tray

So acquire position players that marginally improve the defense in order to marginally increase the future trade value of pitchers? Oh, I get it now...and I think it is contrived and asinine.

"2. They are seriously about defense to make all the short term tradable starting pitching assets look as good as possible." It is axiomatic that pitching is the first line of defense in mlb. Rhetorically, what purpose would it serve to have multiple gold glove level defenders signed primarily to have them shag baseballs hit off an inferior pitching staff ? IMO, Sox have incrementally improved after the subtraction of a few failed starters and relievers. OK, defense wasn't the best but a lot of games were lost last season in late innings by the bullpen. For those of us who watched a lot of games, recall how Sox hitters tried to stage comebacks in certain games only to see our relievers fail to hold leads over and again. A team can win a lot with great pitching, average defensive players, and some timely hitting which, to me anyway, has to include a lot of home runs. HR should be a priority, otherwise we will end up with a team that not only loses a lot, but is painfully boring to watch.

Counterpoints well taken. I didn't realize that AB had never played RF in the majors. Christ. What a great acquisition for 50 Million, a Left Fielder with almost no power and he is no speed demon out there either.

This we know - Hahn signed Benintendi for 50 Million in order to plug the RF spot since he is a good defender and decent LH hitter. He was only switched to RF to make way for Colas, who, in a short stint in the major league, could not make the grade. So now, Benintendi should go back to playing RF. Point is, any power hitting corner outfielder will work to compliment Benni. Sox need more HR next year despite the stated desire to make the team faster with improved defense. Further, pitching is the first line of defense in MLB so why trade Cease at all ? He seems like an ideal top of rotation starter who has durability. Stand pat as far as trades right now. When you are in a hole stop digging. Try adding some talent without giving up one of our best players for a change.

Your feelings/assessment of this player are valid on the surface but again, I have to counter with some examples that support a contrary conclusion about Eloy's value that go beyond his excellent career numbers. Eloy is at the prime of his career at 26 yrs old. But consider the net negative to our Chicago teams when players like Bobby Hull, Carlton Fisk, Ron Santo, and Mike Ditka were not kept in the fold. I am not equating those players with Eloy or Burger. However all of those star players had value to their respective teams and to this city that even exceeded their value on paper. More recently, trading Jake Burger, a beloved player that one could argue was injury prone after 2 Achilles injuries, was short sighted. Fans loved watching him come to the plate to see a 430 ft. bomb and his smile as he crossed the plate and entered the dugout. Getz should not be as foolish as his predecessor Mr Hahn. Everyone would prefer to win the WS every year but mlb teams are in the business of entertainment. That should be obvious when teams like the cubs are popular despite a long history of failure. I will go a step further with this thought. Perhaps Grifol is the wrong face for the organization. Maybe a Manager that has a bit of personality and flair would add to fan interest. Same should pertain to the replacement for Benetti. I'd like to see a homer in the booth. My 3 cents.

Counterpoint (after several posts to the contrary): Eloy is a rare talent...a monster at the plate. If he is removed from the middle of the WSox order you probably cede this season, and the next few to a rebuild and at the same time you diminish the prime years of Robert Jr.. Whenever you bring in a new player, you don't know what you will get and how he might fit in. Eloy is an asset in the clubhouse (including with Robert ) and with most of the fan base.. It is always exciting to see the big man with red gloves come up to bat at key moments of the game, including against the cubs. Sox traded Burger. Trading Eloy would be even more short-sighted and foolish. Now if you just don't like the guy, OK, keep trying to suggest trades that involve him and maybe one will get it done.

People go to see HR and wait for at bats by Robert, Eloy and Vaughn. IMO, it would be foolish to trade any of them, just like it was foolish to trade Burger because he brought excitement to the game with every at-bat he had. I believe that the Burger trade was the final straw that resulted in KW and Hahn being shown the door. Then there was signing Benintendi for 50 Mil while passing on Cody Bellinger on a shorter term deal. One stupid move after another.

No, JR and the Sox and for that matter, Ricketts and the Cubs are not cheap or foolish for not risking tremendous amounts of money on these mega player contracts (including betting .7 Billion on a soon to be 30 yr old Ohtani with 2 arm surgeries and 0 WS Titles ) In fact, more owners, including the perennial big players like the Yankees and Dodgers should do the same. MLB needs a salary cap of some sort to finally harness this issue and achieve some kind or parity and competitiveness. Fan complaints about which owners spends and which do not have become an old axe to grind every year. Here things have devolved into cruel posts with questionable motives about JR being "cheap" and even wishing for his passing. It really has gotten to be ridiculous.

If Reinsdorf's comments were reported (leaked) accurately, they look to be purposeful, inappropriate and untimely.

