On 6/4/2019 at 6:28 PM, Jack Parkman said:

This is a valid point, and I tend to agree. Instead of signing Keuchel, they should be looking for young, controllable rotation pieces that don't fit the window of rebuilding teams, that could be semi cheap. Also, I'd look for guys with a track record of success coming off of TJS that are still controllable for a couple years on rebuilding teams. Bring up Cease and Robert, and let's fucking go!

I agree.  The horse has left the barn on Keuchel.

3 minutes ago, poppysox said:

I agree.  The horse has left the barn on Keuchel.

He wants a one year deal or a multiple with an opt out after this season. Neither would make sense for the White Sox, but if he is willing to sign for 3 with no opt out, why not?

Keuchel just signed with the Braves. JR + Hahn are not going to sign any premium free agents. This so called rebuild is going to be done as cheaply as possible. Hopefully the White Sox farm system will produce enough good players and this team can start winning again sometime in the near future.

6 minutes ago, WBWSF said:

Keuchel just signed with the Braves. JR + Hahn are not going to sign any premium free agents. This so called rebuild is going to be done as cheaply as possible. Hopefully the White Sox farm system will produce enough good players and this team can start winning again sometime in the near future.

The crazy thing is that they may have amassed enough talent to pull it off. 

11 minutes ago, WBWSF said:

Keuchel just signed with the Braves. JR + Hahn are not going to sign any premium free agents. This so called rebuild is going to be done as cheaply as possible. Hopefully the White Sox farm system will produce enough good players and this team can start winning again sometime in the near future.

The Twins have shown you can win without signing premium free agents and finding solid mid tier talent. The problem is Hahn is not good at finding the mid tier talent like the Twins have found. 

Edited June 7, 20196 yr by HoosierSox

22 minutes ago, WBWSF said:

Keuchel just signed with the Braves. JR + Hahn are not going to sign any premium free agents. This so called rebuild is going to be done as cheaply as possible. Hopefully the White Sox farm system will produce enough good players and this team can start winning again sometime in the near future.

Good lord. They didn't give a 30+ year old SP $13 million for a year where they have no chance again. Calm down.

13 minutes ago, HoosierSox said:

The Twins have shown you can win without signing premium free agents and finding solid mid tier talent. The problem is Hahn is not good at finding the mid tier talent like the Twins have found. 

Mid tier talent is what we need.  Two mid tier starters and a Dye type right fielder.  We have elite covered pretty well...and really need some playing time together as Robert, Madrigal, Cease and Kopech adjust to the league and recuperation.  Note:  I'm not saying elite players wouldn't be ideal.

22 minutes ago, HoosierSox said:

The Twins have shown you can win without signing premium free agents and finding solid mid tier talent. The problem is Hahn is not good at finding the mid tier talent like the Twins have found. 

What do you mean?   He found John Jay, Ervin Santana and Yonder Alonso this year.

One year, 13 mil with the Braves. I'm glad the Sox didn't sign him for just this year.

The Braves can certainly benefit this year.

1 hour ago, ptatc said:

One year, 13 mil with the Braves. I'm glad the Sox didn't sign him for just this year.

The Braves can certainly benefit this year.

Yeah, Hahn already wasted enough money on garbage like Nova ($9M), Alonso ($9M), Herrera (2-years / $18M), Jay ($4M), and whatever they had to pay Santana to leave after 3 starts.  Jesus, that’s $40M+ total wasted in one offseason.

But Keuchel at 1-year / $13M for the Braves is a nice deal.

Hopefully, Hahn will learn from this going forward, start signing difference makers over veteran has-been’s, and improve on his FA signings.  But I sincerely doubt it.

Edited June 7, 20196 yr by Moan4Yoan

2 hours ago, WBWSF said:

Keuchel just signed with the Braves. JR + Hahn are not going to sign any premium free agents. This so called rebuild is going to be done as cheaply as possible. Hopefully the White Sox farm system will produce enough good players and this team can start winning again sometime in the near future.

