witesoxfan

He's given the world herpes, so he may as well give it nausea too

QUOTE (NorthSideSox72 @ Dec 1, 2010 -> 07:08 AM) 6 years? Dye wasn't horrible defensively in 2005, he started to decline (IMO) in 2006, but didn't start becoming super-bad until 2007. It's kind of a ticky tack point, and the bottomline is that the Sox haven't had good defense in RF in a while, and I don't think they're too hellbent on improving defense out there any time soon. Beyond that, I think Quentin's still enough of a threat to be a huge middle of the order threat that it's not worth moving him when he only costs $5 mill. Basically, I don't believe that Carlos Quentin can be any worse, and I don't think the Sox are going to make a change based on his mediocrity in the outfield. I think he'll get atleast one more year, and if he does the same thing next year, then I don't think they will tender him a contract.

QUOTE (bschmaranz @ Dec 1, 2010 -> 01:41 AM) Yep, I think the Orioles are gonna throw a big number at a couple guys this offseason. Hell, I could see them doing something crazy like $60m/3 for Jeter. What is "How to set a franchise back by 5 years"?

QUOTE (Chisoxfn @ Nov 30, 2010 -> 10:22 PM) I'd be ok with Lee and Dunn. That depends on what Lee will sign for and you woudl have to deal Quentin which kind of stinks because you are selling low on him (I say you must move him because Dunn would have to be the DH and Quentin shouldn't play the OF regularly). White Sox fans should be used to having bad defense in RF by this point. We've had it for like the last 6 years. I don't think that his defense is going to be a factor in him getting moved, as bad as it is. If anything, it will simply be to free up some money because he is a player that is going to cost a fair share of money and is relatively easily moved.

QUOTE (Kenny Hates Prospects @ Nov 30, 2010 -> 01:32 AM) If you sign Dunn you can't play Q at DH, and Q in RF isn't working anymore. If you sign PK you can't play Viciedo at 1B, and you're not going to play him at 3B over Omar and Morel IMO. Assuming both are 3-year deals or longer, keeping Dayan doesn't make sense because you don't have a spot for him without attempting to convert him to an OF - something the Sox may be reluctant to do. BTW CQ isn't guaranteed offense. You know that, right? Even when he's healthy and on fire he's still prone to major slumps that seem to go on and on and on. For a guy who sucks at defense, that really hurts. If the idea is to make a charge in 2011 and then either reload or re-sign in 2012 depending on the outcome - and I think that's probably the plan here - then you may very well want to have a bit more confidence in your key offensive cogs. Especially when they're also taking up about $6M or so in payroll. And the last thing this team needs to do is trade pitching. Quentin had one of the worst years imaginable in RF last year, but they were never going to play him as the full-time DH to begin with considering that their belief that he is a bit of a nutjob when he has to sit down at all times. I would say that, odds are, Quentin will have a better, but still bad, year in RF next year and that he's going to come back just fine. You are also ruling out the possibility of Viciedo playing in the OF by labeling him as a 1B/3B. If Miguel Cabrera can play the OF (in the early part of his career), then Viciedo surely can as well. I also tend to doubt that Konerko gets 3 years, but it's obviously a possibility. I also disagree that Q isn't guaranteed offense. He will hit for power, and if he ever gets a bit of luck on balls in play, he's going to be just fine. His entire statistical year last year was aided by a 16 game stretch from mid to late June into the early part of July, heading into the All-Star Break. However, every year he's been with the White Sox, he's hit atleast 21 homers. He absolutely has flaws in his game...I recall that 3E8 showed at one point that Quentin generally hits balls early in the count, and when he gets late in the count, either likes to simply wait for the walk or he strikes out. If he is the #6 hitter, he's fine; if you are counting on him to hit 4th or 5th, then you're screwed. The Sox are not doing that. Beyond that, the Sox have 5 starting pitchers locked up to multi-million dollar deals, a guy in Pena who has shown that he can atleast go a few innings at a time and perhaps has the potential to be a backend of the rotation guy, and Sale who was drafted as a starter (though he will almost certainly end up in relief this year). On top of all of that, the Sox can look into signing a rubber arm starting pitcher to act as the 5th man too, so it's not as if they only have 1-2 starting pitchers. They have pitching depth, and trading one starting pitcher will not be taking from a position of strength and then making it a weakness - the rotation will be just fine in the end.

