caulfield12

QUOTE (RockRaines @ Aug 19, 2014 -> 03:49 PM) My own eyes watching live footage, and I've repeatedly seen police trying to ask media members to do something rational like move back 3 feet and they completely ignore it over and over. I saw a camera man basically walk into the path of tear gas last night when warned for around 10 min that it was going to come. I dont trust their words, but I trust their pictures . Even that's not 100% trustworthy if it's taken out of context....or just showing PART of the picture, or it's not continuous footage, etc. For instance, I can watch looting/rioting for 10 minutes, but if I don't see anything that happened before or after, how can you assess it without your own preconceived biases kicking in on one side or the other? We had a debate for a week or so on the Tony Stewart footage, for example.

QUOTE (Jenksismyb**** @ Aug 19, 2014 -> 03:47 PM) But that's still not getting us anywhere. We still need to find out if Brown was running back towards Wilson. If Brown was running/moving away and Wilson missed him or just clipped him in the arm after he shouted "Freeze!", then Brown subsequently turned around and charged back towards Wilson, that's a very different scenario.

QUOTE (kitekrazy @ Aug 19, 2014 -> 03:06 PM) In some areas MLB tickets are up their with the NFL and NBA. That casual fan will opt for the latter. Probably for the Yankees and Red Sox. Definitely not the case in LA for the Angels or Dodgers, for example.

QUOTE (RockRaines @ Aug 19, 2014 -> 03:43 PM) Media reporting on why they did something wrong and were gassed is not a legit source. Who would you actually trust and believe to accurately report ON THE MEDIA...? Is such a thing possible in this day and age?

QUOTE (Jenksismyb**** @ Aug 19, 2014 -> 03:41 PM) Here's a decent breakdown of why the three witnesses' versions are a little questionable: http://www.breitbart.com/Big-Government/20.../hands-up-story And yes, it might make sense if he's a hot-headed moron, which he appears to be. He could have known the gun going off was accidental. And Brown also knew that instead of firing after him immediately when he ran away, Wilson was yelling at him to freeze. When you endanger the life of anyone, that person has the right to defend themselves. If you're that stupid that you want to assault someone with a gun, you need to be prepared to die as a result of a defending act. Yes, if Brown really ran away and was 35 feet away and was shot from that distance, then ok, that's not right and even though Brown is a moron, he's clearly outside of that zone of danger. But if he's facing Wilson and coming towards him for a second time, he's not a "victim" in any sense of the word. He got what was coming to him. It might as well be Matt Drudge or Fox News, lol. Breitbart.com and "Big Government" in the link of a story, c'mon, that's not going to be close to impartial, any more than CNBC anchors like Rachel Maddow or The Ed Show would be reliable sources for unbiased reporting.

QUOTE (illinilaw08 @ Aug 19, 2014 -> 03:37 PM) He might very well have been fleeing when he was shot AT. It's relevant if the first shot that was fired is while he's fleeing, but he isn't hit until he has turned around... That's why we need the ballistics report. Supposedly, Brown was shot 6 times. The weapon went off at least once when they were struggling over it (according to most witness accounts). How many shots were taken...and what was Michael Brown's initial position when the first shot was fired? Did the officer fire at him while he was fleeing/with his back turned, which might have surprised Brown and caused him to turn around, knowing he wasn't going to outrun a much smaller officer with a gun? It's not exactly a rational idea for someone to charge into a police officer's path of fire from 35 feet away unless something has precipitated the thought that this is the only course of action left remaining to survive...that running away wasn't an option.

