Dick Allen

QUOTE (JohnCangelosi @ Feb 27, 2016 -> 08:23 AM) I'm surprised that probably 80% of this board wants to throw Avi out with the bath water now, when he's only in his age 24-25 season. Guys like Carlos Gomez or Aaron Rowand come to mind as guys who didn't develop until age 26 or 27. I realize we have a limited time to contend here and we should be trying to win now, but still, maybe management is gambling he can have a rebound season and put up some decent numbers. There's no guarantee any of the FA or trade options left are going to produce more than Avi this year, I suspect. I agree he can improve, but he needs to improve immensely as a offensive player, or pretty significantly offensively defensively, running the bases, to be a useful player. It can happen, but so far, experience doesn't seem to be an answer. If anything he appears to be going backwards or maintaining in most areas the more he plays. Maybe this new stance shakes things up. Maybe he figures out how to run down fly balls, and judge line drives, maybe he doesn't run into as many easy outs in the bases. But if you truly are going for it, there are too many maybes there. If they bring someone else in and Avi develops like we hope, they will find a spot for him. Guys who can play always play. It is pretty crazy to think the White Sox could possibly be good enough not to have room for a productive player. It is just that Avi needs to show that is what he is,

QUOTE (ChicagoHeel @ Feb 27, 2016 -> 12:51 AM) @mibeltrodriguez Developing: The #WhiteSox are back on SS Ian Desmond #MLB #Sox Wtf!? QUOTE (Chilihead90 @ Feb 27, 2016 -> 02:02 AM) For what? LF? I mean, I guess getting Rollins doesn't really block anyone since it was a minor league deal, but I can't imagine Jimmy would be happy whatsoever if this were to happy. He would have essentially been to lied to. It is Milbelt. What I don't understand is some of the sympathy Desmond is getting from many writers. They guy turned down$107 million, then after having a bad year, turned down the QO., thus knowing he would have this pick attached, and how it has hurt previous free agents. Sorry Ian, you need a new agent.

QUOTE (caulfield12 @ Feb 26, 2016 -> 06:35 PM) Duquette was outspoken about never giving opt-outs. I guess that can end up as another Sox "line in the sand" that makes it seem they're in on players and making legitimate offers when realistically the new market will leave the Sox and Orioles behind...unless they give out insane long-term deals like the Chris Davis one. One wonders why Casey Close even bothered, being as smart as he is, although obviously it ended up pushing the Cubs to finally make an offer. Casey Close's advice cost his client almost $3 million. As for opt outs, the White Sox were one of the first teams ever to give an opt out. It worked out great for them when Albert Belle opted out. I think the issue is giving up the draft pick and giving an opt out after one season. I would image many more teams would be willing to give an opt out after one year if there was no draft pick compensation involved, I have never read the White Sox would not ever give one. Considering they already have, to assume it would be silly.

QUOTE (Steve9347 @ Feb 26, 2016 -> 09:14 AM) I believe General Soreness is the plan moving forward. It sounds like the Bulls will happily have Derrick sit out 1/5 games. If that's the plan to return him to 75% of what he once was, I'm fine with it. I'd take 65 games of that over 75+ of the human garbage we watched the first 3/5 of the season. Which is fine as long as there is some solid logic picking the games he is "sore". When he sat and got the name, not being on the injury report, Butler being out, and the Bulls reeling, a bad time to sit, especially with the All Star break right around the corner.

