3 hours ago, Scott Merkin Fan said:

I think the potential AL ASG starter should be extended and not traded. The only non arbitration contracts on the books are Benintendi and Stassi. This downright refusal to pay players past their rookie contracts is ludicrous. 29 other teams in baseball would behave differently.

They’ve recently extended TA, Moncada, Eloy and Robert, so they are willing. Jerry just refuses to do it for starting pitchers.

4 hours ago, JUSTgottaBELIEVE said:

It’s funny that a month ago I was being ridiculed for saying I thought Crochet would have slightly less but similar trade value this July to what Cease had last offseason. Now some folks thinking he will have even higher trade value. I don’t necessarily agree with that but at least now you see the light. Crochet is a stud, magical innings limit be damned.

I for one will gladly eat crow...chet.

9 hours ago, WestEddy said:

2026 is Crochet's walk year. 2030 is Thorpe's, if he stays in the majors. We may be a .500 team in 2026. We really should be "competitive" before 2030. 

Don't count on being competitive by 2030. Not with this bunch.

1 hour ago, Highland said:

Don't count on being competitive by 2030. Not with this bunch.

A lot can happen in 5 years ?

4 hours ago, WhiteSox2023 said:

Crochet hasn’t blown past it yet.  I seem to remember posters expecting 75-100 innings.  I believe you were expecting 150 innings or possibly more.  But even Sox mouthpiece Bob Nightengale is now saying that the Sox have a plan to limit Crochet the rest of the way this season, which you kept arguing wasn’t a thing at all.  It seems to me that the majority of posters that thought there would be an innings limit were right, but were off on the total number of innings that he would pitch.  You were insistent that there was no plan to limit Crochet’s innings because “he’s a freak” and “he’s showing no signs of slowing down” and that his arm can handle it.  How does that make you more right than the majority of posters?

Nah there was a thread (at least one) with people specifically claiming there is no way he can physically handle more than 75 or 80 innings

https://chicago.suntimes.com/white-sox/2024/07/01/white-sox-can-take-steps-in-rebuild-process-as-trade-deadline-nears

2 hours ago, JoeC said:

I for one will gladly eat crow...chet.

Croquette...a French delight.

9 hours ago, 4OCS said:

Nah there was a thread (at least one) with people specifically claiming there is no way he can physically handle more than 75 or 80 innings

Yup, including the resident doctor

9 hours ago, 4OCS said:

Nah there was a thread (at least one) with people specifically claiming there is no way he can physically handle more than 75 or 80 innings

That was me. I'm surprised they have let him go this many innings.  They are playing with fire. I guess they are really confident in the strengthening program for the rehab for the UCL reconstruction. It will be interesting to see what next year looks like next year. 

12 hours ago, Snopek said:

They’ve recently extended TA, Moncada, Eloy and Robert, so they are willing. Jerry just refuses to do it for starting pitchers.

To a point. The day Jerry would pay an expensive deal well past AB, that’ll be the day that I die

7 minutes ago, Chick Mercedes said:

To a point. The day Jerry would pay an expensive deal well past AB, that’ll be the day that I die

Absolutely. It was more of a response to the “downright refusal to pay players past their rookie contracts” line.

38 minutes ago, ptatc said:

That was me. I'm surprised they have let him go this many innings.  They are playing with fire. I guess they are really confident in the strengthening program for the rehab for the UCL reconstruction. It will be interesting to see what next year looks like next year. 

At this point, would you be surprised if he pitches 150 innings this season while maintaining an ERA in the low 3s? I figure he’s got another ~12 starts and 50+ innings in him before the season ends.

31 minutes ago, JUSTgottaBELIEVE said:

At this point, would you be surprised if he pitches 150 innings this season while maintaining an ERA in the low 3s? I figure he’s got another ~12 starts and 50+ innings in him before the season ends.

I would consider it malpractice if he goes 150. That's double his his entire career and nearly triple his season high.

I think they are more than he should be now. But they are with him so they know more. It will be interesting to see how he performs next year after this workload.

Elijah Evans at Future Sox :

"Ky Bush is being promoted to Triple-A Charlotte! He has been excellent this season after being traded to the organization last summer. 2.12 ERA, 1.03 WHIP, 78 strikeouts. Opponents batting just .180. Should get innings in Chicago later this year! "

 

Looks Like Ky is on the move if the Sox unload pitching at the deadline. 

I tried to get Elijah's link but it didn't work for me

Edited July 2, 20241 yr by Falstaff

5 minutes ago, Falstaff said:

Elijah Evans at Future Sox :

"Ky Bush is being promoted to Triple-A Charlotte! He has been excellent this season after being traded to the organization last summer. 2.12 ERA, 1.03 WHIP, 78 strikeouts. Opponents batting just .180. Should get innings in Chicago later this year! "

 

Looks Like Ky is on the move if the Sox unload pitching at the deadline. 

