Dick Allen

QUOTE (caulfield12 @ Apr 18, 2010 -> 05:43 PM) Who could we actually trade to save money and get something in return? Thornton? Look at all the contracts right now we couldn't give away (like Rios) without subsidizing with cash.... Rios Jenks (50/50, maybe an NL team would take him for half a season and give us a B prospect) Linebrink Konerko Kotsay Vizquel Castro Peavy (depends on how we structured it) Teahen AJ Pierre Nix Williams Lucy Garcia (neither category, but, right now, I'm thinking we wouldn't get anything offered in return) So basically, we really would have to trade Buehrle, Danks, Floyd, Putz, Santos, Pena, Andruw Jones, Ramirez, Beckham or Quentin to do anything but save just a little bit of money which may or may not be invested into the minor leagues/development instead of covering a financial spreadsheet loss. The White Sox don't have to save money. They make plenty and have a top 5 AL payroll. As for the minor leagues, just throwing money at that isn't going to make it better. They have to select better. They gave Joe Borchard more money than anyone ever received at the time they signed him,and the guy had talent and a good attitude yet they couldn't develop him. This team still has some talent. The bullpen looks good, the rotation should be decent althought there has to be concern about Garcia. Maybe see if Washburn, the poor man's Mark Buehrle would be interested in signing on. Floyd sucks early in the season again after coming to spring training and pitching like it was the beginning of June, so if we use last year as a measurement he should be OK eventually. They still need offense. Pierre looks not as quick to me, but IIRC he is a very streaky guy. I don't think Beckham should be hitting 2nd. Teahen is a disaster with the glove. Ramirez just doesn't hit in April. Rios and Jones, a couple of guys just about everyone considered key to the offense have shown a lot of life. If I were the GM, the guy I would seriously consider trading is Ramirez as soon as he starts to hit for a bit. I think he is what he is, can be spectacular at times but will eventually leave you wanting more, but with his favorable contract it may entice some GM to overpay in talent. The Sox need proven hitters. Not reclimation projects, not guys with potential, but guys who get it done.

Obviously there's still plenty of time left in the season and really no time to panic but if we use the formula of 2005 which seems to be popular the White Sox were 52-22 vs. the AL Central that year. Right now they are 2-7. I don't think they are going to have to win 99 games to win the division again, but you never know. I was reading that single game ticket sales were lower than Brooks had thought they would be before the season started, and this streak has got to kill them there. They need to start winning very soon. With the schedule they have played, at worst they should be 2 or 3 games better than they have been.

QUOTE (Jenksy Cat @ Apr 18, 2010 -> 12:17 PM) And again, how are they superior? Who the f*** cares about division titles and no playoff wins? That would piss me off more than having a team that only puts it together every couple years. The Twins are like the Bulls, a fun little team to watch, but they can't, and won't ever, hang with the "big boys". The Twins won the WS in 1987 and 1991. How long do the White Sox get to live off of 2005 before it doesn't count at all?

White Sox DHs are hitting below .200 with 2 hr and 9 rbi. The rbi total is high because Quentin got 6 in a game as the DH. The White Sox DH has driven in a run in 3 of the 13 games. There were two parts to the DH by committee they were preaching that had to be of a concern. One was Kotsay and Jones being in the line up daily. Kotsay has shown he should be a guy that gets about 150 AB throught the course of a season. Jones has been pretty solid. The other part of the DH committee is guys will be DHing that haven't done it before and aren't used to it. For many players being a DH isn't easy, and apparently the rotation the White Sox have been using is struggling mightily with it.

QUOTE (joesaiditstrue @ Apr 18, 2010 -> 03:17 PM) first time where we have scored 4 runs and not won, gavin sucks at the start of the year .....yuck This is the second year in a row he has come to spring training in mid season form and been knocked around when the games counted. He's going to need to alter his off season plan.

QUOTE (Thunderbolt @ Apr 18, 2010 -> 01:31 PM) Joe Morgan would be worse then Ozzie as a manager. Far, far worse. For all of Ozzie's lunacies, those are some of Joe Morgan's direct impulses. If Ozzie quit or was fired, and I think there is less than a 1% chance of either, I would say there's a 99.9% chance that his replacement would be Cora.