If nothing else, you have to appreciate a guy like Derek Anderson. What a dumbass question for the reporter to ask. Deuce went up to him, mentioned something funny that happened on the last play or on the drive or anything to take some of the edge off of a what is amounting to a tough loss, and they shared a laugh, and then ESPN probably caught the beginning, middle, and end of it. Kind of funny how these Monday night blowups seem to always happen to the Cardinals.

Of course it's being reported as a 10-year extension worth $157.75 mill to grab eyeballs, but it's really a 6 year extension worth $119 million. Gotta keep him healthy. Both Long Beach State boys are signed for a long time. Maybe the Rays can work out ANOTHER extension for Longoria!

I don't think these trade rumors really hold much ground anymore now that the Rockies resigned De La Rosa. They can simply go into next year with a rotation of Jimenez, De La Rosa, Chacin, Hammel, and Cook. No need to trade 2 young, team controlled players for a starting pitcher at this point in time.

QUOTE (Kenny Hates Prospects @ Nov 29, 2010 -> 11:16 PM) We should have the funds to do that but it would mean changes elsewhere. Like, Dunn + PK could mean Quentin is gone ($6M or so in arb?) and Viciedo ($2M IIRC) is used in a trade. Let's say we pick up a cheap RF or CF at the minimum plus we get a reliever at the minimum for Quentin + Viciedo, and say we get PK + Dunn at about $25M combined per season, then we've added about $18M to the payroll while addressing 1B (need area), DH and lefty bat (need area), OF defense (need area), and the bullpen (need area). That would probably cap the offseason minus a bad contract swap of FA bargain kind of thing. I really don't think you can justify making room for offense by getting rid of offense. If the Sox are going to free up money to bring in both Dunn and Konerko, then the Sox will trade a starting pitcher. Viciedo or Quentin are both certainly possibilities to be traded, but you can't trade both.

QUOTE (Kenny Hates Prospects @ Nov 29, 2010 -> 08:53 PM) The world does not revolve around OPS and FA contracts aren't given out simply because of a previous year's performance. Torrealba has put up good numbers the last two years, but that's in 605 total PA. AJ's career stands on its own. I don't understand how you can justify a player's future contract based on what he's done in his career when he's a catcher who is quite clearly coming off a down season. Oh, and if you don't believe that free agent contracts aren't given out simply because of a previous year's performance, I would like to see you justify the John Buck contract, as well as the contract Konerko will sign later and the one Aubrey Huff has already signed. Konerko was relatively mediocre in 2009, and Huff was flat out terrible. Further, if in the future you want to use the argument that Konerko found his fountain of youth at 34, so Pierzynski can too, it needs to be mentioned that Pierzynski is also a catcher who has over 11,000 innings of catching in his career. There are definite signs of breaking down, including the drop in power - it's possible that some of it was due to bad luck, as he hit a homer on only 5.8% of his flyballs, but it's also quite possible that he is not longer hitting the ball with much authority. He had a career high groundball rate last year and a career low line drive rate. Maybe that will revert back to his career norms next year, but I wouldn't have been willing to wager $7-8 million on that, and the White Sox weren't either. Which explains why the Padres had a higher average on the road this year too, especially considering that team that was comprised of primarily singles hitters (Gonzalez, Ludwick, and Scott Hairston notwithstanding). Or it's possible that the Rangers think he can be a good everyday catcher for them - the Rangers have done this before. They brought over Mark DeRosa from Atlanta, let him play full time in his second year with the team, and he responded very well for them. Taylor Teagarden is looking like a bust and they thought so highly of Max Ramirez - who was mediocre again this season - that they almost dealt him for an over the hill Mike Lowell. Torrealba has been in the league for 10 years, but he's only going to be 32 next year and he's caught less than half of the innings of AJ Pierzynski, and he's thrown out 30% of potential basestealers in his career, and threw out 37% last year. He would accept that because that is what he is worth. Torrealba is, perhaps, a slightly worse hitter than AJ at this point in their careers (and he might be just as good or better) and I have to imagine he's a better defensive catcher than AJ too. BTW, without AJ's ridiculous .333 average in the final two months of the season, he was hitting .231/.269/.343/.612. Hell, until August 18th, he was at .241/.277/.354/.631. I can cherry pick stats too, and without AJ having I don't know who AJ is going to be mentoring in Texas considering the quality of the catching depth the Rangers have - which is zilch. I'd actually say that's less of an indictment on AJ, but instead more of a thought by the Rangers that Torrealba was the better investment. I don't think there's any argument that the Buck was overpaid, but they Marlins will probably get an above average offensive catcher out of the whole deal, so I doubt they're worried. The point remains - AJ is going to be 34 next season and there aren't going to be many, if any, teams looking to sign him to be the starting catcher. I am most certainly not going to rule out his return, but it'll be closer to $3.5-5 mill per year than it will be $7, and the White Sox have, at the very least, saved $2-3.5 million by not offering him arbitration.

