Michael A. Taylor Signed

[Dick Allen]

16 minutes ago, Chicago White Sox said:

He may not, but I just don’t see a major league hitter in him and wasting 300+ plate appearances on him this year won’t change that.  Would rather spend $3.5M on a veteran RF platoon and potentially take some pressure off of some of the other kids.

Michael A. Taylor is a major league hitter?To me, it’s a waste of $2 million. if you trade Robert, put Fletcher in CF. He played there at the game I went to in Milwaukee. Made a nice catch and got hurt.

[Chicago White Sox]

33 minutes ago, Dick Allen said:

Michael A. Taylor is a major league hitter?To me, it’s a waste of $2 million. if you trade Robert, put Fletcher in CF. He played there at the game I went to in Milwaukee. Made a nice catch and got hurt.

I was referring to Tauchman & Slater.  I can’t really comment on Taylor until I see what they get for Robert.  Regardless, I don’t believe Fletcher would be a good everyday CF defensively, so not sure that he offers anything better than what Taylor does.  To me, the OF post Robert trade is going to be a shitshow no matter what else we get a major league ready CF prospect.

[CaliSoxFanViaSWside]

On 2/12/2025 at 12:53 PM, T R U said:

Of course he didn't win many games, this team had no offense and a terrible bullpen. He went 6-12 and the team went 9-23 in games started by Crochet. What do you think is going to happen now going from a front of the rotation all-star level pitcher to Davis Martin?

The starting pitching this year will be considerably worse than last season, full of washed vets and young guys trying to develop. At least 2024 had Crochet and Fedde for the majority of the season. 

What you're losing with Fedde and Crochet you could be gaining in the number of starters who could be solid in the 3-5 rolls. There's more depth. I think there's also more depth for a better bullpen.

I know it's easy to look at the amount of strange veteran arms and some of the younger arms and think of it as better than last year. It is deeper and they're going to sort through a lot of arms .

Maybe Trey McGough, Shane Smith ,Peyton Pallette, Addison Coffey and others can eventually give solid contributions. They have more arms that had pretty good years last year but they are pretty unfamiliar to the average fan.

 

[caulfield12]

12 minutes ago, CaliSoxFanViaSWside said:

What you're losing with Fedde and Crochet you could be gaining in the number of starters who could be solid in the 3-5 rolls. There's more depth. I think there's also more depth for a better bullpen.

I know it's easy to look at the amount of strange veteran arms and some of the younger arms and think of it as better than last year. It is deeper and they're going to sort through a lot of arms .

Maybe Trey McGough, Shane Smith ,Peyton Pallette, Addison Coffey and others can eventually give solid contributions. They have more arms that had pretty good years last year but they are pretty unfamiliar to the average fan.

 

Adisyn Coffey...and don't forget Schoenle!

You must have Addison Russell/Street/Wrigley on the brain

Trey McGough sounds like either an Irish golfer or an offensive lineman.

 

Carela, Bush and Eder were the guys picked by FutureSox podcasters to be traded due to "too much depth."  We shall see.

[Balta1701]

1 hour ago, CaliSoxFanViaSWside said:

What you're losing with Fedde and Crochet you could be gaining in the number of starters who could be solid in the 3-5 rolls. There's more depth. I think there's also more depth for a better bullpen.

I know it's easy to look at the amount of strange veteran arms and some of the younger arms and think of it as better than last year. It is deeper and they're going to sort through a lot of arms .

Maybe Trey McGough, Shane Smith ,Peyton Pallette, Addison Coffey and others can eventually give solid contributions. They have more arms that had pretty good years last year but they are pretty unfamiliar to the average fan.

 

I know it’s down the memory hole but this is literally word for word what was said this time last year about how the 2024 bullpen would improve on 2023.

[caulfield12]

36 minutes ago, Balta1701 said:

I know it’s down the memory hole but this is literally word for word what was said this time last year about how the 2024 bullpen would improve on 2023.

"The bullpen projects… worse. Indeed, this is the worst unit that ZiPS has ever projected, but I’m not inclined to rag on a dozen org guys on a terrible team. Of the projected relief corps, Prelander Berroais probably the name to watch — though you don’t have to watch the White Sox, I promise — as his plus fastball and slider at least could be good. Problem is, he’s definitely far more of a thrower than a pitcher at this point; his pitches often intersect with the strike zone purely by chance."

