caulfield12

QUOTE (LDF @ Nov 6, 2015 -> 10:57 AM) oh yeah ,..... but his result are of the nl i like the tor sp Estrada But almost all of his numbers were put up playing for the Angels in the AL West...

QUOTE (LDF @ Nov 6, 2015 -> 10:59 AM) that would be the best option, but i doubt the pitcher would like that. i just saw that lackey was given a QO..... dang. Lackey's 2015 is close to Shark's entire career in terms of war and related peripheral numbers.

QUOTE (Dick Allen @ Nov 6, 2015 -> 10:47 AM) Just put the Royals stuff in the proper place Royals boy. Right by the pictures you posted of their parade. It is funny, you weren't telling us teams need to hire a guy from the Braves and the Royals were building a great organization at any time before 2014. 8 years after Moore took the job. Then you hopped on the bandwagon, and they can do no wrong. Why weren't you telling us the White Sox needed to be like the Royals in 2010, 4 years into Moore's tenure? I did tell you Jeff Banister was going to do something good with the Rangers. The real answer is nobody really knew at that time...everything was risked on the Greinke and then Myers/Odorizzi for Shields/Davis trade. Just like the Cubs/Astros now recently, they had the best farm system that time, but so did the White Sox in 2000 when they were cruising to a title and how well did thst work out? Very few of those prospects other than Buehrle had anything to do with 2005, at any rate. It took the White Sox until midseason this year to name Nick Hostetler...so while I was a bit late, the White Sox didn't do any better, either.

On the other hand, if we want to put more pressure on China to continuing to use their capital reserves to shore up weaknesses in the yuan, we're winning that policy confrontation. Of course, in the end, a much lower RMB leads to trade wars, matching or competing devaluations in SE Asia and the further dumping of cheap/subsidized products on the rest of the world (see Sinosteel vs. Tata in England) to meet impossible government GDP growth targets of 6.5-7% for the next five years. Good for Wal-Mart customers, bad in general for fair and equitable world trade.

By that line of reasoning, KW should have a permanent seat as GM/president. It also discounts the incredible helpfulness of playing in two consecutive World Series/es for a fanbase. Those win numbers quoted, not unsurprisingly, don't include the postseason and 11 extra wins that perhaps are just a bit more important than regular season games. Consistent performance. Not part of the Sox history. If we got to the World Series again in 2006, we wouldn't now have to read hundreds of posts blaming White Sox fans for their current situation. We all should appreciate Ozzie, Cooper, Hahn and KW more for their contributions in 2004-2006. Got it. And we should also ignore one of the biggest media markets in the US vs. one of the smallest and compare them as if they should be on equal footing somehow.

QUOTE (Dick Allen @ Nov 6, 2015 -> 10:25 AM) KW's quotes about the Tigers being in a better position to compete were made in December of 2007. 2008 AL Central Champions were the White Sox. Turns out he was correct, and even in hindsight, your ripping the White Sox trumps the truth in your mind. But he was also quite wrong, because the addition of Miguel Cabrera (and our inability to counter Maybin/Miller at that time) tipped the balance of power in the AL Central permanently this past decade. We might have won the battle (more like survived) that particular year after Quentin went down, but all that accomplished in retrospect was pushing back the rebuild, subsequently adding Peavy, Rios and Dunn...how was he actually right because 2008 now and the Blackout Game far outweighs getting destroyed by the Rays and also 2011-12-13-14??? Okay...KW was right I guess.

QUOTE (KyYlE23 @ Nov 6, 2015 -> 10:20 AM) Oh, is that why you led with "if I were the Royals..." Because you know, that totally makes sense that you were examining it as a cross comparison to the white sox when you went on to talk about what the Royals should do in a thread you created about THE WHITE SOX OFFSEASON in a WHITE SOX MESSAGEBOARD. My bad in misunderstanding, here I was thinking you do it all the time And I've said the same exact thing here about the Twins, Indians, Tigers and Cubs as well. "If I were the...."

Because those are two more of the buy low pitching candidates available on the free agent market. Every White Sox fan in the world today would gladly trade six abysmal seasons (2007, 2009, 2011, 2013-2015) for having the best record in the AL over the span of three CONSECUTIVE seasons. As it is, we still won't be close to that latter accomplishment and it will be seven abysmal seasons out of the past ten without a playoff reappearance in sight based on every projection of how 2016 will play out.

QUOTE (KyYlE23 @ Nov 6, 2015 -> 09:58 AM) But that is not what you did. You randomly brought up the royals and what they are gonna do because you have a 10 second attention span that always circles back to THE ROYALS ARE THE BEST EVER AND EVERYONE MUST RECOGNIZE We know they won the f***ing World Series Caulfield. We know we know we know we know. Stop acting like they are the only team that ever accomplished that feat No, someone brought up Chris Young the outfielder and former Sox prospect vs. Chris Young the pitcher. I did the exact same thing with the Twins in the past, or the Tigers. In order to defeat one's enemy, you must know him/her better than you know yourself and study their ways. Maybe the White Sox deliberately remain oblivious to their competition (KW's quotes about the Tigers now being in a better position to compete with the White Sox serving as a sort of template), but I'd like to believe they are more forward thinking than that.