QUOTE (RockRaines @ Aug 19, 2014 -> 03:27 PM) So what did those police do so differently? Why didnt the community decide that the cops were wrong and they needed to burn down local businesses? In the end, part of the reason things didn't blow up THAT night was because it was New Year's Eve and 2:15 a.m. in the morning (everyone was tired and going home) and because of the fact that the victim was pretty much isolated away from public viewing...at least from inside the subway cars from which they'd been taken for questioning and lined up inside the station. In this case, social media really didn't have a chance to disseminate the images right away...it wasn't until the following days the story picked up steam. In the St. Louis case, the first mistake (in my opinion) was leaving the body out on the street in plain view (without even being covered with a sheet for hours and hours. In Oscar Grant's case, he didn't die right away...he went into surgery in a local hospital and the story wasn't pieced together by the media until later. The Fruitvale Station situation wasn't on CNN and the lead story on the nightly news for 7-10 days...that's for sure. I even have my g/f in China asking me what is going on in the United States with this situation, and why can't the police control it? It's also clear the jury didn't completely believe the officer's account he thought he was pulling out a taser when the reality was he was drawing his service revolver. BART Police officers detained Oscar Grant and several other passengers on the platform at the Fruitvale BART Station. Officer Johannes Mehserle and another officer were restraining Grant, who was lying face down and allegedly resisting arrest.[4][5][6] Officer Mehserle stood and, according to his attorney, said: "Get back, I'm gonna Tase him."[7] Then Mehserle drew his gun and shot Grant once in the back. During his court testimony, Mehserle said that Grant then exclaimed, "You shot me!"[3][4][8] Grant was unarmed; he was pronounced dead the next morning at Highland Hospital in Oakland.[8] The events were captured on multiple digital video and cell phone cameras. The footage was disseminated to media outlets and to various websites, where it was watched millions of times.[9] The following days saw both peaceful and violent protests.[10] The shooting has been variously labeled an involuntary manslaughter and a summary execution.[11] On January 30, 2010, Alameda County prosecutors charged Mehserle with murder for the shooting. He resigned his position and pleaded not guilty. The trial began on June 10, 2010. Michael Rains, Mehserle's criminal defense attorney, argued that Mehserle mistakenly shot Grant with his pistol, intending to use his Taser when he saw Grant reaching for his waistband.[4][5] Pretrial filings argue that his client did not commit first-degree murder and asked a Los Angeles judge to instruct the jury to limit its deliberations to either second-degree murder or acquittal. On July 8, 2010, the jury returned its verdict: Mehserle was found guilty of involuntary manslaughter and not guilty of second-degree murder and voluntary manslaughter.[12] Initial protests against the ruling were peacefully organized; looting, arson, destruction of property, and small riots broke out after dark. Nearly 80 people were eventually arrested.[13][14] www.wikipedia.com

QUOTE (Jenksismyb**** @ Aug 19, 2014 -> 03:17 PM) Are these the same witnesses that said he was shot in the back as he was running away? Which doesn't seem likely now? He attacked a cop. He caused facial fractures. He's not some random victim of a cold-blooded killer cop. I don't care if he ran away, he's not the "victim" that he's being portrayed as. Link? Do we know that as a FACT now? Have the police reported this in one of their briefings or it's just a rumor flying around the internet now?

QUOTE (RockRaines @ Aug 19, 2014 -> 03:14 PM) Thats a hell of a jump. If I am walking through an area where there are riots and I dont listen to multiple warnings about gassing and then get gassed, then it would be more accurate to the scenario. If this whole situation was handled appropriately in the beginning, then there wouldn't have been any need for gassing anyone. Someone who knew the community intimately and had the respect of locals in the first hours after the incident would have done a lot more good than Officer Ron Johnson 3-4 days too late, when the situation was already bordering on being out of control. It has already reached the point where even if Officer Wilson is 100% cleared of wrong-doing or culpability, the story is going to be about the inappropriately militaristic response which totally exacerbated the situation instead of cooling things down, not the situation itself. There's a pretty good reason that every "questionable shooting" doesn't break out into mass rioting/chaos/anarchy/looting in the United States, the famous (or infamous) case of Fruitvale Station in SF being a prime example.