Thought this should be revisited when we hear rosy forecasts.

https://www.si.com/fannation/mlb/fastball/history/chicago-white-sox-bullpen-given-historically-poor-projection-in-2025-by-fangraphs

 

 

 

Edited February 14 by caulfield12

[WhiteSox2023]

1-year, $1.95 million, with performance bonuses.

[CaliSoxFanViaSWside]

16 hours ago, Balta1701 said:

I know it’s down the memory hole but this is literally word for word what was said this time last year about how the 2024 bullpen would improve on 2023.

I can't really take your word for it .It can't be literally what I said last year because there's a lot different names this year and there weren't a lot of MLB ready arms last year. And I highly doubt I said some of those arms from last year had good years the previous year. But points for using hearsay to impune my usual spring optimism.

Look be as pessimistic as you want to be but I don't see the point of spitting on my outlook .

[T R U]

22 minutes ago, CaliSoxFanViaSWside said:

I can't really take your word for it .It can't be literally what I said last year because there's a lot different names this year and there weren't a lot of MLB ready arms last year. And I highly doubt I said some of those arms from last year had good years the previous year. But points for using hearsay to impune my usual spring optimism.

Look be as pessimistic as you want to be but I don't see the point of spitting on my outlook .

He didn't mean you specifically though...

[CaliSoxFanViaSWside]

46 minutes ago, T R U said:

He didn't mean you specifically though...

True. My stances are twofold usually. I can find reasons for optimism .

I can also know last year was terrible and it was apparent it was to going to be bad from the get go despite what JR and Getz said.

I always maintained piling up junk and trying to turn it into gold was a poor plan but likely the only one available to any GM who took the job.  I've used metaphors like the Sox are crack addicts trying to sell their  banged up Rolex  to a pawn shops ( the other GMs ) and getting take it or leave offers because JR put Getz over a barrel.

And it's the same plan this year but with more prospects ready to play this year while still trying to turn crap into filet mignon.

I know what's going on sucks but I'd like to think we hit rock bottom and there will be progress behind the scenes even if on field results are still 110 loss bad.

If it wasn't in poor taste I'd make a poll .What happened 1st a new labor agreement or JR passing away ? JRs going to live as long as Virginia McCaskey did.

[2Deep]

6 minutes ago, CaliSoxFanViaSWside said:

True. My stances are twofold usually. I can find reasons for optimism .

I can also know last year was terrible and it was apparent it was to going to be bad from the get go despite what JR and Getz said.

I always maintained piling up junk and trying to turn it into gold was a poor plan but likely the only one available to any GM who took the job.  I've used metaphors like the Sox are crack addicts trying to sell their  banged up Rolex  to a pawn shops ( the other GMs ) and getting take it or leave offers because JR put Getz over a barrel.

And it's the same plan this year but with more prospects ready to play this year while still trying to turn crap into filet mignon.

I know what's going on sucks but I'd like to think we hit rock bottom and there will be progress behind the scenes even if on field results are still 110 loss bad.

If it wasn't in poor taste I'd make a poll .What happened 1st a new labor agreement or JR passing away ? JRs going to live as long as Virginia McCaskey did.

This is not a knock on you BUT every thing you wrote depresses me as a fan.  

I can endure losing/rebuild if I know there is potential for greatness at the end.  I did that in 2017, 2018, 2019.......

I see no end to this because I do not trust Getz or his so called plan and even if there is light at the end of the tunnel, the MAN IN THE HIGH CASTLE will find a way to get in the way to bring darkness.   

[Balta1701]

3 hours ago, CaliSoxFanViaSWside said:

I can't really take your word for it .It can't be literally what I said last year because there's a lot different names this year and there weren't a lot of MLB ready arms last year. And I highly doubt I said some of those arms from last year had good years the previous year. But points for using hearsay to impune my usual spring optimism.

Look be as pessimistic as you want to be but I don't see the point of spitting on my outlook .

I think there was a lot of skepticism about  the rotation last year, especially since we didn't think Crochet could do anything like that.

But the bullpen actually had a bunch of additions to it. Tim Hill, Brebbia, Kopech, Steven Wilson from the Cease trade. Tanner Banks wasn't awful. Ok, Bryan Shaw was up there in age, but you could play the exact same game that is being played here to say that there was talent in those guys. Not great, but not the worst in history?

