From the Boston Globe: I think some sour grapes but the work ethic could be an issue unless that has changed

Moncada was promoted to the majors out of Double A the following season.

By then Moncada already had his own logo, a design combining his initials that he tattooed on his neck, embossed on the hood of several customized sports cars and silk-screened on the front of T-shirts. He was wearing one before the game on Friday.

The other(Red) Sox players found it more entertaining than anything else, a rookie showing off before he had accomplished anything. They were less amused when Moncada showed little interest in honing his craft. He routinely skipped optional batting practice and rarely sought the advice of veteran players.

 

https://www.bostonglobe.com/sports/redsox/2018/06/08/yoan-moncada-very-much-remains-work-progress-for-white-sox/dTJA94kUofR30VfxgSVbcN/story.html

He hasn’t been doing too well lately but man he sure has been the victim of some shoddy umpiring during that stretch.  I don’t see what the big deal is.  

 

A decent hot streak puts him well over 2 fWAR at the break.  Would that be so bad?

“I couldn't disagree more with anyone talking about his bat speed.

I say this with zero hyperbole but he reminds me so damn much of Manny (Ramirez). Even his outs are goddamn tremendous.

I had a discussion with some of the clubhouse people for Greenville (Sally League.) Their take was that he came onto the team with a bit of a chip on his shoulder and probably a feeling of superiority ('he was a prick'). The first few weeks humbled him quickly and to his credit (and to the credit of HC Darren Fenster) he turned it around almost on a dime.”

 

http://sonsofsamhorn.net/index.php?threads/yoan-moncada.9105/page-3

Some interesting observations here...concerns about the K’s, his trying to bulk up, his eventual defensive position...the scouting report is gone, but former Angels’ Scouting Director Tory Hernandez had him at 60 floor and 65 ceiling.

Edited June 12, 20187 yr by caulfield12

Disgusting Boston media.  Printing all that with zero attribution.  Reminds me of Cowley on Kris Dunn slacking because he did three sets instead of four when lifting.

 

 

10 minutes ago, Jerksticks said:

He hasn’t been doing too well lately but man he sure has been the victim of some shoddy umpiring during that stretch.  I don’t see what the big deal is.  

 

A decent hot streak puts him well over 2 fWAR at the break.  Would that be so bad?

No it wouldn't. I think most here would've taken a ~4 fWAR season as a result for Moncada prior to the season, and that would put him on that pace.

2 minutes ago, chitownsportsfan said:

Disgusting Boston media.  Printing all that with zero attribution.  Reminds me of Cowley on Kris Dunn slacking because he did three sets instead of four when lifting.

 

 

The same thing has happened to Adam Eaton over the course of his career...young players are always going to rub veterans the wrong way, especially when they have $63 million at age 19/20 instead of waiting until free agency like American-born players.

Of course, similar things were also said about fellow Cubans Cespedes and especially Puig.

5 minutes ago, Dam8610 said:

No it wouldn't. I think most here would've taken a ~4 fWAR season as a result for Moncada prior to the season, and that would put him on that pace.

Well, considering he was already at 1.6 fWAR weeks ago before the whole hamstring thing, ANYTHING seems a possible outcome with Moncada at this point in his career.

And, fwiw, Carlos Correa (and Lindor) were two of the very top group of prospects pre-Buxton.

 

Edited June 12, 20187 yr by caulfield12

Alex Spier of the Boston Globe i do like. He is really into stats almost to a fault at times. He did an inning in the broadcast booth w  the Red Sox announcers Friday night. He indicated that there is some concern regarding Moncada due to the hand/wrist injuries he has suffered. I wasn't aware he has had multiple problems.  He said that might be contributing to his problems from the right side. 

As I've probably already said in this thread, I'm just not that worried about him. I can't tell you what he'll do this week, and I can't tell you whether he'll be just adequate or great, but he's not going to flame out. I enjoy watching him because you know anything can happen each at bat. If this is him when he's bad, I can't wait to see what good looks like.

2 hours ago, caulfield12 said:

So how confident are you that Buxton and Moncada are 5+ fWAR players for the foreseeable future?

Buxton can put up a 2.5 on CF defense alone, but he has only done it once so far...

I have no idea what you're even talking about. You know, not every post/AB/pitch/inning needs a grandiose declaration. 

15 minutes ago, TaylorStSox said:

I have no idea what you're even talking about. You know, not every post/AB/pitch/inning needs a grandiose declaration. 

You didn’t like the post expressing concern/s about Moncada.

You are obviously unconcerned...based on what?  The fact that he now pretty much has to hit for the cycle tonight because this thread was bumped, allowing everyone to more safely jump back onto the bandwagon?

Why have gamethreads if not for hot takes, armchair managing and “grandiose declarations?”  