QUOTE (Jenksismyb**** @ Aug 19, 2014 -> 03:10 PM) Who cares about internal audits, i'm talking civil cases. There are a s*** ton of those and they are successful. Hell, I owe my job to my firm obtaining a 2.5 million dollar verdict in a police brutality case. And it wasn't even that strong of a case. Oh but you want to fire the incompetent cop too. Well, as i'm sure you're aware, they're fully unionized and those police unions are powerful sons of b****es, so good luck with that. While those types of cops out there exist, and they're mostly control freaks and assholes, you still bite your tongue and follow their instructions. And you do that because you know that it's just going to be a bigger pain in the ass if you speak up. My wife and I just had this happen to us over parking (standing) in a handicap spot for literally 5 seconds. I wanted to scream at the cop and get his badge number and raise hell for being an asshole about the whole thing. But ya know what, I didn't. And after 3 minutes he gave us a warning and let us go. And while I was pissed, it was done and over with and life moved on. Had I been an ass about it, it would have been 100 times worse i'm sure. So like telling your parents or your boss what's what, you close your mouth, you deal with it, and everyone moves on. That's how most civilized people operate. When you scream at cops and yell at cops and disobey orders, like parents or bosses, they get pissed and they'll lash out in response. Are your parents or boss receiving salaries based upon your taxes contributed to the government? There's a different standard at play here for private entities/corporations versus public servants, and it's something every policeman, firefighter, EMS worker or even teacher is well aware of when they choose to get into that line of work. Every teacher knows one false or fraudulent allegation from a student, even if unproven or dismissed, can ruin a career and make it nearly impossible to get another job.

QUOTE (StrangeSox @ Aug 19, 2014 -> 02:59 PM) This assumes that you can have faith in internal affairs audits or judicial proceedings in these sorts of cases. Didn't bmags post something about there never being a single officer-involved shooting ruled unjustified in Wisconsin, ever? You'd be surprised! But more to the point, it makes cops out to be dumb babies incapable of controlling their emotions. If you can't do your job without resorting to violence because someone argued with you or called you a racist, then find a new job. It goes beyond that. If/when the case goes to trial, there's going to be another disaster looming for Ferguson if they don't move the trial venue or change prosecutors. McCulloch has been the St. Louis County prosecutor for more than 20 years, and during that time has been involved with a support group called BackStoppers, which helps the families of police officers killed in the line of duty. The prosecutor’s father, Paul McCulloch, was a St. Louis police officer when he was gunned down July 2, 1964, at age 37 while trying to arrest a kidnapper. He had answered a call by an officer in need of assistance at a housing complex and died in a shootout. One of the shooters was wounded and was later convicted of murder. This is not the first time McCulloch’s objectivity has been questioned because of how his father died. In July 2000, questions were raised about his leading an investigation into two white police officers who fatally shot two black men. The two officers, undercover drug agents, shot Earl Murray and Ronald Beasley, both unarmed, on June 12, 2000, in the parking lot of a fast-food restaurant in the St. Louis suburb of Berkeley. A county grand jury declined to indict the officers; McCulloch said he agreed with the decision. “My father was killed many, many years ago, and it’s certainly not something you forget, but it’s certainly not something that clouds my judgment in looking at a case,” McCulloch told the St. Louis Post-Dispatch at the time. “It certainly makes you more aware of the severity of it.” www.washingtonpost.com

QUOTE (StrangeSox @ Aug 19, 2014 -> 09:46 AM) I've seen them arresting and assaulting journalists for being in a McDonalds. I've seen them tear-gassing journalists and disassembling their video equipment. I've seen them launching tear gas and smoke into neighborhoods. I've seen them aim loaded weapons at unarmed protesters. I've seen them arrest councilmen and refuse to give name or badge number. I've seen them threaten to shoot people. I've seen them use smoke and tear gas to break up 100% peaceful gatherings. I've seen them demand that all video recording be stopped. They also killed the power a couple of nights ago and used all of their night-vision goggles/equipment. Think that's going to freak some people out? This isn't Iraq or Afghanistan. They're not conducting covert operations in Abbotobad to draw out bin Laden.