[nrockway]

On 2/12/2025 at 7:09 PM, Dick Allen said:

Michael A. Taylor is a major league hitter?To me, it’s a waste of $2 million. if you trade Robert, put Fletcher in CF. He played there at the game I went to in Milwaukee. Made a nice catch and got hurt.

See, my memory of Dom in CF is him “oops”ing that easy catch into a home run with crochet pitching. Affected the era and maybe his trade value. He’s too slow and short. Good mind for the position. Not the athletic talent. No Luis. Not even Taylor. 

[WhiteSox2023]

On 2/12/2025 at 7:09 PM, Dick Allen said:

Michael A. Taylor is a major league hitter?To me, it’s a waste of $2 million. if you trade Robert, put Fletcher in CF. He played there at the game I went to in Milwaukee. Made a nice catch and got hurt.

Yes, it is.  This just shows you how bad Getz knows that he fucked on that Fletcher trade, when he didn’t take back Jake McCarthy.  He can’t even entrust Fletcher to backup CF so he has to give old man Taylor $2 million guaranteed.

[CaliSoxFanViaSWside]

On 2/12/2025 at 9:51 AM, TheBooneLoganEra said:

I hear you. But personally I'd be happy to never see Vargas play again. I've seen enough. 

It's a rebuild .You may be right about Vargas but being right about guys isn't the point. Rebuilds require patience. Vargas is out of options . It's his last chance and Sosa's too.

He's had very good minor leagues numbers.He can't possibly be as bad as he's shown. Being a good hitter is harder than ever. Numbers across baseball were down. Pitchers make improvements faster than hitters. Adding a pitch with a lot of movement with command is not easy but I think it's easier than making split second decisions about swinging the bat.

You're dealing with a lot of prospects , any of whom can flop or succeed. We're all guessing here. Someone like Meidroth might be the most MLB ready prospect the Sox have based on his AAA numbers but unfortunately he's not 1st in line based on options.  There's a pecking order whether we like it or not.

I think the logjam has a purpose. Another name for a logjam is a dam. You remove  a few logs ( guys out of options , guys you trade off), you let guys show they are ready and push hard against that weakened dam until they burst through.

The wheat will be separated from the chaff .It's just going to take time. There will be a lot of comings and goings of guys Getz made minor trades for because he's dealing on the fringes. There's lots of failure doing that.

If you're angry about Getz being hired or his performance so far it's understandable.

However I haven't seen many counter solutions to what Getz is up against. Who would've taken a no win position like Getz is in and done better ? You can all dream that someone could have been hired but he or she still would need to do the same things Getz has been trying to do with as little money .

 Maybe Crochet would have been handled differently if a different GM fired Katz and didn't hire Bannister. Maybe they don't sign Fedde because apparently the rest of MLB didn't think enough of him to offer what the Sox did. It also might be why they were so reluctant to trade for him. For a guy who didn't have much money to work with signing Fedde was a quite a coup.

It's pretty pitiful that in 2 off seasons as GM that $15M Fedde contract is the most he's spent on any one player.

The fact that he hired a few well respected coaches and seems to be making an effort to overhaul the infrastructure all seems to be the right things to do. You might be skeptical and say Hahn said and did the same things but that doesn't mean Getz shouldn't get his shot at doing it better.

I just don't care if Fletcher doesn't get to play CF when Robert is traded .Better to have a guy who saves runs in Taylor than a guy who can't save runs in the field or create them at bat. A good fielding RF isn't necessarily a good CF. Dudes are going to have to show they deserve a shot or get out of the way.

Edited February 16 by CaliSoxFanViaSWside

[PaleAleSox]

On 2/14/2025 at 6:30 PM, WhiteSox2023 said:

Yes, it is.  This just shows you how bad Getz knows that he fucked on that Fletcher trade, when he didn’t take back Jake McCarthy.  He can’t even entrust Fletcher to backup CF so he has to give old man Taylor $2 million guaranteed.

You bring up McCarthy like they traded Tatis Jr when he was good. 

[Dick Allen]

9 hours ago, CaliSoxFanViaSWside said:

It's a rebuild .You may be right about Vargas but being right about guys isn't the point. Rebuilds require patience. Vargas is out of options . It's his last chance and Sosa's too.