QUOTE (Kenny Hates Prospects @ Nov 29, 2010 -> 07:43 PM) Journeyman backup/platoon catcher Yorvit Torrealba gets $6.25M guaranteed over 2 years. Still think not offering arb to AJ was a dumb move, especially since the no draft pick cost will just raise his market price. Now the Sox risk goes up from a potential overpayment on a 1-year deal to a lesser overpayment on a 2-3 year deal. Maybe the SoxTalk sources are right and the Sox really don't want him back, and the no arb offer was meant as a nice gesture that will increase his next contract amount and also give them a good excuse for not bringing him back. If that's the case I'm not happy, and Kenny better have something better up his sleeve than Tyler Flowers. So a player who put up an OPS better than AJ did last year in a worse hitters environment who is generally considered to be a pretty good developer and handler of not only other young catchers but of young pitching staffs too gets less over a 2 year contract than AJ would have in a 1 year contract, and you still think NOT offering arbitration was a mistake? If anything, this pretty much confirms what the Sox and everyone else believed in that teams aren't going to spend out the wazoo to get mediocre catchers. If the Sox want AJ back, they can bring him back at the $7-8 mill over 2 years, and if he doesn't accept it, then they can find someone else. AJ is running out of options already considering the main two spots I figured he'd be interested in were Texas and Florida, and they both filled their vacancies almost immediately.

QUOTE (iamshack @ Nov 29, 2010 -> 06:10 PM) Yeah, I remember that being the case...but come on Wite, what do people remember about the Postseason? The big hits, the big defensive plays. Juan has a tendency to get some big hits in the Postseason. He did it for us in 05', and he certainly did it for the Giants last season, including the game winning sac fly in one game and a big home run in another. I remember big defense in the 2005 World Series, like game saving defense. I honestly don't remember any big hits of his, though he did hit well; I honestly didn't even remember that he hit that well. I'm not a big believe in clutch, but Uribe is clutch. He's just not a very good hitter otherwise.

QUOTE (iamshack @ Nov 29, 2010 -> 04:31 PM) He seems to shine in the Postseason. Being on the national stage and winning another title is probably what he meant. Uribe hit .149/.196/.277/.473 in the 2010 postseason. He did fairly well in big spots, hence a positive WPA, but it wasn't anything otherworldly.

This is Ed Wade we are talking about. He would gut the Pirates farm system for a major league outfielder, backup infielder, and 3 mediocre middle relievers and think he had a shot at competing. And then he'd probably get beat up by one of the 3 mediocre middle relievers.

QUOTE (Balta1701 @ Nov 29, 2010 -> 02:19 PM) It also removes them from possibly being in the running for the other veteran SS on the market. Orlando Cabrera?!

Maybe Boise State can join the Big East too!!!

All-nighter writing a 7-page research paper on Futurism's advocation of violence/Fascist beliefs. Fun to read about; dreadful to write about.

QUOTE (Jordan4life @ Nov 29, 2010 -> 03:31 AM) Phil Rogers felt the need to let the world know that the Red Sox are still very interested in Justin Upton and, um, well, that's it. I'm not even going to bother posting the link. Also, what do you do when you have dreams of getting sprayed by a skunk while running? Probably shouldn't go running