QUOTE (chitownsportsfan @ Aug 19, 2014 -> 11:38 AM) De Aza is the backup CF in that scenario. Jordan Danks is the emergency CF and he'll be stashed in Charlotte in that scenario. If for some silly reason they bring Garcia back he's another body that can fill in out there. The problem is De Aza is going to be making around 4-6 million right? That's kinda pricey for a 4th OF. I think there is a decent chance he is traded around Christmas for bullpen arms or a Viciedo type another org has given up on. They're not going to offer him salary arbitration and put him into the $4.5-6.5 million range where he becomes virtually a lock to stick with the team for another full season even if he's only the 4th outfielder. That's not a good use of available resources, and then you're going to end up replacing him in 2015 so why not try to bring in someone who's going to be around for that 2016-2018 run?

A couple of things we do know about Reinsdorf: 1) He's loyal, sometimes to a fault 2) He prefers to have coaches from within the White Sox "family" if at all possible 3) He has the best record in hiring minorities in the game I think the vote against Manfred was more of a "we're losing the next generation of baseball fans, and Werner has a background in tv/media, therefore he "gets it" more than a consummate insider type like Manfred. It's partly about creative and envisioning how to market the game in the future, vs. continuing to do things the way they've been the last twenty years (and of course that's led to a $7 billion increase in revenues and team values, etc.). Because of the strike (which of course JR is accused of causing), lots of people in their thirties and forties now turned away from baseball to the NBA and more specifically football and NASCAR, along with golf due to Tiger Woods. How do you change and grow the game in the future with those now under 40 in mind, as the average age of an avid baseball fan is now up to 53. Also, how do you use technology to draw in those young people and continue to make the game relevant? I'm 44 and was 24 when the strike struck...I feel like 85% of the posters here are younger than me, so that provides some sense of hope for the future, but not everyone here goes to games and of course there's the attendance debate, pricing of tickets, concessions, souvenirs, parking, etc., no longer being affordable for "middle class" families. Finally, with the Dodgers and other teams starting to struggle mightily with monstrous t.v. packages, how can the new commissioner work to make sure there's not a decrease in franchise values...repairing some of the current situations like with the Dodgers and Astros, and continuing to increase the broadcast rights revenue pools. Then you have the issue with the fact that Manfred's unlikely to undo the All-Star game tie-breaker thing (because of his close relationship to Bud, not unlike the relationship JR and Bud had previously), which isn't logical and is only SLIGHTLY better than it alternating year by year.

http://www.murraychass.com/?p=7831 http://hardballtalk.nbcsports.com/2014/08/...count-the-ways/

For five of Cabrera's eight big league seasons, he's been a 1.2 or lower WAR player. He's even put up 2 or 3 NEGATIVE seasons, as recently as LAST YEAR. It can't be a coincidence that all of a sudden he's playing this well right around the time when the PEDS allegations hit? He's pretty much a completely different player. Can you say contract drive? That's almost never good news for the poor sucker team that comes in and signs a guy to a long-term deal and then gets stuck with his deal and an often diminished level of production. Finally, I don't see JR or Hahn taking the risk of bringing in someone with his history. Tyler Flowers was one thing, this is quite another. I would say that we would be better off hiring Toronto's hitting instructor to work with Steverson to revamp our entire minor league approach to hitting. You can't argue with the results that guys like Bautista, Edwin Encarnacion and Cabrera have put up in a Blue Jays uniform...even Rasmus last season. PASS.

QUOTE (greg775 @ Aug 18, 2014 -> 11:15 PM) BMags had a great line in this thread when he said: "But how good of a cop could you be if a jaywalking arrest turns into a dead kid? Surely there was some slip up along the way even if the kid was aggressively behaving." I agree wholeheartedly. My comment after watching live feeds tonight. The cops told the crowd to disperse again "or you will be arrested" after midnight and four guys knelt down refusing to move. Now what in the hell are they accomplishing by getting arrested?? Protests are fine, but go home and resume in the morning at the organized marches. They looked pretty young. If I were their parents I'd freak out and wouldn't bail them out. I mean what are the 4 accomplishing? There's no media in the cop station to interview them. The interviews are all old news now anyway.... Q: Why did you get arrested? A: "I want justice for Mike Brown." Obviously those 4 youngsters don't care that will be on their record that they got arrested for disturbing the peace or something. Very sad. It's like the kids were saying, "f*** you national guard. We are not leaving. Just arrest us." If I'm the national guard I say, "Fine. Cmon with us. Your jail accomodations will be waiting." That's accomplishing more than looting, stealing alcohol, shooting at the police or throwing Molotov cocktails.