Unless you're just chugging the White Sox 2019 Wild Card Kool-Aid, I fail to see the issue here.

It takes two to tango. I imagine Keuchel barely thought of the White Sox as a destination this year. Braves and Yankees were the rumored final destination. Both teams made the playoffs the previous year and are firmly in contention to make runs again this year. 

The White Sox are not. Keuchel improves a woefully thin rotation, but not by much. Suddenly you go from 1 reliable arm, to perhaps 2 (assuming that Keuchel just picks everything up after missing 2 months of baseball). 

Perhaps a year from now if the Sox are firmly in the midst of a quality playoff run, then we can get made if Hahn can't land a Keuchel-esque FA. 

12 minutes ago, Dan of Steel said:

Unless you're just chugging the White Sox 2019 Wild Card Kool-Aid, I fail to see the issue here.

It takes two to tango. I imagine Keuchel barely thought of the White Sox as a destination this year. Braves and Yankees were the rumored final destination. Both teams made the playoffs the previous year and are firmly in contention to make runs again this year. 

The White Sox are not. Keuchel improves a woefully thin rotation, but not by much. Suddenly you go from 1 reliable arm, to perhaps 2 (assuming that Keuchel just picks everything up after missing 2 months of baseball). 

Perhaps a year from now if the Sox are firmly in the midst of a quality playoff run, then we can get made if Hahn can't land a Keuchel-esque FA. 

The Sox are obviously going cheap on this rebuild.  No big or top FA’s will be signed.  I don’t think this should be a surprise to anyone at this point.

Imagine actually being mad the Sox didn't sign Keuchel in the year of our Lord 2019.

 

YIKES

2 hours ago, Moan4Yoan said:

Yeah, Hahn already wasted enough money on garbage like Nova ($9M), Alonso ($9M), Herrera (2-years / $18M), Jay ($4M), and whatever they had to pay Santana to leave after 3 starts.  Jesus, that’s $40M+ total wasted in one offseason.

But Keuchel at 1-year / $13M for the Braves is a nice deal.

Hopefully, Hahn will learn from this going forward, start signing difference makers over veteran has-been’s, and improve on his FA signings.  But I sincerely doubt it.

I dont think you understand the concept of rebuild. 

the point is to be as bad as they can until they are ready to compete. this way they build up the best draft picks and hopefully the best players to sustain a longer period of winning.

Signing Keuchel would get then a worse draft pick and still wouldn't get them any closer to a sustained period of winning.

they aren't winning anything this year by design. next year or the after are about when the winning should start, 4 to 5 years into a rebuild.  

they've made some big mistakes such as not signing Harper or Machado but not signing Keuchel to a 1 year deal isn't one of them.

Edited June 7, 20196 yr by ptatc

1 hour ago, Moan4Yoan said:

The Sox are obviously going cheap on this rebuild.  No big or top FA’s will be signed.  I don’t think this should be a surprise to anyone at this point.

I really dont understand your logic here. you want them to trade Colome and Abreu both of which are currently helping the team win. this will decrease their chances of winning this year. Yet you want them to sign Keuchel to a 1 year deal to try to win this year?

Yes we need to win every year! EVERY YEAR! That's how I expect the Sox to play. Not that we should make stupid deals or go crazy when there is no shot, but to purposely lose goes against the ethics of the game. To be as bad as we can to get draft picks is cheating the game.

Now is the time for winning, it would be sweet to make the playoffs this seasons, and get players some experience in playoffs. We need an attitude of winning to start now. We can do it this season, we are 3 games back of the wild card, we are seeing some really good things, let's make a push!

Edited June 7, 20196 yr by Chisox378

6 hours ago, ptatc said:

I dont think you understand the concept of rebuild. 

the point is to be as bad as they can until they are ready to compete. this way they build up the best draft picks and hopefully the best players to sustain a longer period of winning.