I tried to get Elijah's link but it didn't work for me

Tbf everyone with a pulse is getting innings in Chicago, Crochet or not

2 hours ago, ptatc said:

That was me. I'm surprised they have let him go this many innings.  They are playing with fire. I guess they are really confident in the strengthening program for the rehab for the UCL reconstruction. It will be interesting to see what next year looks like next year. 

Yet so afraid of extensions after Danks.

1 hour ago, Falstaff said:

Elijah Evans at Future Sox :

"Ky Bush is being promoted to Triple-A Charlotte! He has been excellent this season after being traded to the organization last summer. 2.12 ERA, 1.03 WHIP, 78 strikeouts. Opponents batting just .180. Should get innings in Chicago later this year! "

 

Looks Like Ky is on the move if the Sox unload pitching at the deadline. 

I tried to get Elijah's link but it didn't work for me

Elijah Tatis, lol…?  Can SoxTalk/Future Sox interview him on what went wrong?

1 hour ago, ptatc said:

I would consider it malpractice if he goes 150. That's double his his entire career and nearly triple his season high.

I think they are more than he should be now. But they are with him so they know more. It will be interesting to see how he performs next year after this workload.

Certainly not one to give the Sox any benefit of the doubt (you have much more than I) but I do wonder if this has been a calculated decision, to showcase him as much as possible because they know they will be trading him. There is historical data that does back up what you're saying, and if Crochet was viewed as a long term investment for the Sox, you would think they would handle with more caution, especially in a season when they are the worst team in the league. 

1 hour ago, ptatc said:

I would consider it malpractice if he goes 150. That's double his his entire career and nearly triple his season high.

I think they are more than he should be now. But they are with him so they know more. It will be interesting to see how he performs next year after this workload.

What happens if he goes 150 this season and 175+ next season while continuing to perform at a high level? Will he have established a new precedent for pitchers coming off TJS moving forward?

4 minutes ago, Tony said:

Certainly not one to give the Sox any benefit of the doubt (you have much more than I) but I do wonder if this has been a calculated decision, to showcase him as much as possible because they know they will be trading him. There is historical data that does back up what you're saying, and if Crochet was viewed as a long term investment for the Sox, you would think they would handle with more caution, especially in a season when they are the worst team in the league. 

Average number of innings pitched after TJ1…median is just 130 for pitchers who had the first one.

More than 50% of players returned to the DL because of injuries to their throwing arms after returning from surgery.
 

Also, total number with two or more TJ surgeries somewhere in the 125-150 range.

7 minutes ago, JUSTgottaBELIEVE said:

What happens if he goes 150 this season and 175+ next season while continuing to perform at a high level? Will he have established a new precedent for pitchers coming off TJS moving forward?

Or it’s just a total fluke…based largely upon Crochet’s willpower/determination than anything to do with a coordinated White Sox system-wide program.

See Burger.

19 minutes ago, Tony said:

Certainly not one to give the Sox any benefit of the doubt (you have much more than I) but I do wonder if this has been a calculated decision, to showcase him as much as possible because they know they will be trading him. There is historical data that does back up what you're saying, and if Crochet was viewed as a long term investment for the Sox, you would think they would handle with more caution, especially in a season when they are the worst team in the league. 

100% they are treating him like they don't care about his long term health implications.  That's the first thing that told me he would be traded.

26 minutes ago, caulfield12 said:

Yet so afraid of extensions after Danks.

They extended Sale and Quintana after Danks, courted Samardzija and Giolito, both of whom were intent to test out free agency. They also worked with Lynn on a short extension. Oh, and Bummer. 

21 minutes ago, JUSTgottaBELIEVE said:

What happens if he goes 150 this season and 175+ next season while continuing to perform at a high level? Will he have established a new precedent for pitchers coming off TJS moving forward?

It's not so much the UCL rehab as it is his previous workload. He never pitched more than about 50 innings in any season. But maybe the UCL rehab will be looked at to build the arm without actually pitching. It's possible.

Or maybe he is a physical freak that we don't know about. The peo0le working with him will know more.

6 minutes ago, ptatc said:

It's not so much the UCL rehab as it is his previous workload. He never pitched more than about 50 innings in any season. But maybe the UCL rehab will be looked at to build the arm without actually pitching. It's possible.

Or maybe he is a physical freak that we don't know about. The peo0le working with him will know more.

But Chris Sale also had a huge jump in workload from 2011 to 2012. He was fine for years after that.