Jake Burger

[JUSTgottaBELIEVE]

1 hour ago, WestEddy said:

From today's MLBTR chat with Steve Adams:
 

KC Pain

1:25

Jake Burger, how legit was that half with the Marlins?   Im looking at prior seasons and this seasons small sample and injury and a tad worried

 

Steve Adams

1:29

He's not going to keep up the .350-.360 average on balls in play that got him to his '23 Marlins production, and he's not going to continue to struggle like he has this year with the BABIP pendulum swinging in the other direction.

Burger's career numbers are basically what he is to me... a low- to league-average batting average with poor OBP skills, good pop and poor defense. He's a fine guy to have around when his cost is low, but I don't think he's someone teams are going to want to pay through his arb years as his salary escalates.

I'm typically a "yeah, trade your pitching prospects because they all break" guy, but my initial reaction to that trade was still "I wouldn't have given up Jake Eder here"

Sounds like Steve agrees with my assessment from a month ago.

[WestEddy]

1 minute ago, JUSTgottaBELIEVE said:

Sounds like Steve agrees with my assessment from a month ago.

Yeah, the plan was to stockpile higher ceiling arms. If you have 15 guys at 4 levels, all 15 won't be Cy Young winners. 

[JoeC]

1 hour ago, WestEddy said:

From today's MLBTR chat with Steve Adams:
 

KC Pain

1:25

Jake Burger, how legit was that half with the Marlins?   Im looking at prior seasons and this seasons small sample and injury and a tad worried

 

Steve Adams

1:29

He's not going to keep up the .350-.360 average on balls in play that got him to his '23 Marlins production, and he's not going to continue to struggle like he has this year with the BABIP pendulum swinging in the other direction.

Burger's career numbers are basically what he is to me... a low- to league-average batting average with poor OBP skills, good pop and poor defense. He's a fine guy to have around when his cost is low, but I don't think he's someone teams are going to want to pay through his arb years as his salary escalates.

I'm typically a "yeah, trade your pitching prospects because they all break" guy, but my initial reaction to that trade was still "I wouldn't have given up Jake Eder here"

Whoever pulled off that burger trade probably needs a promotion. Sounds like he is a smart guy who is a good negotiator and knows how to sell at the right time.

[WestEddy]

5 minutes ago, JoeC said:

Whoever pulled off that burger trade probably needs a promotion. Sounds like he is a smart guy who is a good negotiator and knows how to sell at the right time.

I think that guy got promoted to the position he truly wanted. 

[caulfield12]

42 minutes ago, WestEddy said:

I think that guy got promoted to the position he truly wanted. 

KW lol?

From the Marlins' perspective, they made the playoffs because of Burger and Josh Bell.

Let's wait and see if Eder provides anything close to that as a building block...

Edited May 14 by caulfield12

[WestEddy]

16 minutes ago, caulfield12 said:

KW lol?

From the Marlins' perspective, they made the playoffs because of Burger and Josh Bell.

Let's wait and see if Eder provides anything close to that as a building block...

KW and Hahn both were looking to leave at times. Now they're gone. That's what I meant. 

[southsider2k5]

I feel like we are in a bad Disney parody...

 

WE DON'T TALK ABOUT BURGER, NO, NO!

[WhiteSox2023]

8 hours ago, WestEddy said:

From today's MLBTR chat with Steve Adams:
 

KC Pain

1:25

Jake Burger, how legit was that half with the Marlins?   Im looking at prior seasons and this seasons small sample and injury and a tad worried

 

Steve Adams

1:29

He's not going to keep up the .350-.360 average on balls in play that got him to his '23 Marlins production, and he's not going to continue to struggle like he has this year with the BABIP pendulum swinging in the other direction.

Burger's career numbers are basically what he is to me... a low- to league-average batting average with poor OBP skills, good pop and poor defense. He's a fine guy to have around when his cost is low, but I don't think he's someone teams are going to want to pay through his arb years as his salary escalates.

I'm typically a "yeah, trade your pitching prospects because they all break" guy, but my initial reaction to that trade was still "I wouldn't have given up Jake Eder here"

I wonder if Steve would have given up Mena for Fletcher.

[baseball_gal_aly]

https://www.sportsmockery.com/chicago-white-sox/analyzing-the-jake-burger-for-jake-eder-trade-nine-months-later/

 

Of note, Eder's BABIP against is .424, his xFIP is 2.60 and his FIP is 3.18. 

Edited May 19 by baseball_gal_aly

[caulfield12]

13 minutes ago, baseball_gal_aly said:

https://www.sportsmockery.com/chicago-white-sox/analyzing-the-jake-burger-for-jake-eder-trade-nine-months-later/

 

Of note, Eder's BABIP against is .424, his xFIP is 2.60 and his FIP is 3.18. 

The test for every Sox pitcher is always going to be Charlotte and Chicago in the summer months...just as Charlotte offensive numbers can be suspect, you have the opposite sppression effect on the pitching side of things.

[nrockway]

1 hour ago, baseball_gal_aly said:

https://www.sportsmockery.com/chicago-white-sox/analyzing-the-jake-burger-for-jake-eder-trade-nine-months-later/

 

Of note, Eder's BABIP against is .424, his xFIP is 2.60 and his FIP is 3.18. 