3 minutes ago, caulfield12 said:

You didn’t like the post expressing concern/s about Moncada.

You are obviously unconcerned...based on what?  The fact that he now pretty much has to hit for the cycle tonight because this thread was bumped, allowing everyone to more safely jump back onto the bandwagon?

Why have gamethreads if not for hot takes, armchair managing and “grandiose declarations?”  

I figured you would have learned your lesson after the Puig hype.

 

The original post I replied to was nonsensical. Does it worry me that a rookie hasn't had multiple 5+ WAR seasons? No Caufield, it doesn't worry me. 

I just wish Ron or greg had started this thread.

1 minute ago, southsider2k5 said:

I just wish Ron or greg had started this thread.

I started the Covey thread, and he is proving my observation/prediction correct. Covey has been wheeling and dealing

16 minutes ago, southsider2k5 said:

I just wish Ron or greg had started this thread.

Moncada would be on pace for 20 fWAR if Ron started talking badly about him.

Well, I quickly jumped on board the Covey, Madrigal and Tatis, Jr., bandwagons.  Will see how those work out.

Ohtani and Puig, the results have been mixed, at best.  Obviously, there was concern from the very beginning about his elbow ligaments before the Angels signed him, so we'll just have to wait and see what happens.

Puig has been worth 15.6 fWAR over about 5 seasons, so that works out to a 3.1 fWAR average.  Still a HUGE step down from the 4.75 promise of his 2013-14 seasons. 

I think a 3.5-4.0 fWAR is a reasonable expectation for Moncada, right?

 

 

And the deluge begins...notice I picked a day when Moncada was facing a favorable match-up against a pitcher he looked good against in CLE, haha?

Edited June 13, 20187 yr by caulfield12

He homered.. he’s fine. Until the next time he struggles 

It should be noted that just mentioning Moncada caused not only one homer tonight, but Puig has also gone 2/3 (2B and HR) to raise his OPS for the season all the way up to .795 after a terrible start to the season (12-3 Dodgers, BOT 6th).

 

4 hours ago, EvilJester99 said:

He homered.. he’s fine. Until the next time he struggles 

He'll be a bust again with his next strike out so let's enjoy the moment, for however long it lasts.

6 hours ago, BlackSox13 said:

He'll be a bust again with his next strike out so let's enjoy the moment, for however long it lasts.

Well, he did strike out in 2 of 3 at-bats following the homer...actually, he and Tim with nearly identical OPS, 725 vs. 722.

I think it would worry me more if a 23 year-old top prospect's game was at its peak at age 23.  The guy's a star now with so many ways to improve.  

Edited June 13, 20187 yr by FT35

22 minutes ago, FT35 said:

I think it would worry me more if a 23 year-old top prospect's game was at its peak at age 23.  The guy's a star now with so many ways to improve.  

uhhhhhhh That's the most backwords thing I've ever read...  "I'd be more worried if he was good right now"

55 minutes ago, FT35 said:

I think it would worry me more if a 23 year-old top prospect's game was at its peak at age 23.  The guy's a star now with so many ways to improve.  

He's not a star right now.

 

15 hours ago, Jake said:

As I've probably already said in this thread, I'm just not that worried about him. I can't tell you what he'll do this week, and I can't tell you whether he'll be just adequate or great, but he's not going to flame out. I enjoy watching him because you know anything can happen each at bat. If this is him when he's bad, I can't wait to see what good looks like.

I know the difference between great, adequate, and "flame out" and I can tell you that in the case of Moncada, if he's adequate, for me he would have flamed out.

 

15 hours ago, SCCWS said:

Alex Spier of the Boston Globe i do like. He is really into stats almost to a fault at times. He did an inning in the broadcast booth w  the Red Sox announcers Friday night. He indicated that there is some concern regarding Moncada due to the hand/wrist injuries he has suffered. I wasn't aware he has had multiple problems.  He said that might be contributing to his problems from the right side. 

I hope not. He is, as Hawk would say, a "bundle of talent" and you hate to see those careers ruined by a multitude of small injuries.

55 minutes ago, cjgalloway said:

uhhhhhhh That's the most backwords thing I've ever read...  "I'd be more worried if he was good right now"

Say what?  That's the most backwards way of interpreting that I've ever heard!  Who implied what you said?  Who said he wasn't good now?  Go back and read the post...the little words are the big words...the 4 letter word that looks like "peak" is the key word to focus on.  With that in mind, now go back and read it while thinking of what the word peak means.  Now apply that comment.  Would you want a player's development to peak at age 23 then be all downhill from there or be strong at 23 and continue to improve??   Would it worry you more to see him go through a rough patch now or if someone said we have seen the best from Moncada already and then if Moncada followed that downward trajectory (away from his peak) from here on out?  

Edited June 13, 20187 yr by FT35