Dick Allen

Bloop, Bloop, Bomb, tie game. Please.

QUOTE(fathom @ Jul 14, 2006 -> 08:40 PM) Assuming we lose, Widger now has a 4 game winless streak going. What's his hitless game streak at?

QUOTE(nitetrain8601 @ Jul 14, 2006 -> 08:34 PM) Um, why isn't Crede at 3rd? He was beaned in the calf. It must have stiffened up on him.

Must hold them right here to have a chance. Game over. Contreras' streak over. In a wierd way I think Contreras getting a L might not be that bad of a thing. I think he's been pitching not to lose lately, rather than pitching to win.

Quality starts stats are the most BS stats there are.

I just went to a teller in my bank for the first time in a few years. The little pregnant teller's name is Carrie Woods. I was laughing my ass off. She thought I lost my mind.

The Sox should get rid of Freddy while everyone else still thinks he can pitch. Its like Roberto Alomar. He struggled in NY. When the Sox acquired him everyone was saying he's going to be with his brother, he's leaving NY, he'll be back in the AL, he'll return to form. He was done. Other than his won/loss totals, Freddy appears to be nearing the end of his usefullness in a major league rotation. Someone will pay up for his name. Please KW, pretend you are at Joe Perillo and make the deal.

QUOTE(jphat007 @ Jul 14, 2006 -> 12:00 PM) He hasn't been great, especially with the money we are paying him. But he does have 10 QS so it isn't like he is terrible out there. He has had some good starts. I think the league is catching up to his new "style" however, and although he never could hold on runners, its now automatic they run every chance they get on him. Unless he was saving himself for the second half, and actually finds a fastball that would be impressive to anyone above Pony league, I think there's a very good chance his ERA is actually going to rise in the second half.

Freddy, thanks for your efforts in the playoffs, you were magnificent. Now go, leave, get out of here.........If KW gets a nice package for Freddy, I take back any negative thing I have ever posted about him.

Strengthening the bullpen will help out all of the Sox starters. All of them have shown signs of fatique. BMac could get stretched out fairly quickly, and should be strong in the second half as well.

QUOTE(WCSox @ Jul 14, 2006 -> 11:36 AM) KW doesn't need Ozzie's "blessing" and I'm sure that the two of them have spoken about this before. I don't think there's a chance in hell KW would ship Freddy out of town without consulting Ozzie and getting his OK first. He doesn't need his blessing, but its best for everyone that he gets it, at least concerning Garcia.

QUOTE(Rowand44 @ Jul 14, 2006 -> 11:33 AM) Pretty odd with out a leadoff hitter. Milledge is one hell of a talent but Flash would definitely be more of a boost to this team than Lastings. Milledge would look pretty good around 2008-9. Gordon would look good 2006-7.

If KW is shopping Freddy, Ozzie must have given his blessing. I think that says enough right there.

QUOTE(redandwhite @ Jul 14, 2006 -> 11:20 AM) There are there differences between the two as you mentioned, but the deal was made completely mortaging the future of that Expos franchise, for a month or two of Colon. I think him being under contract for another year, regardless of what he's owed, is something that will spike his value. If the Mets thought they could change Victor Zambrano into a prize, they certainly think the same about Freddy Garcia? No? Actually, Colon had another year on his contract. Minaya made the 3 way which netted the Sox Colon. Minaya wound up with crap, Liefer, Biddle and an injured El Duque.

QUOTE(beautox @ Jul 14, 2006 -> 11:18 AM) agreed from a white sox prespective, but you move him to the NL and his stats go down drasticly. I don't know about that. He would be pitching in a bigger park, but he lets lots of hitters get on base now, and when they get there, they run wild. Freddy Garcia 2006 is a completely different pitcher from anything we have seen from him earlier. He could easily turn into a total disaster. I'm not a fan of Vazquez, but in the playoffs I'd rather have him pitching than Freddy throwing up his junk.

QUOTE(redandwhite @ Jul 14, 2006 -> 11:15 AM) That wasn't my argument. I don't give a damn who said Milledge wasn't available, the same bulls*** was said about Grady Sizemore and the Indians netted alot more than just him alone for Colon. So don't try pass off crap and say that I'm arguing something im not. When Minaya traded for Colon, his ERA was about half of what Garcia's is right now. Phillips I believe was actually the biggest name in the deal. He was supposed to be a stud, although Sizemore was very well reguarded.