And we can just as easily look at the same records for the Cubs before Epstein joined the organization and that proves what exactly? Epstein is twice the GM because the Cubs got to the NLCS twice as fast? Looking at those numbers in isolation, you would think it wasn't Allard Baird operating the team for a long stretch under Glass with the smallest amount of resources of any team in baseball. Is the GM of the Dodgers suddenly stupid now because they didn't get to the NLCS with a $300 million payroll and two of the fve best pitchers in baseball whereas in TB he was a genius? All interesting questions, but none of them answer the current problem/s posed by the White Sox roster.

QUOTE (KyYlE23 @ Nov 6, 2015 -> 09:38 AM) Here caulfield, there is a place you can discuss Royals all day long and nobody will care http://www.scout.com/mlb/royals/forums/205...sas-city-royals So basically, if someone mentions Alex Gordon as an option for the White Sox and talks about the likelihood of his staying put, they should also have to go to that website as well? It's not a fair question to wonder what he's worth to either the Royals or the White Sox from the perspective of a veteran stopgap in the rotation?

Chris Young SHOULD get more than that, the pitcher, that is... If you look at his overall results over the last two years, and in light of his recent versatility demonstrated in the playoffs, he should be worth $15-20 million the next two, if not a bit higher. If I'm KC, you think long and hard about those numbers versus $10 million 2016 option for Kris Medlen and the very really possibility of his breaking down again after two TJ surgeries. Capuano's the only comparison there historically.

If nothing else, this shows there is a pretty high amount of uncertainty about EJ and Montas, combined with our knowledge of Cooper being able to work successfully with quite a few veteran starters (Shark and Paulino obviously went south). Does that also mean we believe a Latos, Fister, Kennedy, Estrada, Gallardo type could much more easily have their value/s maximized by the coaching staff compared to EJ, Montas, Beck, Danish, etc.? It doesn't speak too highly for our confidence level, unless there's an attendant belief Danks will also be gone well before season's end, opening up another spot at the back end OR the assumption of dealing Quintana for offensive help.

Denard Span, Asdrubal Cabrera, Rasmus, Byung ho Park, Brett Anderson, Gallardo, Estrada, Freese, Uribe...more names. Austin Jackson, maybe. Thought this was funny. In his eight seasons, spanning more than 991 innings, Samardzija has been worth just a couple more WAR than John Lackey was in 2015 alone. He might be the most overrated pitcher in the game, a confounding enigma of superlative stuff, encouraging peripheral stats, and disappointing seasons. On the bright side, it's unlikely that he'll get paid like a top-rotation pitcher, getting a deal more in line with his average career to date, and he still has the electric fastball to dream on. He would have been a disaster of a deal if he were a free agent last year, but he could be a hidden bargain if everyone forgets about him this year. http://www.sbnation.com/2015/11/4/9665970/...-2016-offseason

QUOTE (Chicago White Sox @ Nov 5, 2015 -> 08:56 PM) He's got a career wRC+ against RHP, that's pretty f***ing good. How much of that is from his earlier outlier season/s as opposed to 2013-2015? 2012-2014, and that's not including his injury-riddled 2015, he's at a 726 OPS vs. righties. So the next question is do you want for Alex Avila with his recent history (including numerous physical problems) to be the primary catcher? He is only 28 now and would be 29 on Opening Day. I'd gamble with that over Flowers, honestly. Plus he has the added motivation of proving the Tigers and his father wrong in their head-to-head match-ups, so there's that.

As I noted in the offseason thread: These moves would push out EJ, Montas (maybe pen or trade bait) and Webb, and Beck would probably join the trade collection as well. Bringing in Kendrick and keeping Ramirez would push Carlos Sanchez to super-utility or trade bait, and force Micah Johnson into that category since it's his only viable position other than DH. Saladino's status would be up in the air...waiting with Olt and Davidson for other moves to bump them. Thompson's role would be reduced OR they would have to trade Avisail Garcia.

So much for the Miller as Alexei Ramirez replacement idea...

This plan would push the White Sox payroll very close to $150 million. Would it even be a competitive roster with clear issues still lingering at 3B, starting catcher, SS, RF, DH and LF defensively, not to mention another LHR? .500ish? 83-85 wins? 85+? You could add guys like Fowler/Parra/Austin Jackson but they would cost more than Young/Pearce, and you could add someone like Iwakuma, but that would bump the payroll into the $160-165 range unless they were able to dump LaRoche and/or Danks (obviously neither would be easy). Likewise, Ian Desmond would push you up to that same range and it would probably be a minimum 3 year deal. Essentially, other than a massive payroll hike coming off a lackluster season, the only solution left is trading Quintana, a package of minor leaguers and/or Avi Garcia (also as part of a package).

