Gents and ladies, I'm going to preface my comments by acknowledging that our offense blows right now and pretty much has in key parts of the season.........BUT.....

This Kimbrel trade could a disaster for this team and organization. This supposed great reliever has no clue where the ball is going. He is a disaster........this was the Craig Kimbrel the Cubs saw in 18 when they signed him. He is reverting back to that dude he was in 18.....absolute hot garbage.

I'm so tired of watching this guy as he has blown leads, given up tying or winning hits or wild pitches. Lets open our eyes and see how bad this guy really is.  He has been scored upon in the majority of his white sox outings.

This guy, if given the opportunity, is going to rip our hearts out in the playoffs.

 

Katz has been pretty underwhelming so far, the entire bullpen has been a total shitshow since Katz arrived and I'm someone who was 100% on board with them going with Katz and firing Cooper

First off the kimbrel trade even if he sucks will not be a disaster of a trade. Heuer will be an okay player and Madrigal is a run of the mill second basemen whose only tool is that of a slap hitter essentially a dime a dozen. Let’s back off the ledge. 

But kimbrel is not a Katz issue. 

Dude is a 33 year old vet.....what is Katz going tell him?

Just now, HahnsKiddieTable said:

First off the kimbrel trade even if he sucks will not be a disaster of a trade. Heuer will be an okay player and Madrigal is a run of the mill second basemen whose only tool is that of a slap hitter essentially a dime a dozen. Let’s back off the ledge. 

Think on the bright side, maybe they end up upgrading 2nd base this offseason with someone better than Madrigal

He can’t pitch in 8th inning painfully obvious.

1 minute ago, HahnsKiddieTable said:

First off the kimbrel trade even if he sucks will not be a disaster of a trade. Heuer will be an okay player and Madrigal is a run of the mill second basemen whose only tool is that of a slap hitter essentially a dime a dozen. Let’s back off the ledge. 

It is and could be a disaster in the sense that you did not get what you thought and what you paid for.  It also has potential disaster written all over it with this dude coming into a close game in playoffs 

Just now, 2Deep said:

It is and could be a disaster in the sense that you did not get what you thought and what you paid for.  It also has potential disaster written all over it with this dude coming into a close game in playoffs 

Compared to any of the other dumpster fires out there in the bullpen? I’d much rather take a chance w Kimbrel over the likes of Marshall, Ruiz or any other reliever for that matter not named Hendricks and Kopech 

1 minute ago, HahnsKiddieTable said:

Compared to any of the other dumpster fires out there in the bullpen? I’d much rather take a chance w Kimbrel over the likes of Marshall, Ruiz or any other reliever for that matter not named Hendricks and Kopech 

Not for the price you paid for him with Heuer and Madrigal and the $16 mil a year he's getting 

Edited August 24, 20214 yr by 2Deep

6 minutes ago, joesaiditstrue said:

Katz has been pretty underwhelming so far, the entire bullpen has been a total shitshow since Katz arrived and I'm someone who was 100% on board with them going with Katz and firing Cooper

Carlos Rodon went from getting DFA'd by the Sox and no one claiming him to arguably being the best AL SP on a per inning basis. Dylan Cease is currently 16th in fWAR amongst pitchers. He's gotten Reynaldo Lopez on the right track with improved mechanics. The role he played in turning around Gio's career has been documented 1,000 times already. The Sox also lead the majors in pitcher WAR, and have the best strikeout rate for pitchers despite the fact they play in the AL.

He certainly hasn't had smashing success with every pitcher, but on the hole, adding him to the organization has been a HUGE positive.

29 minutes ago, 2Deep said:

Gents and ladies, I'm going to preface my comments by acknowledging that our offense blows right now and pretty much has in key parts of the season.........BUT.....

This Kimbrel trade could a disaster for this team and organization. This supposed great reliever has no clue where the ball is going. He is a disaster........this was the Craig Kimbrel the Cubs saw in 18 when they signed him. He is reverting back to that dude he was in 18.....absolute hot garbage.

I'm so tired of watching this guy as he has blown leads, given up tying or winning hits or wild pitches. Lets open our eyes and see how bad this guy really is.  He has been scored upon in the majority of his white sox outings.

This guy, if given the opportunity, is going to rip our hearts out in the playoffs.

