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QUOTE (steveno89 @ Dec 16, 2016 -> 01:04 PM) Maitan looks like a very good prospect, but he has not even turned 17 yet. There is far too much risk projecting a player that young to the major leagues. Albies looks like he could be a really good player, and I will give him the benefit of the doubt because he is still young, but his 2016 performance at AAA was not great. The speed, makeup and defensive ability are not questioned, but if the bat doesn't play his value will be limited. I don't doubt that he will make the majors eventually and contribute, but he needs to prove he can handle AAA pitching this season to take the next step. Maitan is a toolsy wild card, and a serious gamble. If I'm dealing Quintana I would want a more proven prospect. I guess my question is, if you were trading with BRaves would you deal more with certainty or the highest possible upside? I can see doing a deal without Meitan but I love any deal with him a lot more.

QUOTE (Y2JImmy0 @ Dec 16, 2016 -> 12:47 PM) This is true. I just have no idea how any person thinks that they aren't in a fairly substantial rebuild. It's very obvious that they aren't done and they aren't going to turn around and buy. It keeps getting talked about though. I keep taking the bait though like an idiot because it's a stupid opinion. I agree with you that it's a ridiculous conspiracy theory when all signs point to rebuild. I don't think its necessary for people to just turn this entire thread into trashing OP. Jimmy, you have good stuff to say, drive it there.

QUOTE (StrangeSox @ Dec 16, 2016 -> 11:51 AM) Did anyone in Russia give a s*** when all of his shady dealings related to the Panama Papers came out? The coverage you saw of this was more than any would have seen from within Russia, and part of a cyber attack would be to open up commnucation areas for dissidents currently shut down. But obviously yes people did care in Russia, and the state as always uses their media monopoly to turn it into "US propoganda "

As always, a great way to let less interesting discussion die is to not respond to it with your own uninteresting opinion.

QUOTE (BlackSox13 @ Dec 16, 2016 -> 12:16 PM) Thanks for posting that. Lipper34 does a good job of looking at the proposed trade from both sides. The writer of the article however, is disillusioned if he thinks Luhnow should wait out Hahn's asking price. The reality of the situation is that the Sox are rebuilding, have a very valuable asset in Q and do not need to trade him. The writer comes off as though the Sox NEED to trade Q and will at some point drop the price which is clearly not the case. The Astros need Q more than the Sox do so if Luhnow doesn't want to pay thats fine with me because somebody will. Go ahead Houston, wait it out because rebuilds take time and the Sox have plenty of it. Would be hilarious if the Sox ended up getting their haul for Q in July, from the Rangers. Rangers system at such an odd point in development. The team that I still go back on is the Braves. Not from a "will they" standpoint as I think their Sale interest was a starry eyed new stadium acquisition ploy, but trying to figure out much value I would put to incredibly high up side incredibly risky players like Meitan or Vlad Guerrero Jr from Blue Jays. But Albies/Meitan, does that get you in door with other teams?

Ziegler close to a decision. edit: Sorry, per Jeff Passan on Twitter.

QUOTE (Steve9347 @ Dec 16, 2016 -> 09:00 AM) Yes, hit them where it hurts for a month, then transfer power to a guy who's in bed with Putin. That'll work. Unleashing cyber attacks would be capable of opening up the very rich information of all of putin's dealings with his oligarch base. It can open up avenues for dissent to be heard. It undermines his power within Russia. That is still powerful regardless of what happens on inauguration day.

This poster from crawfishboxes answered a lot of my questions on why this analysis feels at odds with the market and does not address the questions well: KUDOS to him (poster Lipper34): http://www.crawfishboxes.com/2016/12/16/13...r-jose-quintana

Add me to the list of surplus value being an overvalued indicator. I would welcome a report on these excess value applied retroactively to previous years of trades to see how accurate they would have been, and that should ultimately ignore performance of trade itself.

QUOTE (soxfan2014 @ Dec 16, 2016 -> 10:46 AM) $6 million is seriously nothing to get worked up about lol I don't understand some posters on here. His point is well taken, as it was my own, when we were relying on bargain basement guys to play SERIOUS roles on a competitive team. But Fowler actually was a $13 mill contract, was clearly going back to cubs, and cost a 1st round pick. Desmond also cost a 1st round pick.