QUOTE (Chicago White Sox @ Nov 5, 2015 -> 05:54 PM) Seriously, the endless Royals comments are already getting tiring and the offseason just started. I'm more than happy to praise the White Sox if they actually do something right. At this point, Flash Tizzle, myself and a few others have made our point/s. Now if we see these "the KC Royals are totally a product of LUCK" arguments, they had to be terrible for 30 years (when Moore took over as GM in 2006 and didn't draft anyone until 2007), they're ONLY a product of high draft picks for being so terrible in the last 15-20 years, then I'll be more than happy to rebut that.

Thought you would enjoy that word choice.

QUOTE (Dick Allen @ Nov 5, 2015 -> 05:07 PM) Why is Royals crap in this thread? Because the White Sox used to be capable of hitting on the type of moves that Schoenfeld outlined. They did it in 2004-05. As much as we see retorts of thirty years of losing and look at all those high draft picks, the Royals won largely because of the plethora of free agents they (cheaply, except for Rios) brought in over the last two seasons. Sure, they had their core, like the White Sox have now...but it had to be supplemented with the right mix of players. Why have the White Sox been complete failures in this category for the past decade? Why do we always seem to have the same recurring problems/issues with talent evaluation and/or scouting, forgetting for a moment the role of the coaching staff. http://www.wsj.com/articles/building-royal...?mod=rss_Sports But mostly just for Greg to get a kick out of an Alex Rios quote about winning it all in the Wall Street Journal of all places...revenge for all of his incorrect predictions this postseason.

QUOTE (BlackSox13 @ Nov 5, 2015 -> 04:44 PM) I think Cameron needs to pass booze over this way. All those players combine to add 42M to a payroll that supposedly stands at around 105M. For some reason I have a difficult time believing the SOX will jump from 119M to 147M. Put down the sauce Cameron. Depends on how you look at Alexei. Technically, it wouldn't be adding new spending there compared to 2015 since nearly everyone assumed they were going to keep him at $10 million. From another pov, that would be $43 million because you also have to include his buyout, too. His real cost would be $7 vs. $10 million. That's putting us closer to $150 million with the Royals still getting by at around $125-130 million. Pretty preposterous.

http://www.si.com/mlb/2015/10/24/royals-bl...-clinch-pennant Three poignant examples from Verducci of coaches/advance scouts winning the ALCS for KC against Toronto.

Worth noting that the Royals have attractive team options these next two seasons for Escobar (first two FA years). 2018 is going to be the beginning of their rebuild. Two year window left.

QUOTE (Dunt @ Nov 5, 2015 -> 04:13 PM) Dave Cameron's completely random speculation of our postseason: Undeterred by a pretty lousy 2015 season, the White Sox still seem to want to contend while they have Chris Sale and Jose Abreu locked up, so I’d expect another aggressive offseason from Rick Hahn this winter. Howie Kendrick would provide a substantial upgrade at second base, and at $48 million for three years, won’t entirely break the bank. Mat Latos on a one year deal for $10 million to work with Don Cooper and try to live up to his potential seems to make some sense, and then I’m also giving them Alex Avila and the outfielding Chris Young on 2/$10M deals to provide some depth that the team lacked a year ago, while Alexei Ramirez comes back for $6 million on a one year deal to bridge the gap to Tim Anderson.Undeterred by a pretty lousy 2015 season, the White Sox still seem to want to contend while they have Chris Sale and Jose Abreu locked up, so I’d expect another aggressive offseason from Rick Hahn this winter. Howie Kendrick would provide a substantial upgrade at second base, and at $48 million for three years, won’t entirely break the bank. Mat Latos on a one year deal for $10 million to work with Don Cooper and try to live up to his potential seems to make some sense, and then I’m also giving them Alex Avila and the outfielding Chris Young on 2/$10M deals to provide some depth that the team lacked a year ago, while Alexei Ramirez comes back for $6 million on a one year deal to bridge the gap to Tim Anderson. If that is our offseason, I will be busy doing a lot of camping next summer. There's a perfect example of $78 million in new spending that would get us where exactly? The net adds there would be in the neighborhood of $36 million for 2016. That's pushing payroll up in the $150 million range and beyond...and we know how unlikely dumping Danks and LaRoche is to happen before the season. You end up blocking Erik Johnson, Montas goes to the pen or is probably trade bait along with Beck and Webb, you have made a utility player out of Carlos Sanchez (one good thing) but you still have issues in the outfield, 3b and catcher that aren't going to be solved by Young or Avila, not to mention LaRoche's bat and Melky's defense. Trayce Thompson can play Young's part for close to minimum. Avila hasn't been healthy or productive offensively for 2-3 seasons now. Finally, Kendrick is declining even more in 2017 and 2018 when you really need him the most. The one plus is that it would give Tim Anderson a respected and experienced vet to pair with up the middle, but there's just no way Kendrick is worth that much money to a team with 3 young guys already there. So you've also doomed Micah to the trade bin as well. And therein lies the danger of doubling down with second and third tier players. Pick the wrong ones and we are definitely talking about Sale, Quintana and Abreu being traded after next season. They absolutely are banking on Rodon, Tim Anderson and Fulmer or this whole thing starts to unravel.