Here's a list of #27 overall picks. I don't have the last 2, but I think I would trade every single one of them for Dexter Fowler. Porcello could be an exception. The White Sox are really going to have to buck a trend to get impact here, although I do admit, there will be some available: 27th Overall MLB Draft Picks Year Player Pos. Drafted From Drafted By 2013 Phil Ervin OF Samford Cincinnati Reds 2012 Clint Coulter C Union HS (WA) Milwaukee Brewers 2011 Robert Stephenson RHP Alhambra HS (CA) Cincinnati Reds 2010 Jesse Biddle LHP Germantown Frieds HS (PA) Philadelphia Phillies 2009 Michael Franklin SS Lake Brantley HS (Fla.) Seattle Mariners 2008 Carlos Gutierrez RHP University of Miami (Fla.) Minnesota Twins 2007 Rick Porcello RHP Seton Hall (N.J.)Prep Detroit Tigers 2006 Jason Place OF Wren HS Boston Red Sox 2005 Joseph Devine RHP North Carolina St. Atlanta Braves 2004 Taylor Tankersley LHP U Alabama (AL) Florida Marlins 2003 Eric Duncan 3B Seton Hall Prep School (NJ) New York Yankees 2002 Sergio Santos SS Mater Dei HS (CA) Arizona Diamondbacks 2001 Alan Horne P Marianna HS (FL) Cleveland Indians 2000 Robert Stiehl P El Camino College Houston Astros 1999 David Walling P University of Arkansas New York Yankees 1998 Chip Ambres OF West Brook HS (TX) Florida Marlins 1997 Kevin Nicholson SS Stetson University San Diego Padres 1996 A.J. Zapp 1B Center Grove HS (IN) Atlanta Braves 1995 Shea Morenz OF University of Texas New York Yankees 1994 Jacob Shumate P Hartsville HS (SC) Atlanta Braves 1993 Marc Valdes P University of Florida Florida Marlins 1992 John Burke P University of Florida Colorado Rockies 1991 Scott Stahoviak 3B-1B Creighton University Minnesota Twins 1990 Mike Zimmerman P University of South Alabama Pittsburgh Pirates 1989 Todd Jones P Jacksonville State University Houston Astros 1988 Jeff Mutis P Lafayette University Cleveland Indians 1987 Pete Harnisch P Fordham University Baltimore Orioles 1986 Mike Fetters P Pepperdine University California Angels 1985 Bill McGuire C University of Nebraska Seattle Mariners 1984 Gary Green SS Oklahoma State University San Diego Padres 1983 Calvin Schiraldi P University of Texas New York Mets 1982 Stan Boderick OF Robinson HS (Tampa,FL) Chicago Cubs 1981 Kevin Dukes P Arizona State University Seattle Mariners 1980 Jay Tibbs P Huffman HS (AL) New York Mets

QUOTE (Y2JImmy0 @ Feb 26, 2016 -> 10:58 AM) Don't have the pieces to get a run producing bat which is why I want to improve the worst defensive OF in the AL. I've wanted Jackson all offseason. It isn't some new thing. And he's 29. There has to be so hope his offense can rebound. And it's not like he was Leury Garcia with the bat last year either.

QUOTE (OmarComing25 @ Feb 26, 2016 -> 10:54 AM) This is why bringing in another OF is so important, it not only addresses the hole in the OF, but it also addresses the DH platoon for LaRoche with Avi. That is another reason why Avi "being addressed" kills 2 birds with 1 stone, and is a priority. Most of the other "problems" have been addressed anyways.

He basically matches Baltimore's supposed offer if he gets 2/$20 million next offseason. But the my heart is with the Cubs was BS. He signed for $13 million. He could have taken the QO for almost $16 million. His heart is with the Cubs as long as other teams weren't willing to pay him more money. Nothing wrong with that. But the now standard line , "I turned down more money elsewhere" probably is true when most players say it, but 3 or 4 years from now it will not.

QUOTE (HickoryHuskers @ Feb 26, 2016 -> 10:04 AM) Illinois job >>> DePaul job I agree, but that doesn't mean he would take it. I would assume he would, but you never know. I think its moot. Groce will be back unless it just gets really embarrassing the rest of the way.

QUOTE (Buehrle>Wood @ Feb 26, 2016 -> 09:43 AM) He makes 250k there and would make 2 million plus here. He'd be in Champaign in an hour if you offered him. Didn't he interview for the DePaul job last year? I think he was down to the final stage and might have pulled out. You would think he would take the ILL job if offered, but you never know. It does appear as if he would listen.

Just ask yourself if you think the money doesn't matter and everyone just wants to play for Maddon, if $13 million for one year was satisfactory to Fowler, why didn't he just take the QO? He got burned, but he would have no problem playing for someone else if he got paid.