Why won't he (Lindstrom) throw a fastball? It's like that portly RF/P Thibault on the Rhode Island team tonight in the 6th. Curve after curve after curve. Slider...slider...slider...slider...slider.

Who do you go with? Discuss.

Kendrys Morales is another good comparison for Ravelo power-wise...the average body of work, not his 1-2 outlier seasons. Well, there's Morales pre-injury and post-injury.

Surely we're always going to wonder if this incident would have happened without a police force that was 94.3% white patrolling a heavily minority area (at least 70%+ African American). I'm willing to admit Brown probably had some culpability, it might even be 60-70% if SOME of the accounts are too believed. It's also possible the officer got shook up or panicked because he SUPPOSEDLY almost was disarmed by this huge guy and the flight response isn't possible for a police officer, so the FIGHT response kicked in, as well as his target range training, assuming this is the first time he's fired his gun while on duty. The officer surely has to be thinking of different ways he could have handled this situation without ending up in the loss of human life...just like Tony Stewart's sitting at home having to live with his actions and his contribution to a tragedy. Perhaps he's not going to be held criminally negligent or responsible, but you can be sure the civil trial will go forward no matter what, and a not guilty verdict's going to be as hard to stomach for the local residents as the Trayvon Martin or Rodney King/Simi Valley cases. Fruitvale Station this isn't...but it's one in a long line of seemingly similar incidents that show we still have a LONG ways to go in terms of trust and communication not only between the police and their communities, but also between black and white people specifically. Not only that, but black people distrusting others "representing them" or trying to appease them (Uncle Tom's/sell outs) or make a name for themselves coming from the outside to exploit the situation to their own benefit.

QUOTE (greg775 @ Aug 18, 2014 -> 04:54 PM) I still kind of have to see it to believe it regarding the Royals actually winning the division. I guess it's possible. I can see Hosmer wrecking the chemistry when he returns and KC slumping. Will Detroit take advantage is the question? why? They'll just move Butler back to 1B and Ibanez would be more of a PH/role player. It's not like he's not ancient and hitting in the 100's. In fact, he might have more value providing veteran leadership on the bench than anything else, having gone through a number of pennant races in his career.

QUOTE (greg775 @ Aug 18, 2014 -> 04:49 PM) So after next season, Sox could get him for 4-5 million a year for 2 years? Theoretically, but by the tenor of his words, he's not going to stick around like Konerko did if he's not the same pitcher or close to the same as before. He's not going to hang on into his late 30's or early 40's like a Glavine or Moyer IMO. I think he really misses his family. Sure, every player SAYS that, but I'm going to be Mark in that top 10% that really mean it, have made all the money they need already and value time with family over money. And would be perfectly happy to stay at home, not missing being on the road for 4-4 1/2 months per year including spring training. I could see him retiring as a White Sox, like Thome did with the Indians.

QUOTE (Milkman delivers @ Aug 18, 2014 -> 04:42 PM) You sound so freaking dumb on this subject. Just give it up. And you sound so gung-ho to go into Ferguson and bring some good 'ol fashioned law and order...at least I presented some evidence that MIGHT exonerate the officer, if it was actually truthful. You aren't giving ANY benefit of the doubt, at all...

QUOTE (greg775 @ Aug 18, 2014 -> 04:39 PM) That's what I was thinking, how classy the people are who go to games. I wish Mark would come back. He still has several good years left with his rubber arm and style. How many years left on his current contract? Please come back! Like Paulie said he should be finishing his career on the South Side. Only $19 million next year. He's already admitted to hitting a wall and seems to be experiencing some physical/wear & tear issues for the first time in his career.