He's looked pretty good to my eye even if the ERA doesn't match up. I still think it's a fine trade even if Burger returns to form and Eder never becomes anything. Take a risk on top end talent, Burger, an oft-injured DH, wasn't leading this team anywhere. Look how well that's worked out for the Marlins, they could use some young arms. 

I think it would be hilarious if we traded back for him. Eloy replacement/Ramos sub. I'd be hesitant to swap Wilfred Veras for him, but that should get it done. I think the Cubs might actually be interested in him if he starts hitting the ball again. 

[caulfield12]

31 minutes ago, nrockway said:

He's looked pretty good to my eye even if the ERA doesn't match up. I still think it's a fine trade even if Burger returns to form and Eder never becomes anything. Take a risk on top end talent, Burger, an oft-injured DH, wasn't leading this team anywhere. Look how well that's worked out for the Marlins, they could use some young arms. 

I think it would be hilarious if we traded back for him. Eloy replacement/Ramos sub. I'd be hesitant to swap Wilfred Veras for him, but that should get it done. I think the Cubs might actually be interested in him if he starts hitting the ball again. 

Veras has little value because he doesn't play a premium position...he simply has to hit everywhere he goes.

Not unlike Burger...but at least there's something of a track record there now.

Still impossible to write him off when he's had that oblique injury affecting his hit tool.

[Dick Allen]

12 hours ago, baseball_gal_aly said:

https://www.sportsmockery.com/chicago-white-sox/analyzing-the-jake-burger-for-jake-eder-trade-nine-months-later/

 

Of note, Eder's BABIP against is .424, his xFIP is 2.60 and his FIP is 3.18. 

One thing that isn’t mentioned is that he’s 25. Older than Crochet. 6 months younger than the already  given up on Andrew Vaughn. And he’s in AA. 

[wrathofhahn]

It's all about his velocity. Last I read he was throwing 91-92. He used to throw 96-97 prior to TJS

[Chicago White Sox]

2 hours ago, wrathofhahn said:

It's all about his velocity. Last I read he was throwing 91-92. He used to throw 96-97 prior to TJS

Eder?

[wrathofhahn]

18 minutes ago, Chicago White Sox said:

Eder?

Yes. His velocity had massively decreased post TJ, according to the scouting report I read awhile back. 

I can't find it but here is an old scouting report from MLB

 

93-96 mph

 

He maintained the velocity on his four-seam fastball, sitting at 93-96 mph and touching 98, and the quality of his low-80s slider, giving him a second plus pitch.

 

Eder - Marlins Top Prospects | MLB.com

 

Fangraphs

Eder was drafted out of Vanderbilt in the fourth round of the truncated 2020 draft and his stuff exploded in pro ball. Eder made 15 starts in 2021, racking up a mid-30s strikeout rate and a 0.98 WHIP while sitting 94-97 and bending in a plus-plus slider, but he blew out and needed Tommy John surgery. His rehab was interrupted by an ill-timed foot fracture, which kept him off the mound until midway through the 2023 season, after which old co-workers Kenny Williams and Kim Ng swapped Jake Burger for Eder at the trade deadline. When he returned, it was with a lower arm slot, and Eder struggled to recapture the arm strength from before his injury, as his fastball sat in the 92-94 mph neighborhood during the 2023 regular season and again in the Arizona Fall League.

[wrathofhahn]

That is why I am interested to know if he has regained his velocity because if he is still throwing 91-92 or 92-93 he projects probably to a more backend type at best

[Chicago White Sox]

1 minute ago, wrathofhahn said:

That is why I am interested to know if he has regained his velocity because if he is still throwing 91-92 or 92-93 he projects probably to a more backend type at best

I believe he’s regained most of his velocity

[southsider2k5]

44 minutes ago, wrathofhahn said:

Yes. His velocity had massively decreased post TJ, according to the scouting report I read awhile back. 

I can't find it but here is an old scouting report from MLB

 

93-96 mph

 

He maintained the velocity on his four-seam fastball, sitting at 93-96 mph and touching 98, and the quality of his low-80s slider, giving him a second plus pitch.

 

Eder - Marlins Top Prospects | MLB.com

 

Fangraphs

Eder was drafted out of Vanderbilt in the fourth round of the truncated 2020 draft and his stuff exploded in pro ball. Eder made 15 starts in 2021, racking up a mid-30s strikeout rate and a 0.98 WHIP while sitting 94-97 and bending in a plus-plus slider, but he blew out and needed Tommy John surgery. His rehab was interrupted by an ill-timed foot fracture, which kept him off the mound until midway through the 2023 season, after which old co-workers Kenny Williams and Kim Ng swapped Jake Burger for Eder at the trade deadline. When he returned, it was with a lower arm slot, and Eder struggled to recapture the arm strength from before his injury, as his fastball sat in the 92-94 mph neighborhood during the 2023 regular season and again in the Arizona Fall League.

That's actually fairly normal in the conditioning in the recovery season post TJS.  He never really got that time to recover last year with the broken foot.  

[southsider2k5]

4 minutes ago, southsider2k5 said:

That's actually fairly normal in the conditioning in the recovery season post TJS.  He never really got that time to recover last year with the broken foot.  

Also this