 

If you are going to rip into the guy, at least know your shit.  Dude was straight up dominant in 2018.

He’s going through a rough stretch.  Again, from what I know of him, he really is someone who is routine orientated.  And so I imagine it must be difficult for him to make an adjustment mid season.  Luckily these games ere kind of meaningless in the grand scheme of things.  

The fact is, we will know the value of this trade based on October and how well he does there.  I’m still pretty confident in him.  Definitely more confident than any of the other options we have.

2 minutes ago, Colome's Hat said:

If you are going to rip into the guy, at least know your shit.  Dude was straight up dominant in 2018.

He’s going through a rough stretch.  Again, from what I know of him, he really is someone who is routine orientated.  And so I imagine it must be difficult for him to make an adjustment mid season.  Luckily these games ere kind of meaningless in the grand scheme of things.  

The fact is, we will know the value of this trade based on October and how well he does there.  I’m still pretty confident in him.  Definitely more confident than any of the other options we have.

My bad 2019. Point still remains....

What has he done to instill confidence in the ladder stages of his career. He shit his pants for the Red Sox in 2018 in playoffs. 

You mention games being meaningless and I can agree there but at some point you have to look like a playoff team or a shut down reliever. You constantly keep getting beat by good to very good teams and your $16 mil man, who you gave up 10 years of control for young good players, keeps shitting the bed.

Ran into a Brewers scout at a party 2 weeks ago, the consensus among the Brewers and many MLB scouts is that Madrigal doesn’t progress into a good major leaguer. Feels the Sox got a steal with the trade. 
 

That being said, definitely need more from Craig but we had to be aggressive and get somebody. 

26 minutes ago, HahnsKiddieTable said:

First off the kimbrel trade even if he sucks will not be a disaster of a trade. Heuer will be an okay player and Madrigal is a run of the mill second basemen whose only tool is that of a slap hitter essentially a dime a dozen. Let’s back off the ledge. 

It will be a huge disaster if he ends up being a 2-3 month rental and THIS is what he produces. Both Heuer and Madrigal are young and you have no idea what they can/will turn into, granted both have shown some success at the major league level

I just don't understand why they want to die on the Craig Kimbrel can pitch the 8th inning hill.  It would be different if he wasn't one of the best closers in baseball history but those 371 career saves don't lie. Do something different. 

29 minutes ago, joesaiditstrue said:

Katz has been pretty underwhelming so far, the entire bullpen has been a total shitshow since Katz arrived and I'm someone who was 100% on board with them going with Katz and firing Cooper

 

27 minutes ago, HahnsKiddieTable said:

First off the kimbrel trade even if he sucks will not be a disaster of a trade. Heuer will be an okay player and Madrigal is a run of the mill second basemen whose only tool is that of a slap hitter essentially a dime a dozen. Let’s back off the ledge. 

Germ or two of truth in both of these posts.  Katz's halo fitting needs to be postponed a while.  None of the talent sent north for The Big Flop is named Tatis or even close.

1 minute ago, Harold's Leg Lift said:

I just don't understand why they want to die on the Craig Kimbrel can pitch the 8th inning hill.  It would be different if he wasn't one of the best closers in baseball history but those 371 career saves don't lie. Do something different. 

Kimbrel's numbers in medium/low leverage situations in his career are better than they are in high leverage (dominant in all).

1 minute ago, 2Deep said:

My bad 2019. Point still remains....

What has he done to instill confidence in the ladder stages of his career. He shit his pants for the Red Sox in 2018 in playoffs. 

You mention games being meaningless and I can agree there but at some point you have to look like a playoff team or a shut down reliever. You constantly keep getting beat by good to very good teams and your $16 mil man, who you gave up 10 years of control for young good players, keeps shitting the bed.

As somone who actually followed the Red Sox in October of 2018 because my friend is a giant fan and I watched many of the games with her, he didn't shit his pants in the playoffs.  He wasn't great by any means but he saved 3 of the 4 games in the ALCS and saved one game in the world series, there weren't that many save situations in that series, although he did have an iffy one in a non save situation.  He blew one save in that marathon game but it was also a kind of freak occurrence play anyways.

Again.  Dude didn't allow a run in September of 2020.  

And was having a historically good season up until this month.

Again, if you are going to say these things you should have numbers to actually back you up.