QUOTE (Hatchetman @ Feb 25, 2016 -> 06:41 PM) you failed to see the point that it is all about the $$$ Of course it is about the money. Even Fowler signing with the Cubs isn't taking too much of a gamble. He is betting he can get at least 2/$20 million next offseason. That's not a real high risk bet. The only caveat being if the money is similar then all bets are off, but the White Sox have signed guys for similar money others were offering.

QUOTE (AustinIllini @ Feb 25, 2016 -> 06:14 PM) Addison Russell was among the best defensive shortstops in the game and a defensive difference make we haven't seen on the south side in forever. And you inexplicably exclude Bryant. Rizzo, Bryant, Russell, and Schwarber. All under 26. The Cubs would be good without free agent signings. Their lineup now is terrifying. How would the rotation look?

QUOTE (Hatchetman @ Feb 25, 2016 -> 06:30 PM) How can you blame Sox management for being a lousy organization that nobody wants to play for? We all know its the fans' fault that nobody wants to play here. Yeah nobody wants to play for the White Sox. It may be the beginning of spring training, but the whining is in mid season form.

QUOTE (shipps @ Feb 25, 2016 -> 05:30 PM) Love to see that they appear to be looking to draft a qb this draft. I wasnt sure they would make that a focus. I think it was Bill Polian who said if he had to do it over again he would draft a QB every year.

QUOTE (Balta1701 @ Feb 25, 2016 -> 01:53 PM) Like I said, that translated to an extra 1000 PAs against left handed pitching for the Rangers compared to the Marlins. That's like 27 extra full games of facing lefties during a season. I'd have never guessed teams could pull that off. The top 10 teams were all AL. I would take the AL averages and see how it compares. Of course the next to bottom was Detroit, a mostly RH line up. I think the answer is pretty simple. You want to limit LHP vs. Detroit, and maximize LHP vs. Texas.

QUOTE (VAfan @ Feb 25, 2016 -> 02:31 PM) I get the point about RF being a great place to target an upgrade, but all the ink devoted to it has been absurd. The Sox were worse at 3B, 2B, and DH last year, and offensively were also worse at SS and C. Plus, LF seriously underachieved, as did quite a few of the pitchers. Many of those positions were addressed. LF, there is reason to believe Melky will be better, and addressing another RF also in a way addresses the DH position.

QUOTE (LittleHurt05 @ Feb 25, 2016 -> 02:52 PM) If the Sox or Orioles had offered him 3/$35 with an opt out after one season, he's not on the Cubs today. Correct. But then you either have him for 1 year giving up the draft pick, or disaster happens and you are on the hook for 3. If there was no draft pick tied to him, he would have no problem getting an opt out after 1 year.

QUOTE (Knackattack @ Feb 25, 2016 -> 02:43 PM) I would imagine that if they trade a quality player like Coghlan for Aaron freakin Brooks they must have tried many other places and not found much interest. If Hahn had a guy like Coughlan and had to trade him for basically nothing, and his options were the Cubs or the Padres, and he picked the Cubs garbage over the Padres garbage, he would be crazy to do that. Coughlan, if he does do anything, has a far less chance to haunt Theo and the Cubs in Oakland than he does across town. Besides, we don't know what Hahn has in mind other than he does have something in mind. We should see what that is before being upset Chris Coughlan isn't a White Sox. There may be a time you should be upset he wasn't acquired for something useful, but not yet.

QUOTE (Balta1701 @ Feb 25, 2016 -> 02:40 PM) The trick is...I kinda buy that, but at the same time there's information here. If Fangraphs is hanging too much on the defense, then that also means the other pitchers weren't as strong as fangraphs put them either. So, if you're going to say it's all on Samardzija and he's a below-replacement player, as is said there, then Sale was a 3.3 WAR pitcher by the same standard, no where near an ace level season. I think reality remains somewhere in-between. Yes, he got rocked in August, but at the same time, if a guy is pitching for a team with a terrible offense, if he gives up 5 runs or 9 runs you lose either way. At the same time, he also got the team a fair number of wins in June and September and definitely helped keep them in the "we're still in this!!" mode that Hahn was in at the end of July last year. The defense isn't the same for every pitcher, and since a guy like Sale strikes out more guys, he isn't as defense dependent. Sale didn't have his best year either, but sometimes WAR numbers don't add up. To think that Shark's 2015 performance was really worth close to $20 million on the open market is IMO positively preposterous Batman. He went on a real hot streak before he got awful. Another problem was his 1st inning woes. It took any wind out of the sails on several occasions.