QUOTE (chw42 @ Apr 18, 2010 -> 01:31 PM) I have no problem with KW, I have a problem with KW listening to Ozzie. I don't think Ozzie wanted Rios or Beckham on the team last year. This is a guy who said if the Sox had to have Beckham on the team they would be in trouble, yet liked Wise in the leadoff spot. The team wasn't even .500 and they gave Ozzie even more power determining the roster this year. Whatever the reason for this is flawed. It could be KW just let him, which would be on him, or it could be JR.

QUOTE (earthshiner @ Apr 18, 2010 -> 01:29 PM) say what you want about Williams but overall his tenure as GM has been one of the best decades in white sox history. 3 playoff appearances and a world series. This is the best in 90 years 2 playoff appearances from KW. 2000 was Schueler.

Ozzie has been a genius at keeping all the pressure and attention off his players from spring training on. The results have been spectacular.

QUOTE (Thunderbolt @ Apr 18, 2010 -> 01:23 PM) Beckham and Hudson were two guys whom Bell oversaw the development of. I suspect Danks will be the first true example. Bells loves him. I'm not going to give Bell credit for Beckham. He was very advanced and a top of the line prospect when the Sox drafted him. The key for Sox minor leagues isn't Bell, its bringing in talent that can be developed, something that has been severely lacking. Bell thinks highley of Oney Guillen. Just ask Oney.

QUOTE (KipWellsFan @ Apr 18, 2010 -> 01:17 PM) OMG the whining on these boards is incredible when we're slumping. 2005 was a fluke now? One of the most dominant playoff performances ever. That's not what I said. There were a couple of plays that if they were different, and KW and Ozzie had nothing to do with, that the attitude that they can do no wrong would be 180 degrees different right now.

QUOTE (Thunderbolt @ Apr 18, 2010 -> 01:14 PM) I know you hate Rios, but are you seriously writing off Peavy, right now? Not to mention hiring Buddy Bell to dramatically improve our minor league system? I'll believe the Buddy Bell impact when I see it at the major league level.

QUOTE (fathom @ Apr 18, 2010 -> 01:07 PM) As much crap as Ozzie is getting, Kenny Williams has done a HORRIBLE job as our GM since the Quentin trade. Both Ozzie and KW like Ditka, living off 2005. If the ball doesn't go through Tony G's legs and El Duque actually gives up a couple of runs that year, the two baseball geniuses that people actually shed tears thanking, are nothing more than failures. I just want that "how many championships" has whoever won argument gone. That's in the past. It doesn't take much baseball IQ to figure out the line ups last year and this were lacking. Ozzie can pop off about fans all he wants. The proof is in the pudding. He's losing.

QUOTE (fathom @ Apr 18, 2010 -> 01:03 PM) Just like with Teahen, we just have to hope they turn it around. I really have a problem with a team always concerned about budget giving Teahen that ridiculous extension. If the Sox didn't trade for him, there was an excellent chance he would have been non tendered.

QUOTE (Frankensteiner @ Apr 18, 2010 -> 12:52 PM) The thing about the 0-8 record when scoring 3 or less is more an indictment on the pitching staff than anything else. I mean, we all knew the offense would suck and low scoring games would be common place. But I think that most of us would think that with our pitching staff, we can pull some of these games out, at least some of the time. Even if we won 2 of those 8, we'd be 6-6 right now. Basically, the pitching was supposed to carry this team. I don't think it has. I don't care how good your pitching staff is, if they can only give up 2 runs to win, with the Sox defense, that's asking for way too much.

When does the statute of limitations expire on the KW and OG are geniuses because of 2005?

We've been told its nearly impossible to sweep a MLB team. The Sox are still sitting pretty today. Stone said something interesting, the Sox just don't bore White Sox fans, they drew the smallest crowds EVER at each of the two destinations on this road trip.

QUOTE (S_R_N83 @ Apr 18, 2010 -> 09:38 AM) new guy here from Pittsburgh, PA Kotsay is really batting in the 3 hole? How can this team become consistent offensively when its a different lineup everyday?! Jerry Manuel used to get blasted for being a "tinkerer". Ozzie usually gets a pass from those same people, but in his defense, if the line up isn't working, changes are in order. If he keeps it the same he'll be criticized, if he changes it, he'll get the same thing. They just need to start scoring runs and winning. They weren't helped by a weak offseason from management, but they can overcome that because of the division they play in. Is the goal to be the best team you can be or be a team that is considered a contender in its division? It seems to be the White Sox higher ups have settled on the latter. If they were actually in the AL East, would they have the line up they have now and consider themselves a contender for anything but a high draft pick?