#1 - I think too much is being made of their home/road splits. Surely there is going to be SOME exaggeration in their overall numbers because Coors plays much better than the average park (or really, any park in the majors), but players (generally) struggle on the road and hit well at home. 2010 Home - .264/.334/.416/.750 Road - .251/.317/.390/.708 2009 Home - .267/.340/.430/.770 Road - .258/.326/.407/.733 2008 Home - .270/.341/.428/.769 Road - .258/.325/.405/.730 (I don't know if 560,199 plate appearances is a big enough sample size for you, but it works for me) Of course there will be instances where a player hits better on the road then at home, especially players on the San Diego Padres, but using a player's road splits to suggest that he's suddenly not a good player is very short-sighted. If that were the case, you guys would be crazy for wanting to give $12 mill a year to Paul Konerko when he put up a relatively mediocre .831 OPS on the road this year and has a career OPS on the road of .791 (compared to .920 at home). I would leave that out of the discussion. #2 - I don't think the original trade idea is nearly as lopsided as some have made it out to be. Gavin Floyd is quite clearly the best player in the deal, but he's proven to be slightly inconsistent and a bit injury prone. He is also only under team control for 3 more years. Mark Teahen has to be viewed as a player with negative value at this point simply because he's owed a decent amount of money and really doesn't have a position on the field. I think Escobar throws the value of the deal off slightly, but he's not suddenly a mammoth prospect because he had a good AFL - he's still a glove first, hoping and praying for a .700 OPS kind of prospect. Perhaps he can catapult this AFL into the development of his offensive game, but I tend to doubt that. Ian Stewart, even though he's arbitration eligible, is still under control for 4 more years, and he's still very talented (to the point where I think you can make comparisons to Carlos Quentin when the Sox acquired him, though that was obviously the exception to the rule and the Sox didn't give up Gavin Floyd to get him). Dexter Fowler is also under control for 4 more years, and he has the potential to be a very good player as well (and it's the one time I will say where having Juan Pierre may be a good thing for this club). When considering the flat out value of this potential deal, I think the Rockies come out ahead: they get 3 years of #2-3 starting pitcher at a very reasonable price, a good bat that can stand at several different spots on the field and mimic the act of playing defense, and an all-glove, no-bat prospect who has the potential to become a great-glove, some-bat prospect (though thinking again, all of Escobar's surplus value comes from the fact that he can play a ridiculous SS and his bat really won't hold up well anywhere else on the diamond; the Rockies have some guy named Tulowitzki at SS under team control through 2014. I think the Rockies would want a different player here), which is like 11 years of solid performance. However, the Sox get a guy in Stewart who they can play at pretty much any corner that they need (and some 2B if Beckham goes down too) and then a high ceiling guy in Fowler who runs really well and still hasn't fully developed as a hitter; those are two pretty damn valuable pieces and they will help complete good lineups in the future. I mean, I don't want to say those guys will completely develop into offensive superstars, but I think it's safe to say that both have All-Star potential and, at the very least, will provide competency in the lineup for the next 4 seasons. The point that I'm not sure has been considered enough in my skimming of the posts was the money exchanged. Stewart and Fowler will make roughly $1.75 mill combined next year, while Gavin Floyd and Mark Teahen make $9.75 mill combined. That frees up $8 mill for the Sox to make a few moves and potentially even retain Konerko, though if they went that route, they have an extra hitter on the major league roster (which I wouldn't mind in the least). #3 I figure I may as well start a new point for this one, since it kind of branches off a bit. The Sox lose one starting pitcher in this, a shortstop prospect who was probably never going to see the light of day with the Sox, and an overpaid version of Geoff Blum. They add two offensive pieces and $8 million in savings. Using any number of creative ideas, the Sox can: -sign Konerko and Dunn, which leaves them with (holds breath) Dunn, Konerko, Beckham, Ramirez, Morel, Stewart, Pierre, Fowler, Rios, Quentin, and Viciedo as players I would classify as, at the worst, competent major league hitters and, at the best, great major league hitters. That also doesn't include Vizquel (because he's a relatively mediocre offensive player and I think last year was a bit of a fluke, but he can atleast handle the bat) and doesn't include the catcher's position (where the Sox can then afford to go relatively cheap or perhaps signing a defensive whiz, because I think they are getting enough offense elsewhere). -sign Konerko and Dunn, and then trade a bat or two for a piece that Kenny really wants. I have absolutely no idea who that could be, but perhaps it's a prospect or two that Williams is enamored with (hehe) or another starting pitcher that he covets, or anything. -sign one of Konerko and Dunn and use the rest on filling out a dynamite bullpen. The Sox have 3 competent relievers at this point in time. Freeing up $8 million by trading Floyd probably forces either Sale or Pena into the rotation, or forces them to resign Garcia, so at worst they are down to 2 competent relievers. However, I think they can probably afford to add 2 relievers with $10-12 mill (adding anywhere from $2-4 million to the money currently saved). Perhaps Putz at 2 years, $12 mill ($6 both years) and then say Brian Fuentes at $2-4 million to act as the second lefty out of the pen (because god knows we don't want to go through the Randy experiment again). I barely scratched the surface of the potential that this deal opens up. #4 I'm sure there are a few things I missed, but I think I've dragged on long enough. I love Floyd, but I think this would be an absolutely fantastic deal for the Sox. I think there's quite a bit that can go wrong in this deal, and I don't think Escobar really has a ton of value to the Rockies (especially as an organization that really hasn't traded many prospects), so those kinks would have to be worked out in the deal. I think both teams would want one more piece from each other, and I think Chris Iannetta is a name that makes more sense for the White Sox opposed to Dexter Fowler (even though I like Fowler quite a bit), and I think Tyler Flowers probably has some value to the Rockies but not a ton and this and that and everything else - point being that I think these discussions could most certainly take place at the Winter Meetings. As someone else did mention though, if you trade Floyd, you better be damn sure you can lock up Danks. In fact, they should probably work on that before actually dealing Floyd, because if/when Floyd is dealt, Danks' adds leverage to negotiations and they have a more difficult time signing him to an extension or they flat out won't be able to agree to one, and that would not be good.