QUOTE (GreenSox @ Dec 16, 2016 -> 10:27 AM) Rick Hahn spent $17.5 million on the following: Morneau, Avila, Navarro, Jackson, Latos, Rollins. Let's add $5 mill for Shields and his ERA near 7 and we get $22.5 million. Desmond and Fowler each signed for $8 million. The Sox can afford it, but $6 million seems way excessive for a pitcher with the production of Holland; and his peripherals were bad. And it is concerning for the future, as such contracts are routine out of Hahn and used in a way to "go for it". Yikes! But Andrew Cashner just signed a contract for 10 million. You want to check his peripherals? You want to know what Ivan Nova's about to get?

QUOTE (soxfan2014 @ Dec 16, 2016 -> 10:39 AM) Exactly. They're athletic and transition to another position. Very good problem to have. It's much better than Multiple 1b or LFers.

QUOTE (Dam8610 @ Dec 16, 2016 -> 09:59 AM) He won't stay at SS in this organization, though. I'd be looking at him as a future 2B or 3B, depending on where they want Moncada. I think there is plenty of evidence that having multiple great shortstops is not a bad thing.

Chapman and Miller got a lot at the deadline but Ken Giles and Kimbrel got a lot in the offseason and Thornburg just got a lot a few weeks ago. I don't think it matters that much. Thornburg just netted a major league 3b and two prospects.

Yes, it is the .200 iso as a 19 year old. Edit: That plays shortstop

I went last night and it was really good. Chicago performance just as enjoyable. Was more awkward first few 15 or so minutes to get into than I expected but fantastic as you go through. Also have had 4 friends get tix through lottery so may be worth trying those that could do last minute plans like that

QUOTE (southsider2k5 @ Dec 15, 2016 -> 04:35 PM) I think you are over thinking it. I mean coaches are still going to coach this year, even with no chance at winning anything. If they like Holland, and think they can turn him into something this year, why not recruit him? They could offer him a chance at reclamation, plus a shot at being traded to a contender if he succeeds. It is a win for both him and the Sox. Plus the Sox would like to keep their pitching at bay for another year if possible when it comes to some of these guys. They need SOMEONE in the rotation. I don't know if this was obvious to everyone else but I don't remember if we had really concluded it after it was announced: I was listening to Garfein's podcast (I think) and their interview with Hahn he was talking to the offseason and (paraphrased) I told people that they would know our direction based off of our first move and then people went "What does signing Liriano mean?". But part of this was the coaching staff shakeup and moving a player development guy in Capra down to 3b coach so we have more developers in our staff". This was another moment where I felt my confidence in Hahn rising. Regardless if Capra is the top person for that job, this is what you WOULD do if you had a plan to acquire a bunch of young talent and needed to develop. So yes, our coaches are going to try and make our players better, and will also try to make HOlland better.

http://atlanticleague.com/about/press-rele...?article_id=622 Rooting for this guy hard after reading Ben Lindbergh and Sam Millers book running an indy league team last year. Interested to see if he goes to AAA or what.

QUOTE (Balta1701 @ Dec 15, 2016 -> 03:49 PM) Usually when we sign a "Coopll fix em" guy someone asks the GM if Cooper had any say or input beforehand and everyone always says no, with the exception of Thornton where everyone said "Shut up Coop now you have him". Except for Zach Duke. Remember Coop going down to nashville with his fancy ipad?

It's funny the variation. JJ Cooper said he wouldn't do the Musgrove/Tucker/Martes deal for Quintana and Law says he wouldn't even respond to it. Law says Giolito is still top prospect with mechanics screwed while Lopez is a bullpen piece. Cooper says Lopez is the superior prospect to Giolito.

QUOTE (Balta1701 @ Dec 15, 2016 -> 03:08 PM) I think that the EE market is holding this up. He's asking for money with no teams willing to pay that price right now - once he moves, then it becomes possible to judge the value for both Frazier and Abreu better. I don't see this ending soon thou. Cespedes waited for a while and got exactly what he wanted.

QUOTE (steveno89 @ Dec 15, 2016 -> 02:59 PM) Jones would not come cheap in a trade either He had a strong 2016 and is signed to a cheap contract I didn't suggest he would come cheap. I am suggesting he is a much better bullpen piece because he is more likely to succeed in Coors field. Robertson is a terrible idea there.

QUOTE (shipps @ Dec 15, 2016 -> 02:53 PM) If I were any team that needed bullpen help I would be after Jones over Robertson. Well yes, but Jones throws fireballs and that is the only pitch they are confident in.

If I were Rockies I'd be after Nate Jones much more than Robertson.