QUOTE (chimpy2121 @ Apr 18, 2010 -> 09:27 AM) I dont even want to post this lineup... Pierre lf, Beckham 2b, Kotsay rf, Konerko 1b, A.J. c, Rios cf, Teahen dh, Vizquel 3b, Ramirez ss, Floyd p Who knows how it will turn out, but I think even the guys who think KW and Ozzie can do no wrong would say that isn't a very impressive-looking line-up. At least Vizquel isn't leading off.

QUOTE (GREEDY @ Apr 18, 2010 -> 09:04 AM) How about not blacking out the WCIU games for people that aren't blessed with the Tyler Perry channel? MLB Extra Innings: Blacked Out MLB.TV: Blacked Out MLB Iphone App: Blacked Out My options are to watch the game on 1/20th of a screen on the MLB Extra Innings channel that shows all the games or listen to Ed and DJ. This sucks Brooks! I am a season ticket holder, when I give my tickets away I would like to watch the damn game on tv. I hate the games on WCIU because for some reason DirectTv doesn't have HD on that channel. I've become very spoiled. Its hard for me to watch anything that isn't HD.

The key today is to score at least 4 runs.

QUOTE (knightni @ Apr 17, 2010 -> 05:41 PM) They're skipping Garcia's next start in favor of Buehrle. This is pretty good news for Hudson fans. If you have your starts being skipped 3 turns into the season, it doesn't bode well for being around much longer. Freddy actually looked good his first start, but then was pounded just like spring training. Chances are he doesn't pitch much more for the Sox than he did last season.

QUOTE (caulfield12 @ Apr 17, 2010 -> 06:48 PM) The Konerko move was the right one at the time. Maybe KW went one year too long with Contreras AND Paulie, but nobody was disagreeing at the time, not after all the pride we had when JR welled up and Konerko handed him the baseball. If you want to make any argument, it's not that we built around Konerko. He has always been merely an above average, but not great, 1B. The problem is that the offensive firepower provided by Thome and Dye has been replaced incorrectly and ineffectively. It wasn't necessarily wrong to let them go, it's the moves that KW made that were horrible. Our offense would look a lot nicer with Nick Swisher in the line-up, of course, that ship sailed when the relationship deteriorated with Ozzie and the FO...but losing Swisher and giving up all that talent really was a set-back. That said, Ryan Sweeney, Chris Carter, Chris Getz or even Chris Young the way he's playing now for ARIZ wouldn't make or break this Sox team. But our lack of minor league development has forced moves like Pierre, Rios and Teahen that have hamstrung our payroll to the point where we were basically helpless to sign Matsui, Damon or Vlad. Or O-Dog. BTW, AJ is not doing as expected, he's been pretty close to horrendous. His offensive output was always the most predictable, along with Juan Uribe. The Konerko thing I agree with completely. If he would have walked away after the WS, it would have been a huge PR hit, and even if he is slightly above average to average, what is the probability the Sox could have filled his spot with someone more productive? Doubtful if you ask me. This team is just currently finding ways to lose. They will start winning some games eventually. How many they win is a good question, but I don't think we are looking at a 2007 situation here. Like was stated before, boring baseball and especially losing boring baseball isn't going to work at the box office. I think KW relaxed way too much this offseason. Its time to do something.

Gene Lamont won 86 games his first year managing the White Sox then had 2 first place finishes. He was canned 31 games into his 4th season with a career winning pct. a lot higher than Ozzie's and replaced with Terry Bevington, perhaps the biggest joke of a manager in MLB history. I guess what I'm saying is, even though I wouldn't do it, its not unprecedented for a guy like Ozzie to get canned fairly early if things don't turn around, even if there really isn't a better alternative around. Its one thing to be 4-8, but with 8 of those games against Cleveland and KC and the others against Toronto, there has to be a little concern.

QUOTE (BigSqwert @ Apr 17, 2010 -> 05:45 PM) Now 0-8 when scoring 3 or less. Ozzie ball! The White Sox won about 12% of the games last season when they scored less than 4 runs. It shouldn't be a surprise they lose when they score 2 runs. Ozzie might have made a mistake keeping Peavy out there too long, I didn't see the game, but you score 2 runs against the Indians again and you should lose. The scary thing is Andruw Jones is actually hitting pretty well and this team is a bat short. Pierre looks done. He seems like he's lost a couple of steps. There is no margin of error for the pitching staff or the defense. One let down and the game is over. NL offenses don't work in the AL.