Signing Keuchel would get then a worse draft pick and still wouldn't get them any closer to a sustained period of winning.

they aren't winning anything this year by design. next year or the after are about when the winning should start, 4 to 5 years into a rebuild.  

they've made some big mistakes such as not signing Harper or Machado but not signing Keuchel to a 1 year deal isn't one of them.

Read my post again.  I said Keuchel is a good signing for the Braves.  I didn’t suggest he would be a good signing for the Sox.  However, if you are trying to lose, why even waste money on the bums Hahn did sign?  Also, my point was also that Hahn doesn’t seem to understand the concept of spending on quality over quantity.

Edited June 7, 20196 yr by Moan4Yoan

1 minute ago, Moan4Yoan said:

Read my post again.  I said Keuchel is a good signing for the Braves.  I didn’t suggest he would be a good signing for the Sox.  However, if you are trying to lose, why even waste money on the bums Hahn did sign?

sorry. I thought the comment about about Hahn wasting enough money already implied that you thought he should make this signing as well.

 

7 minutes ago, Chisox378 said:

Yes we need to win every year! EVERY YEAR! That's how I expect the Sox to play. Not that we should make stupid deals or go crazy when there is no shot, but to purposely lose goes against the ethics of the game. To be as bad as we can to get draft picks is cheating the game.

Now is the time for winning, it would be sweet to make the playoffs this seasons, and get players some experience in playoffs. We need an attitude of winning to start now. We can do it this season, we are 3 games back of the wild card, we are seeing some really good things, let's make a push!

I know what your saying.  You and I grew up in an era that the word "tank" was never thought of.  Unfortunately, times have changed.

10 hours ago, HoosierSox said:

The Twins have shown you can win without signing premium free agents and finding solid mid tier talent. The problem is Hahn is not good at finding the mid tier talent like the Twins have found. 

Maybe Hahn should find the guy in the Twins org. who is finding this talent and hire him. 

39 minutes ago, poppysox said:

I know what your saying.  You and I grew up in an era that the word "tank" was never thought of.  Unfortunately, times have changed.

Keuchel signing a 1 year deal would not help us at this stage.  Better we didn't get involved.  But the organization needs to start to change their mindset as well. When the Sox are ready to be a contender, they do need to take some chances on players w limited contracts w the goal to convince them to re-sign. I agree w those who said that Keuchel probably never considered the Sox. That t has to change in the next few years. This FO has to change the perception as the winning increses.  It is how good teams keep rolling along year after year. 

If Keuchel has a solid 3 month stint with the Braves then this is actually good for us. He would become another reliable LH starter on the FA market for 2020 when we clearly need to go buy one.

Just now, SCCWS said:

Keuchel signing a 1 year deal would not help us at this stage.  Better we didn't get involved.  But the organization needs to start to change their mindset as well. When the Sox are ready to be a contender, they do need to take some chances on players w limited contracts w the goal to convince them to re-sign. I agree w those who said that Keuchel probably never considered the Sox. That t has to change in the next few years. This FO has to change the perception as the winning increses.  It is how good teams keep rolling along year after year. 

I don't disagree...only pointing out the era is different.  We became baseball fans in an era where Cubs had Ernie Banks and many other quality players.  Even though they were in last place...they just didn't consider trading the teams star.  The Sale trade would not happen no matter the offer.  We of course did trade players like Norm Cash and Earl Battey to the chagrin of many White Sox fans.

1 hour ago, poppysox said:

I know what your saying.  You and I grew up in an era that the word "tank" was never thought of.  Unfortunately, times have changed.

Times have changed, that's for sure. Years ago if the team was bad it didn't draw and the team lost money. Today you lose and with low payrolls you make nothing but money. Always remember that Forbes magazine said the White Sox were the 6th most profitable team in MLB in 2018. This losing year after year and the franchise making nothing but money doesn't  cut it with me. I dearly wish that JR would sell the team.

1 hour ago, Balta1701 said:

If Keuchel has a solid 3 month stint with the Braves then this is actually good for us. He would become another reliable LH starter on the FA market for 2020 when we clearly need to go buy one.

yes.