Just now, Harold's Leg Lift said:

I just don't understand why they want to die on the Craig Kimbrel can pitch the 8th inning hill.  It would be different if he wasn't one of the best closers in baseball history but those 371 career saves don't lie. Do something different. 

I personally think they really never had any intention of keeping Kimbrel next year, so it might be awkward with Hendriks to make Kimbrel the closer, and then go back to Hendriks next year after he really didn’t lose the job. But at this point, the Sox need to win some games and have Hendriks unavailable and see what happens with Kimbrel in the 9th. If it is more of what has been going on, then th 8th vs. 9th is BS. If he is mowing them down, start giving Hendriks some 8ths and see what happens.

34 minutes ago, HahnsKiddieTable said:

Madrigal is a run of the mill second basemen whose only tool is that of a slap hitter essentially a dime a dozen.

Can’t wait to see how this hot take holds up. ?

2 minutes ago, Harold's Leg Lift said:

I just don't understand why they want to die on the Craig Kimbrel can pitch the 8th inning hill.  It would be different if he wasn't one of the best closers in baseball history but those 371 career saves don't lie. Do something different. 

Do something different like have him throw to a competent catcher?    I think he’ll be fine with Grandal behind the plate.    The fact that Lynn threw the game he did tonight with Zavala behind the plate just shows how awesome he is.   Since Yasmani got injured, we’ve been working with the worst catching duo in MLB.   Some of you greatly underestimate the effect this has on pitchers and unfortunately we have no solution until Grandal comes back.

Just now, Dick Allen said:

I personally think they really never had any intention of keeping Kimbrel next year, so it might be awkward with Hendriks to make Kimbrel the closer, and then go back to Hendriks next year after he really didn’t lose the job. But at this point, the Sox need to win some games and have Hendriks unavailable and see what happens with Kimbrel in the 9th. If it is more of what has been going on, then th 8th vs. 9th is BS. If he is mowing them down, start giving Hendriks some 8ths and see what happens.

Given Hendriks history of pitching in the 8th and his ability to go multiple innings, I think he will likely make the adjustment pretty easily. 

That being said, given what Kimbrel has said and what has been written about him, this may be a thing where it requires a longer period of adjustment then normal (i.e. a month).  I'm not sure suddenly pulling him from a role he's trying to get comfortable with and sticking him a new role would be great.  Although I do think he can pitch the 9th without any problem.

5 minutes ago, Colome's Hat said:

As somone who actually followed the Red Sox in October of 2018 because my friend is a giant fan and I watched many of the games with her, he didn't shit his pants in the playoffs.  He wasn't great by any means but he saved 3 of the 4 games in the ALCS and saved one game in the world series, there weren't that many save situations in that series, although he did have an iffy one in a non save situation.  He blew one save in that marathon game but it was also a kind of freak occurrence play anyways.

Again.  Dude didn't allow a run in September of 2020.  

And was having a historically good season up until this month.

Again, if you are going to say these things you should have numbers to actually back you up.

Lol what in the world?

He gave up 7 runs in 10.2 innings (walked 8 guys!), and had an ERA of :

11.57
4.5
4.15

in the three playoff rounds.

What is with the weird Kimbrel excuse makers on this forum?

Edited August 24, 20214 yr by Look at Ray Ray Run

These last 2 “disasters”, one good thing is he isn’t getting hit very hard.

2 minutes ago, Colome's Hat said:

As somone who actually followed the Red Sox in October of 2018 because my friend is a giant fan and I watched many of the games with her, he didn't shit his pants in the playoffs.  He wasn't great by any means but he saved 3 of the 4 games in the ALCS and saved one game in the world series, there weren't that many save situations in that series, although he did have an iffy one in a non save situation.  He blew one save in that marathon game but it was also a kind of freak occurrence play anyways.

Again.  Dude didn't allow a run in September of 2020.  

And was having a historically good season up until this month.

Again, if you are going to say these things you should have numbers to actually back you up.

Look bro, its frustrating that we gave up so much for this shit. I'm genuinely worried that he will not turn it around. 

I'll be honest, kimbrel is a huge issue for me but I do not like that TLR and his guys have set the plane on coast mode. It will not bode well for this team. They are not good enough or have the playoff pedigree as a team to do that.