I assume CJ Wilson was an analyst on MLB Network or something, because I have no idea why he'd be talking about Konerko otherwise. Anyways, as much as Konerko has done for this franchise, I think Williams is pretty dead set on bringing in a left handed bat, and one has to imagine that it's Dunn. At that point, even if the Sox somehow had enough money to bring Konerko back, I'm not sure it would be financially responsible, considering that they still have a bullpen to fill out and only 3 solid relievers under contract (Sale, Santos, and Thornton). I have loved everything Konerko has done for the Sox, but it just feels like his time in a Sox uniform is done, atleast for now.

QUOTE (The Gooch @ Nov 29, 2010 -> 12:14 AM) Easily the best 2-9 team I have ever seen. Can't tell if it's sarcasm or not...I'm assuming it is...I honestly don't even think they're the best 2-9 team in the league, as I think Detroit is a better team, though I also doubt they are 2-9 at this point with a healthy Stafford. But beyond that, I expected them to be a monumental disaster and to go like 1-15, and the reasons ranged from their inability to lure a big name head coach to Buffalo to once again signing virtually nobody of impact in free agency to drafting a gadget player with the #9 pick to naming Edwards the starting QB in preseason and then cutting him like 3 weeks later to shuffling the running back touches like crazy and having no offensive consistency to the defense showing virtually no signs of adequacy...they've come a long ways. I'm not going to sit here and say that they need only one or two more pieces to be competitive, but there have been signs that they might not actually be the least competent franchise in the NFL. They need to build both lines up a bit more, add more pieces to the defense, and bring in a developmental signal caller (preferably before round 7 this time), but they aren't nearly as far away as I thought they were starting the year. QUOTE (iamshack @ Nov 29, 2010 -> 12:26 AM) Wow...what does that make the Vikings? Just a "bad" team? A great team led by a Hall of Fame quarterback!

He is amazing. Speaking of them, that has to be about the hardest 2-9 of all time. Their last 4 losses have been decided by a field goal or less, and they've lost 7 games by one score (and an 8th by 10 points, a game they were leading for a while against Jacksonville). On my drive back today, I caught about 3 minutes of the Vikings post game coverage, and the radio dude was talking about how the Vikings have the Bills coming up on the schedule and how the Bills are a "terrible team." Perhaps the Vikings will be playing inspired football in their first home game without Childress, but if they take the Bills lightly, they're gonna get steamrolled, because they are most certainly not a terrible team.

QUOTE (JPN366 @ Nov 23, 2010 -> 01:34 PM) Luis Rodriguez signed with the Mariners. FGs speculated that Luis Rodriguez might be this year's Andres Torres.

It'd probably be set in Communist Russia. The plot would revolve around how everyone is controlled by the government and they decide where these people work and what they do, but in the end, it turns out that the people themselves are the government and they choose where they end up. Oh, and the country is run by a zombie Stalin, and Waldis comes in at the end of the movie and kills him with a spear.

QUOTE (chw42 @ Nov 24, 2010 -> 02:46 PM) Both are in the same age range. Uehara's a pretty good dark horse option IMO. His numbers are very good, although when I look at that 58% FB%, something tells me there's something fishy going on. I'm seeing 66.3% at FG, but I wouldn't worry about that too much. Fact is, Uehara is a junkball reliever, but there is nothing wrong with that (unless you throw 83 like Shingo and can't locate your offspeed pitch, because then you get rocked). I haven't researched it too heavily yet, but I imagine that fastball has movement and then he has 3 other pitches he can feature too which all do very different things. I really wouldn't worry too much about fastball usage or that the velocity is low. I think he would be a fine addition to the Sox, especially if he could be had for around $4 mill or so.