3 minutes ago, Look at Ray Ray Run said:

You said hes bad against good competition. Show me that.

Or Vaughn is a historically good bat prospect. You ever think of that?

It doesn't matter how good his bat is in college because he is a 1B/DH. Those guys are a dime a dozen. You don't waste a top 3 pick on one of those unless you think he's a slam dunk HOF player. If they take Vaughn 3rd, he better hit .300 with 30 bombs every year. 

Edited June 2, 20196 yr by Jack Parkman

1 minute ago, Jack Parkman said:

It doesn't matter how good his bat is in college because he is a 1B/DH. Those guys are a dime a dozen. You don't waste a top 3 pick on one of those unless you think he's a slam dunk HOF player. If they take Vaughn 3rd anything less than induction into Cooperstown is a failure. 

So Vaughn has to be a hofer or hes a failure but other guys can be less? Wtf.

Jack, calling vaughns bat a dime a dozen just shows your lack of knowledge on vaughn.

2 minutes ago, Lillian said:

How much money could the Sox save, by taking Baty and how might they employ those dollars, for other selections, in this Draft?

Well he was going to go underslot at #8 and if he were going just on talent he would probably go late teens to early 20s. Slot at #8 is ~$5.175mm and slot at the higher end of where he could go otherwise is ~$3.75mm for #16. So if he was agreeing to an underslot deal at #8, it was probably between $4mm and $4.5mm. So if we say it was $4.25mm, that would save us ~$3mm, which combined with the 5% overage would give us an extra $3.5mm for overslot deals the rest of the draft. Adding half of that amount to our second pick would give the same amount as an early 20s slot. So this strategy could end up getting us two of the top 20 or 25 guys in the draft while still having some left for guys after round 10.

4 minutes ago, Jack Parkman said:

If they take Vaughn 3rd, he better hit .300 with 30 bombs every year. 

This is exactly what he projects to do. Law has him the top 25 prospects in baseball upon being drafted. I think you are severely underselling him.

1 minute ago, DirtySox said:

This is exactly what he projects to do. Law has him the top 25 prospects in baseball upon being drafted. I think you are severely underselling him.

A righty 1B is the type of player that KLaw hates. For him to be so high on him, it must be a special bat.

7 minutes ago, Look at Ray Ray Run said:

You said hes bad against good competition. Show me that.

Or Vaughn is a historically good bat prospect. You ever think of that?

As I've said, I like Vaughn and would be happy with the pick but he has struggled at times. He went 1 for 10 over 3 game series vs. LSU and came right back with 1 for 9 in 3 games vs. OSU among other unremarkable performances. 

Just now, fathom said:

A righty 1B is the type of player that KLaw hates. For him to be so high on him, it must be a special bat.

Jack has been making up nonsense about Vaughn the entire thread. Not sure why.

Just now, Flash said:

As I've said, I like Vaughn and would be happy with the pick but he has struggled at times. He went 1 for 10 over 3 game series vs. LSU and came right back with 1 for 9 in 3 games vs. OSU among other unremarkable performances. 

Are you seriously citing a 10 at bat sample?

2 minutes ago, Look at Ray Ray Run said:

Are you seriously citing a 10 at bat sample?

I cited a 6 game stretch where he was 1-19 because you are making erroneous  statements to support your opinions. Like I said, I like Vaughn but at times, he has been less than 'generational' this year.   

11 minutes ago, GenericUserName said:

Well he was going to go underslot at #8 and if he were going just on talent he would probably go late teens to early 20s. Slot at #8 is ~$5.175mm and slot at the higher end of where he could go otherwise is ~$3.75mm for #16. So if he was agreeing to an underslot deal at #8, it was probably between $4mm and $4.5mm. So if we say it was $4.25mm, that would save us ~$3mm, which combined with the 5% overage would give us an extra $3.5mm for overslot deals the rest of the draft. Adding half of that amount to our second pick would give the same amount as an early 20s slot. So this strategy could end up getting us two of the top 20 or 25 guys in the draft while still having some left for guys after round 10.

In the absense of a consensus 'can't miss' future all-star, the strategy above would be extremally smart.

4 minutes ago, Flash said:

I cited a 6 game stretch where he was 1-19 because you are making erroneous  statements to support your opinions. Like I said, I like Vaughn but at times, he has been less than 'generational' this year.   

Thanks flash 

4 minutes ago, Flash said:

In the absense of a consensus 'can't miss' future all-star, the strategy above would be extremally smart.