Nashville Mayor also has Jewish descent, is a progressive Democrat, and appears to have ideological views that are in line with some of Jerry's. Sounds like a good man from what I have read. Meanwhile, Sox aren't goin' nowhere and our fan base is strong. Don't take this dinner as something designed for cheap leverage or like paparazzi reporting of TayTay and Kelce. The Sox are already in a commanding contractual position with the Illinois Sports Facilities Authority and the City and they will stay right here. All of the consternation I read here seems to point to the necessity to add talent and try to compete rather than selling and trading off talent. I expect the Sox will spend on talent if the right deal comes along.

Jimmy Margalis had wondered (back in July) why Vaughn wasn't mentioned in trade talks, especially now that Getz wants to improve team speed and athleticism, and Vaughn is one of the slowest players in major league baseball and has built-in defensive limitations, which Margalis outlined pretty well in this article: https://soxmachine.com/2023/07/andrew-vaughn-still-oddly-outside-scope-of-white-sox-trade-talks/ I would add a similar sentiment about Oscar Colas whose upside/potential might be seen as more valuable to another team. He just could not adjust to major league pitching last season.

You evaluate him as a player based on his 162 game BA and HR average which is borderline elite level. You do not conflate reliance with anticipated time off moving forward because he will not be playing in the outfield. He should be fully rehabbed from his hamstring surgery, and his appendix was removed. Eloy does not want any more issues with the hamstring so he will do whatever he can in terms of stretching it out and warming up in the clubhouse between at-bats. Also, no more big final step at first base trying to leg out a single. I think we need his bat behind Robert and Vaughn in the middle of the order to remain competitive.

Baltimore, where Gavin's father played, would obviously would be the logical choice for Sheets to be traded for some minor league prospect. He can run faster than I thought after seeing him play RF in person but he is a big man that is probably not going to play outfield for any other team.

Jim Margulis said: "Jiménez isn’t particularly athletic, he doesn’t offer defensive value, and he hasn’t been able to provide a visually satisfying effort, and whether that’s due to frequent leg injuries or bad work habits is your call." Actually, Eloy is "particularly athletic' for a 6' 4" DH that can hit for average and power. He is a lifetime 162 game average .275 hitter / 33 HR. He does have speed on the bases. Sheets has too much swing and miss to be the DH, even on a platoon basis. Vaughn, only a year younger than Eloy, is substantially less athletic than Sheets, markedly slower, and likewise provides questionable defense at any position. Of the three, Eloy stands out as the best choice for DH. The "visually satisfying effort" comment strikes me as strange at best and at worst possibly carries with it some darker perceptions. Eloy had surgery to his hamstring, to his wrist and earlier this year, had his appendix removed. It is short sighted to add all those reasons together when evaluating Eloy as a player. IMO, the Margulis comments are really foolish but it is not the first time I found that guy to be way off base and at times, a bit strange.

Holmes is a cub fan and it increasingly looks like you are as well young man, which may explain why I am getting tired of reading your posts. The Sox fan base is deeply rooted, widespread, and here to stay.

I'm sick of maga Joe Ricketts, his sons and daughter and the Cubs in general.

Getz comment about possibly trading Eloy that "it has to make sense for both sides" indicates that he is probably shopping him around to see what he could get in return. I just don't see getting that excited about the middle of our line-up without Eloy's bat in there. He is a monster at 6' 4" with great bat speed, plate coverage, and bat to ball skill. The intangible that I see with Eloy is an Ernie Banks level love of the game and for Sox fans in the stands. I often call out "Eloy!" from the stands like I did with big bad Bobby Jenks, and a few others who seemed to thrive off of fan encouragement. Most mlb players are aloof and look like they are only playing for the money, not for the love of the game or to please fans. All that probably means nothing to Getz.

I think Cubs would love to trade for Eloy and that may be where the might Sox garner the biggest return for him. Either way, I agree with others that he is all but gone, in part because Getz does not have that many other players on the roster that other teams would even want (other than Robert and Cease, who are not going anywhere) and Getz wants to make a big splash trade. Getz also might think that Vaughn and/or Sheets can replace him at DH without any loss of offensive power in the current line-up. Good luck with that. Hey, Eloy is one of my favorite players, but these decisions aren't mine to make. Frankly, I think trading Eloy will prove to be a mistake, a really foolish short-sighted move for the franchise.

Bummer could not get the ball over the plate to start the 7th inning in a close game while Steve Stone just kept marveling at how great his stuff was. He made himself useless as a set-up man because of that.

As far as spending, time is money. It is life's final currency. Remain positive and don't waste your time trying to ruin it for others.

Trying to piss me off.

I didn't suggest an Eloy trade but think it would be a great idea... for the Cubs.

Eloy would look good in a Cubs jersey....kinda Ernie Banks , especially with his sweeping swing , his smile, involvement with fans in the stands, and desire to play and win.

I usually don't spend money on baseball in November. Relax.