He's had very good minor leagues numbers.He can't possibly be as bad as he's shown. Being a good hitter is harder than ever. Numbers across baseball were down. Pitchers make improvements faster than hitters. Adding a pitch with a lot of movement with command is not easy but I think it's easier than making split second decisions about swinging the bat.

You're dealing with a lot of prospects , any of whom can flop or succeed. We're all guessing here. Someone like Meidroth might be the most MLB ready prospect the Sox have based on his AAA numbers but unfortunately he's not 1st in line based on options.  There's a pecking order whether we like it or not.

I think the logjam has a purpose. Another name for a logjam is a dam. You remove  a few logs ( guys out of options , guys you trade off), you let guys show they are ready and push hard against that weakened dam until they burst through.

The wheat will be separated from the chaff .It's just going to take time. There will be a lot of comings and goings of guys Getz made minor trades for because he's dealing on the fringes. There's lots of failure doing that.

If you're angry about Getz being hired or his performance so far it's understandable.

However I haven't seen many counter solutions to what Getz is up against. Who would've taken a no win position like Getz is in and done better ? You can all dream that someone could have been hired but he or she still would need to do the same things Getz has been trying to do with as little money .

 Maybe Crochet would have been handled differently if a different GM fired Katz and didn't hire Bannister. Maybe they don't sign Fedde because apparently the rest of MLB didn't think enough of him to offer what the Sox did. It also might be why they were so reluctant to trade for him. For a guy who didn't have much money to work with signing Fedde was a quite a coup.

It's pretty pitiful that in 2 off seasons as GM that $15M Fedde contract is the most he's spent on any one player.

The fact that he hired a few well respected coaches and seems to be making an effort to overhaul the infrastructure all seems to be the right things to do. You might be skeptical and say Hahn said and did the same things but that doesn't mean Getz shouldn't get his shot at doing it better.

I just don't care if Fletcher doesn't get to play CF when Robert is traded .Better to have a guy who saves runs in Taylor than a guy who can't save runs in the field or create them at bat. A good fielding RF isn't necessarily a good CF. Dudes are going to have to show they deserve a shot or get out of the way.

Why has Michael A. Taylor shown at this stage of his career he deserves a spot on the team? 

[WhiteSox2023]

8 hours ago, PaleAleSox said:

You bring up McCarthy like they traded Tatis Jr when he was good. 

The running theme is that Getz continues to take back the wrong players in his trades, regardless of the scale of players involved.  Even with lesser trades, your team isn’t going to improve when you continue to take back negative WAR players over ~2 WAR players.

Edited February 16 by WhiteSox2023

[CaliSoxFanViaSWside]

3 hours ago, Dick Allen said:

Why has Michael A. Taylor shown at this stage of his career he deserves a spot on the team? 

Because he can field CF defensively way better than anyone else available for that little cost . He can also put Benintendi on the bench in the late innings or against LH starting pitchers .

He leads all MLB OFs in DRS with 54 runs saved since 2020. He's also likely their best Pinch runner and despite his inability to hit he usually generates positive WAR overall. Incrementally he'll do things to help them win and avoid another season like 2024.

Why are you so opposed to it ? Can you name one  OF who truly was available or  currently on the Sox for equal or less money who can provide what Taylor can defensively and on the basepaths ?

Certainly not Fletcher. Getz didn't even trust him to handle RF where he contributed decently defensively but he doesn't have the wheels to be as good defensively in CF , on the bases or as a late inning defensive replacement for Benintendi or occasional starter against LHP.

If Fletcher was the best you could do to replace Robert in CF that's pretty bad. He couldn't even earn RF and you're going to hand him CF ?

If you're thinking Slater in CF you're going to have to convince me that taking him out of the RF platoon roll against LHP and sticking him in CF full time in the event of a Robert trade helps OF depth ,RF weak side Platoon , late inning defense in LF pinchrunning and defense in CF and contributes  more to wins than just adding Taylor. What if Robert and Tauchman  are traded ? Then won't you need a left handed RF ( presumably Fletcher or Colas) to hold down the fort in RF unless you prefer Joey Gallo out there ?