Disagree. Seems like a strategy that could blow up badly in your face. Just take the best player available at #3 and don't try to get cute or outsmart yourself. 

Just now, OneDog847 said:

Disagree. Seems like a strategy that could blow up badly in your face. Just take the best player available at #3 and don't try to get cute or outsmart yourself. 

That might work if there was consensus on 'best player'

6 minutes ago, Flash said:

That might work if there was consensus on 'best player'

Most have the big 3 at a higher tier than everyone else 

40 minutes ago, Look at Ray Ray Run said:

So Vaughn has to be a hofer or hes a failure but other guys can be less? Wtf.

Jack, calling vaughns bat a dime a dozen just shows your lack of knowledge on vaughn.

A 2 win 1B has an OPS+ of 135. 100 is MLB average. He has to be 35%  better than the average hitter just to be an average 1B. 

May I remind everyone of Matt LaPorta? He was a LH bat too. There is a reason 1B don't go top 15. 

Edited June 2, 20196 yr by Jack Parkman

On 5/30/2019 at 6:02 PM, Jack Parkman said:

Good read

https://www.theringer.com/mlb/2019/5/30/18645138/mlb-draft-andrew-vaughn-first-baseman-cal

Read this article. It explains why you shouldn't pick 1B in the top 10. 

There hasn't been a RH 1B taken in the top 10 in 30 years, and the last one was a massive bust. 

Edited June 2, 20196 yr by Jack Parkman

1 minute ago, fathom said:

Most have the big 3 at a higher tier than everyone else 

Except for those who like Bleday or Abrams.

I think the marginal difference in potential value for Sox options (assuming Witt and Adley are gone) supports using underslot savings to float a strong prospect to second and/or 3rd picks

2 minutes ago, Flash said:

Except for those who like Bleday or Abrams.

I think the marginal difference in potential value for Sox options (assuming Witt and Adley are gone) supports using underslot savings to float a strong prospect to second and/or 3rd picks

Doesn’t it bug you that there are rumors none of the other 5 teams picking in the top 6 view Abrams as not worthy of their pick?

3 minutes ago, Flash said:

Except for those who like Bleday or Abrams.

I think the marginal difference in potential value for Sox options (assuming Witt and Adley are gone) supports using underslot savings to float a strong prospect to second and/or 3rd picks

Agreed. After Rutschman and Witt there isn't much to be excited about. Take a guy you like for underslot and go spend money later in the draft. 

1 minute ago, fathom said:

Doesn’t it bug you that there are rumors none of the other 5 teams picking in the top 6 view Abrams as not worthy of their pick?

Yes. But I'd still rather him than Vaughn. 

1 minute ago, fathom said:

Doesn’t it bug you that there are rumors none of the other 5 teams picking in the top 6 view Abrams as not worthy of their pick?

Yes. I agree with them but there are others, possibly KW, who apparantly disagree. 

14 minutes ago, Jack Parkman said:

A 2 win 1B has an OPS+ of 135. 100 is MLB average. He has to be 35%  better than the average hitter just to be an average 1B. 

May I remind everyone of Matt LaPorta? He was a LH bat too. There is a reason 1B don't go top 15. 

Since Reinsdorf has owned the Sox , who was the best player they drafted, and what position did he play? I am glad some other teams got caught up in the he can onky play 1B and decided to get cute. Even the Braves messed up.

8 minutes ago, Dick Allen said:

Since Reinsdorf has owned the Sox , who was the best player they drafted, and what position did he play? I am glad some other teams got caught up in the he can onky play 1B and decided to get cute. Even the Braves messed up.

I don't think that Vaughn will be anything close to Frank Thomas. Hurt was in Ted Williams company for a decade. No way in hell you get two of them. No way. 

30 minutes ago, Jack Parkman said:

Read this article. It explains why you shouldn't pick 1B in the top 10. 

There hasn't been a RH 1B taken in the top 10 in 30 years, and the last one was a massive bust. 

Jack, I understand where you're coming from, but this isn't exactly accurate.

29 years ago Marc Newfield was picked #4 out of high school as a first baseman and immediately moved to the outfield.

30 years ago we took the greatest hitter in franchise history at #7.

7 minutes ago, Quin said:

Jack, I understand where you're coming from, but this isn't exactly accurate.

29 years ago Marc Newfield was picked #4 out of high school as a first baseman and immediately moved to the outfield.

30 years ago we took the greatest hitter in franchise history at #7.

Frank was the last one. If you're not getting Frank Thomas, it's not worth it. That's my point. 

Edited June 2, 20196 yr by Jack Parkman