I think long term you try to develop Collins. Flowers came a long way defensively in the Sox system. Until they are trying to compete, I don't think it is imperative they find a long term guy. When they are ready to win, it should mean they can carry an offensively challenged guy back there, so you find a veteran pitch framer who calls a good game. Catchers are hard to find, hard to develop, have a bust rate, but some come out of nowhere. I would hate the Sox not get big time value somewhere else and get smoked takimg on a mediocre catcher.

If we are doing this rebuilding thing I want Navarez to get most of the reps at Catcher to see if we might have something with him

 

Well, if we are going by that logic then they are probably going to run Avi out there again as well. I don't have a problem with it in what is FINALLY a rebuilding year. If they suck they suck and actually might help bring success by improving the draft pick. If they improve, f***ing great.

I think long term you try to develop Collins. Flowers came a long way defensively in the Sox system. Until they are trying to compete, I don't think it is imperative they find a long term guy. When they are ready to win, it should mean they can carry an offensively challenged guy back there, so you find a veteran pitch framer who calls a good game. Catchers are hard to find, hard to develop, have a bust rate, but some come out of nowhere. I would hate the Sox not get big time value somewhere else and get smoked takimg on a mediocre catcher.

 

As you said yourself, the chances Collins pans out are very slim. Maybe 1/10 as a catcher. It would behoove them to find someone in one of these trades that is much closer to MLB level or already at MLB level. Won't be cheap, for all the reasons you listed, but if they are rebuilding getting a solid catcher should be a high priority.

Well, if we are going by that logic then they are probably going to run Avi out there again as well. I don't have a problem with it in what is FINALLY a rebuilding year. If they suck they suck and actually might help bring success by improving the draft pick. If they improve, f***ing great.

 

Well no lol. Avi has had plenty of chances, Navarez has not

As you said yourself, the chances Collins pans out are very slim. Maybe 1/10 as a catcher. It would behoove them to find someone in one of these trades that is much closer to MLB level or already at MLB level. Won't be cheap, for all the reasons you listed, but if they are rebuilding getting a solid catcher should be a high priority.

I never said that. No one is going to trade you the next Buster Posey. I read a Fangraphs guy say Collins horrid AFL defensively can be blamed a lot on playing games since February. He has a long way to go, but has made strides in recent years, and is willing to work hard at it. John Orton works with Sox minor league catchers and made Flowers a decent defensive catcher when he basically had the same reputation as Collins both defensively and offensively. Flowers was going to move away from catching and be a big power OBP guy. IMO, he never was great defensively, but he usually called a good game and became a great framer. If Collins gets anywhere near there, he can catch a couple times a week at least.

Edited December 7, 20169 yr by Dick Allen

Well no lol. Avi has had plenty of chances, Navarez has not

 

I'm just saying if you're really committing to a rebuild then it makes sense to apply that same logic to guys like Avi. Same with Saladino, same with Sanchez. Yes Avi has failed but unless they have someone he's blocking (and they don't) then you just trot him out there and hope for the best.

 

If they were contending (like last Winter's moves indicated) then it would be stupid (like it was last year with Avi) but they aren't, things change. There's no downside to letting Avi trot out there for 300 more PA if he's not blocking anybody.

Ramos got $12.5 mill over 2 years with potential to make up to $18.5. I would have offered a bit more guaranteed money to get him in.

Ramos got $12.5 mill over 2 years with potential to make up to $18.5. I would have offered a bit more guaranteed money to get him in.

Eh, the problem with Ramos is that someone still has to catch for the first 1/2 of the season, so we still need a catcher somewhere else to go along with Narvaez.

Eh, the problem with Ramos is that someone still has to catch for the first 1/2 of the season, so we still need a catcher somewhere else to go along with Narvaez.

 

Ryan Hanigan on minor league deal. Or any other backup type.

Ryan Hanigan on minor league deal. Or any other backup type.

Great, do that anyway.

I'm just saying if you're really committing to a rebuild then it makes sense to apply that same logic to guys like Avi. Same with Saladino, same with Sanchez. Yes Avi has failed but unless they have someone he's blocking (and they don't) then you just trot him out there and hope for the best.

 

If they were contending (like last Winter's moves indicated) then it would be stupid (like it was last year with Avi) but they aren't, things change. There's no downside to letting Avi trot out there for 300 more PA if he's not blocking anybody.

 

If we don't trade Melky or Eaton I would expect Avi to start

Great, do that anyway.

 

Agreed.

Not trying to be mean but did you pay attention to MLB in the second half of the year? I don't blame you if you didnt. But he was one of the biggest stories in baseball. Highly doubt he's touchable after that.

watched very little baseball last year. mainly radio and at bat app feeds

Gross.

 

Horrible pitcher framer too.

 

Suggested for a one year stop gap. Worth noting.

Hundley is available, again, terrible framer.

 

Our offense will be a black hole but Pena's Defense is supposedly phenomenal.

watched very little baseball last year. mainly radio and at bat app feeds

 

Sanchez was a HUGE story. I was checked out and couldn't help but see his name everywhere. He put up some Ruthian like numbers for about 50 games, and it was for the Yankees so of course it got magnified every more.

Chris Widger is a free agent.

 

If 2017 will be a true rebuild year, why not sign Suzuki or Hanigan as a stopgap? Even if the Sox were able to acquire a catching prospect in another trade, my guess is that they would still need a placeholder for 2017.

Edited December 7, 20169 yr by pittshoganerkoff

If 2017 will be a true rebuild year, why not sign Suzuki or Hanigan as a stopgap? Even if the Sox were able to acquire a catching prospect in another trade, my guess is that they would still need a placeholder for 2017.

I mainly hate it because of the stories of how Rodon lost more strikes than any other pitcher. Need to get him his own catcher and those guys are terrible.

I mainly hate it because of the stories of how Rodon lost more strikes than any other pitcher. Need to get him his own catcher and those guys are terrible.

Wasnt Rodon raving about Narvaez's catching and game calling towards the end of the season?

Wasnt Rodon raving about Narvaez's catching and game calling towards the end of the season?

"He's not Navarro this is spectacular!!!"

"He's not Navarro this is spectacular!!!"

 

Narvaez did a pretty decent job during his 34 games at the big league level I thought. Probably not starting catcher material, but certainly could be a quality backup

 

He's only 24 years old as well, worth hanging onto. Collins should absolutely be developed as a catcher in the minors for a few more seasons.

 

Since we are going to suck the next few seasons anyway all we need is a serviceable defensive catcher.

 

Is Chris Ianetta available?

I figure it really doesn't matter during this rebuild. I fully expect an uninspiring stopgap. Wellington Castillo would be a nice grab though. Hope he rebuilds some value, and flip him at the deadline.

 

During the rebuild we should prioritizing a catcher that pitchers like throwing to as you try to develop young arms.

I say Wellington Castillo, or just bring back Avila. Let Narvaez get good playing time.

 

I do think the Sox will probably acquire a ML ready catcher in one of these deals though. Tom Murphy from the Rox or Pedro Severino from the Nats are two to keep an eye on.

"He's not Navarro this is spectacular!!!"

 

Good one dude!