If the goal is to win more than 41 games again but still have the best chance at the Top pick in every round of the draft you're going to have to come up with better reasons than it saves JR $2M dollars or blocks the 5'6", -.8 fWar Dominic Fletcher from playing CF.

 

 

 

[Jake]

I'm not necessarily against Taylor as a guy to fill out the roster/organization, but the fit with two other veteran outfielders added in the same offseason — along with the fact you have tens of millions invested into 2 of the 3 positions already — makes this confusing to me. Want Dominic Fletcher to have to earn a spot on the club? Great, that's fine, he really struggled at the dish last year and some underlying metrics are bad. But this kind of freezes him out when you give all these guaranteed contracts to old guys with limited upside. For this last spot on the bench, I'd prefer someone else kind of marginal *like* Fletcher who might give you years of value if he takes advantage of the opportunity.

[Chicago White Sox]

25 minutes ago, Jake said:

I'm not necessarily against Taylor as a guy to fill out the roster/organization, but the fit with two other veteran outfielders added in the same offseason — along with the fact you have tens of millions invested into 2 of the 3 positions already — makes this confusing to me. Want Dominic Fletcher to have to earn a spot on the club? Great, that's fine, he really struggled at the dish last year and some underlying metrics are bad. But this kind of freezes him out when you give all these guaranteed contracts to old guys with limited upside. For this last spot on the bench, I'd prefer someone else kind of marginal *like* Fletcher who might give you years of value if he takes advantage of the opportunity.

This only makes sense if you feel there is a 90% or better chance of Robert being moved by the end of camp.  Carrying five guys who can only play the OF just doesn’t make sense from a roster design standpoint.

[Bob Sacamano]

16 minutes ago, Chicago White Sox said:

This only makes sense if you feel there is a 90% or better chance of Robert being moved by the end of camp.  Carrying five guys who can only play the OF just doesn’t make sense from a roster design standpoint.

I’m with you and think Robert will be moved

[CaliSoxFanViaSWside]

13 minutes ago, Chicago White Sox said:

This only makes sense if you feel there is a 90% or better chance of Robert being moved by the end of camp.  Carrying five guys who can only play the OF just doesn’t make sense from a roster design standpoint.

I think it makes sense just for the possibility Robert may get traded before the season . The longer you wait the less chance you have that Taylor is not there to replace Robert .

As far as roster construction goes it's a bit odd but Rojas can play the jack of all trades roll along with Baldwin playing SS if Colson Montgomery isn't just handed SS.

I'm rather interested in seeing how Catcher plays out during the preseason with McKinven. Him and Fuller have a lot of work to do.

[CaliSoxFanViaSWside]

48 minutes ago, Jake said:

I'm not necessarily against Taylor as a guy to fill out the roster/organization, but the fit with two other veteran outfielders added in the same offseason — along with the fact you have tens of millions invested into 2 of the 3 positions already — makes this confusing to me. Want Dominic Fletcher to have to earn a spot on the club? Great, that's fine, he really struggled at the dish last year and some underlying metrics are bad. But this kind of freezes him out when you give all these guaranteed contracts to old guys with limited upside. For this last spot on the bench, I'd prefer someone else kind of marginal *like* Fletcher who might give you years of value if he takes advantage of the opportunity.

Fletcher has shown no signs whatsoever since his arrival in the minors or major last year of being capable of providing value. I have more faith in Colas providing value and we all know how deep Colas is buried on the depth chart.

[Chicago White Sox]

26 minutes ago, CaliSoxFanViaSWside said:

I think it makes sense just for the possibility Robert may get traded before the season . The longer you wait the less chance you have that Taylor is not there to replace Robert .

As far as roster construction goes it's a bit odd but Rojas can play the jack of all trades roll along with Baldwin playing SS if Colson Montgomery isn't just handed SS.

I'm rather interested in seeing how Catcher plays out during the preseason with McKinven. Him and Fuller have a lot of work to do.

Under no circumstance can I justify a roster for what will likely be a 105 to 110 loss team having five veteran OFs.  If there was a good chance we were going to keep Robert and Benintendi but also wanted a legitimate backup CF, then we should have prioritized Taylor over Slater at the time.  It’s simply bad roster design to have this many veterans without positional flexibility and any trade upside.  Again, I am pretty confident they will trade Robert this spring and as such this move makes more sense as a CF placeholder.