QUOTE (Balta1701 @ Feb 25, 2016 -> 02:29 PM) Just to note - by using the phrase "replacement level" you're indicating a stat that partially disagrees with your statement. Fangraphs clocked him at 2.7 WAR, which was exactly what he also put up in 2012 and 2013. B-R put him as worse than that I will also note - something I think is Fangraphs giving more of the credit for the terrible season to the defense and B-R saying the whole white sox pitching staff was weak last year (including Sale, FWIW). That's great, but he led the league in earned runs allowed, hits, homers and the defense was the problem has a big arrow pointing to his own defense. The fact is, the Sox defense was fine when after the All Star break, he decided to suck. It wasn't on Melky, or Avi, or anyone else. It was Shark. 14-18 in his starts which pencils out to about 71 wins in a 162 game schedule. He was awful. WAR isn't the end all. If the choice was a pitcher who gave up fewer runs or a pitcher with the higher WAR, I'll take the lower WAR every time. Replacing his 2015 performance, despite his WAR number, shouldn't be a tall task.

QUOTE (southsider2k5 @ Feb 25, 2016 -> 02:16 PM) One of the biggest things is that no one plays pick up game anymore. That's true. I grew up across the street from a long parkway. We "made" about 4 or 5 different fields, and every summer until HS would play from 9 AM until guys started getting yelled at to come in for dinner. Then we would go back out and play until it was too dark to see anything. My sister lives pretty close to there now, and says she hasn't seen anyone playing baseball on the parkway since I stopped playing.

QUOTE (Balta1701 @ Feb 25, 2016 -> 01:40 PM) Then that argues teams do a much better job of targeting your hitters with weak platoon splits than I would have imagined. I don't think it really has as much to do with rotations athough I suppose if for a team like the Rangers you could skip the 5th starter who throws RH and go all lefty, maybe they do that, but I think a lot of it as to do with bullpens. Managers love L/L, R/R match ups. If a team is mostly lefthanded, they are going to see more lefty pitching, and vice versa.

QUOTE (Balta1701 @ Feb 25, 2016 -> 01:21 PM) This prompted me to go take a look at some truly bizarre stat lines - team stats against LHP, sorted by "total plate appearances against LHP". The Rangers somehow faced lefties more than 200 PAs more than any other team in the big leagues. They saw almost double the number of LHP of any team in the bigs - 2200 PAs for them, 1300 PAs for the Marlins. The White Sox were 20th, about 1500 PAs against LHP. Interestingly, this was not the lowest number of PAs against lefties in the AL Central - the Tigers only faced 1350 lefties. Cleveland and KC came in #2 and #3 on total PAs against LHP and I'd wager the White Sox had some to do with that. Minnesota was 8th. Detroit though, how the hell? Look at their big hitters and see if they are LH or RH. That probably has a lot to do with it. The Rangers are really lefthanded. 1 or 2 a game adds up.

QUOTE (SoxSteve @ Feb 25, 2016 -> 01:19 PM) I'm happy Fowler signed with the Cubs rather than with Baltimore. The more good players not in the American League the better and i firmly believe the Cubs and their success on doing what their doing puts more pressure on Hahn and Kenny to make moves and put a better product on the field and try to keep the Sox relevant. As much as both teams always seem to downplay it, I agree with you. If the Cubs get better, it does cause the White Sox to be a little more aggressive.(As much as the current pursuit of an additional OF seems to squash that thought) Even Hawk agreed. On the other side of the coin, the attendance trophy suddenly wasn't good enough anymore when the Sox won it all.