mostly flyers is all Hahn's done, except for Keppinger which was just a bad signing, sort of out of desperation. You'll lose most flyers. Putnam and Noesi have worked out. Cleto still might.

Sox have 2 holes in the rotation, not 3. Noesi and/or Danks can handle the #5 position. Noesi did it admirably last season I'd go after a mid-tier pitcher who appears to be a ground ball pitcher like McCarthy. After this year, the price of relief pitchers is going to be so high that I wish the Sox had some to deal. I think Carroll can be a good reliever. Sign 1 but be careful.

And let's not forget that the Rangers declined Alex Rios' option. That is a man this team needs - Rios.

Ethier/Crawford have 3 strikes against them: 1)Salary is 2x-3x higher than their production warrants. 2)They are 32-33 years - decline stage 3)They are signed for 3 more years. Yes, the Dodgers will throw in 1/2 the salary, but it still leaves a commitment longer than is warranted.

Good list. Where do we figure to be? 15-20?

No Peavy, Floyd...why not De Aza. Mercy!

QUOTE (Chilihead90 @ Oct 18, 2014 -> 01:14 AM) Carlos Sanchez, Frank Montas, and Chris Beck? I feel like his numbers are worth way more than that, but I just can't bring myself to want to give up more. More? More for a 33 year old .749 OPS with 1 year left on contract? The trade as listed would horrendous - Worse than the first Swisher trade. No reaching and no trading of top prospects, especially for aging veterans.

QUOTE (BaconOnAStick @ Oct 17, 2014 -> 02:59 PM) Don't be so blinded by trying to maximize Montas' value. The White Sox have at least some starting pitchers. The White Sox have nobody, literally nobody, who can be relied on out of the pen. They're not paying for someone either, we know that much. Montas might have more value as a starter for the other 29 teams in baseball, but the Sox have the glaringest of needs in the bullpen. Plus pitching out of the pen should substantially reduce his injury risk. Heck yes you should try to maximize value. That's how you develop a winner. Putnam, Guerra and Petricka are good bullpen pitchers. Sox have at least an equal need for starting pitching. That said, a year in the pen is decent prep to start. But if Montas can start eventually, he starts. Making a bullpen pitcher out of a quality starter is clowning around.

Should look at the San Francisco model. Sabean was lampooned second only to Kenny Williams by the sabre crowd (although they deny it now).

QUOTE (Chisoxfn @ Oct 16, 2014 -> 12:08 PM) As far as I'm concerned, Priority 1 is fixing the defense, Priority 2 is fixing the pen, and priority three is finding another starter. In terms of adding a bat, all great but you hope you can accomplish that in conjunction with priority 1. Adding bad defensive players really just isn't a good strategy given our existing defense and how bad it is. 1. Defense 2. LF 3. DH Pen will be better, even if only internal candidates are used. I still think someone like Cleto can pitch. I wouldn't go overboard on starters right now - we should be getting osme out of minors soon.

QUOTE (caulfield12 @ Oct 16, 2014 -> 09:19 PM) Pretty soon, they're just going to have to get Anderson's bat and athleticism into the MLB line-up. His ultimate defensive position is becoming secondary, although of course they would love for it to be SS and not 2B/OF. His defense cannot be secondary. He needs to stay in the minors while that part of his game improves.

QUOTE (caulfield12 @ Oct 16, 2014 -> 08:49 PM) C Sal Perez over Flowers, not even close...Perez is one of the best catchers in baseball 3B Moustakas (although he makes a lot more errors than he should) over Gillaspie, not even close SS Escobar, slight edge over Ramirez 2B wash 1B Hosmer has made more errors this year, but he's already won a Gold Glove LF best versus worst OF defenders in baseball CF Dyson/Cain, slight edge over Eaton RF Cain/Aoki...big edge over A. Garcia We don't have a single position of advantage. SS and CF are close, but nobody would pick Ramirez and Eaton over Alcides Esobar/Cain/Dyson. You MIGHT be able to argue Carlos Sanchez/Leury over Infante if they could hit well enough to justify their starting position. Of course, the Royals are exceptional defensively. Upgrades at 3B and LF and 2B would help immensely.

QUOTE (bear_brian @ Oct 16, 2014 -> 02:12 PM) Our fielding percentage and the Royals was almost identical. Range, man, range. Fielding percentage reveals little about defense. Startling stat above- near 140 run differential between woeful sox D and Royal D.?