QUOTE(redandwhite @ Jul 14, 2006 -> 11:05 AM) And somehow in a similar situation last year, McCarthy was inches away from being shipped to the Marlns. Thats baseball. The White Sox couldn't rely on Hernandez in the fifth slot, needed some offense aswell, and almost got rid of there best prospect because of it. Thankfully they did not, but Omar Minaya's track record isn't as lucky, ala: June 27, 2002: Traded by the Cleveland Indians with Tim Drew to the Montreal Expos for Lee Stevens, Brandon Phillips, Cliff Lee, and Grady Sizemore. That was Bartolo Colon. He's a little different than Freddy Garcia throwing 86, and it was a trade he can learn from.

QUOTE(nitetrain8601 @ Jul 14, 2006 -> 10:58 AM) I don't know if it's the fact that he's washed up or that he really doesn't want to throw his fastball anymore. If it's the latter, then I want him gone and this is coming from a huge Freddy Garcia fan. He's not even a great pitcher in day games or in big games anymore when last year, he was always good for that. I think Freddy wants to throw his fastball, he just can't.

QUOTE(redandwhite @ Jul 14, 2006 -> 10:46 AM) Well then he's going to go into the playoffs with a battered Pedro Martinez, an old Tom Glavine, and barely anyone else behind him. It's not like the Mets are in a position of power here. The White Sox are. You saw what the Reds did yesterday to acquire needs, the Mets and Omar Minaya certainly will do the same. The Mets also got burned trading a phenom for a wash-up pitcher in 2004. Believe me, it will take more than Freddy Garcia to get Milledge away from the Mets, and if Milledge is available, there will be teams willing to part with pitchers more attractive than Garcia to acquire him.

I would think if KW trades a starter is almost a lock BMac moves into the rotation. I would think if they did this deal fairly soon, they may call up a guy like Haeger to be the long man in the bullpen. If he could handle it, and if AJ can handle the knuckler fine, if not, a guy like Armas may make sense as a guy they could use in long relief.

QUOTE(redandwhite @ Jul 14, 2006 -> 10:41 AM) The White Sox won't trade one of the two unless they get a stunning deal. Would you do Lastings Milledge, Duaner Sanchez for Freddy Garcia? Add in Cliff Politte if necessary. Omar Minaya wouldn't do that trade.

QUOTE(quickman @ Jul 14, 2006 -> 10:35 AM) the risk to all this is if Garcia and Vasquez pitch like crap in there next outing. I am sure they aare reading the same crap we are. Its easy to get distracted especially in the NEw York press. There is a pretty good chance they would pitch like crap anyway. QUOTE(GoSox05 @ Jul 14, 2006 -> 10:35 AM) i would love to have flash back. YOu could almost count on teams not scoring innings 7, 8, and 9. If we were to move Bmac to the starting rotaion. We would need someone to be are long reliever. Tracey maybe. fathom has a source that told him there are very long odds of Tracey pitching on a team managed by Ozzie Guillen ever again.

QUOTE(beck72 @ Jul 14, 2006 -> 10:29 AM) Jenks would be the closer, Flash in set up The nice thing about this is if Jenks pitches 2 or 3 games in a row, Gordon could be used to close it out. An All Star closer as a set-up man, and you probably have at least a 50/50 shot of improving the rotation by getting BMac in there in place of one of the bigger names. I think if this trade were to be made, there would also be something else that would probably come down.

QUOTE(southsideirish71 @ Jul 14, 2006 -> 10:16 AM) Well maybe Freddy's antics at the Bosox series and showing up his teamates pushed this over the edge. That and his new style of pitching. If he isnt hurt and just decided not to throw hard, KW has to be pulling his hair out. Its like if Bobby Jenks just decided that 98 was too hard, so he would cruise it in there at 92 just for the hell of it. I think you are right. His antics the Boston series, showing up Iguchi, lost velocity, the alledged positive marijuana test at the WBC, and the fact that KW gave up a guy he had on his "3 year board" for Vazquez, would indicate to me that he would be reluctant to pull the plug on Vazquez after 3 months. If the Sox trade a starter, I would imagine it would be Garcia that KW would prefer to move. I wonder how much more than Gordon KW wants from Philadelphia.

QUOTE(Capn12 @ Jul 14, 2006 -> 06:38 AM) If other teams are willing to take on a headcase for their rotation in Weaver, then surely they are willing to bite on Garcia or Javy....though I'm not quite sure which I'd be more willing to move right now honestly... The Angels are paying part of his remaining contract, which expires after this season, and gave up a 24 year old 47th round draft pick who started the season in A ball. A non-prospect. Makes the interest a little easier to understand. I hope if the Sox move one of these guys before the deadline, they move the other one next offseason.