May 7 Game Thread

[Lip Man 1]

13 minutes ago, WhiteSox2023 said:

Hey, give Getz some credit.  This team is on pace for 44 wins.  That’s a whole 3 win improvement over last year’s record setting team.  What an amazing GM!

But remember..none of this NONE of this is his fault in the minds of some. 😉

[caulfield12]

White Sox (0-3)

26th in Runs Scored per game (3.46)

 

Royals (3-0)

27th in Runs Scored per game (3.39)

[greg775]

I really thought our improved club could beat KC two or three in this series cause they'd be so overconfident. Darn.

Why'd the Sox lose? Fathom had a nice post "I’m so unbelievably tired of having to watch guys like Palacios, Taylor, Maton and Amaya." True dat. Those players are so bad they on a given night are hard to win despite of. Actually should cut all four players now. Nobody should dispute that.

[Lip Man 1]

11 minutes ago, greg775 said:

I really thought our improved club could beat KC two or three in this series cause they'd be so overconfident. Darn.

Why'd the Sox lose? Fathom had a nice post "I’m so unbelievably tired of having to watch guys like Palacios, Taylor, Maton and Amaya." True dat. Those players are so bad they on a given night are hard to win despite of. Actually should cut all four players now. Nobody should dispute that.

Even more revealing if you cut those guys probably NO ONE would pick them up.

The White Sox are the last destination where players go to die in their careers. 

[caulfield12]

Did some math/s...

In 81% of their games, or 30/37, they're averaging 2.48 runs per game.  67 runs scored.  Good for a 3-27 record.  A robust 10% winning percentage.

In the other 7 games, they've scored 61 runs on 8/11/10/9/8/8/7 runs scored in those specific games.   Unsurprisingly resulting in a 7-0 record.

 

They've scored 5 runs twice, 1-1 in those games.

They've scored 4 runs twice, 0-2 in those games

They've scored 3 runs eight times, 2-10 in those games.

They've scored 2 runs five times, 0-5 record.

They've scored 1 run five times, 0-5 record

They've been shut out 4 times as well.  0-4 record

 

A scintillating 2-26 when they score 0-4 runs!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

 

And yet we clearly need more of Nick Maton, Jacob Amaya, Palacios and Vaughn....and are not even willing to try Elko, Julks, Fletcher or utility guy Tristan Gray

 

Edited May 8 by caulfield12

[caulfield12]

27 minutes ago, greg775 said:

I really thought our improved club could beat KC two or three in this series cause they'd be so overconfident. Darn.

Why'd the Sox lose? Fathom had a nice post "I’m so unbelievably tired of having to watch guys like Palacios, Taylor, Maton and Amaya." True dat. Those players are so bad they on a given night are hard to win despite of. Actually should cut all four players now. Nobody should dispute that.

Greg, they don't have a CFer for AFTER they trade Robert...unless you want to look at Greg Jones and aren't expecting him to hit more than .150ish.

Believe me, you don't want to watch Palacios or Baldwin in CF too often.

[fathom]

2 hours ago, WhiteSox2023 said:

Hey, give Getz some credit.  This team is on pace for 44 wins.  That’s a whole 3 win improvement over last year’s record setting team.  What an amazing GM!

Can we send Getz to the Arizona complex

[kitekrazy]

1 hour ago, caulfield12 said:

Greg, they don't have a CFer for AFTER they trade Robert...unless you want to look at Greg Jones and aren't expecting him to hit more than .150ish.

Believe me, you don't want to watch Palacios or Baldwin in CF too often.

and probably never.........I guess if appeases the prospect humpers.   Next season they will find someone else really bad at baseball to replace him.  They hare hoping for a naive GM not named Chris Getz. 

[caulfield12]

49 minutes ago, kitekrazy said:

and probably never.........I guess if appeases the prospect humpers.   Next season they will find someone else really bad at baseball to replace him.  They hare hoping for a naive GM not named Chris Getz. 

We'll see if they can win a game against the woeful Marlins this weekend.

After Meyer, they're facing Edward Cabrera (6.29 ERA) and Sandy Alcantara (who might be the biggest "get" on the trade market, but he's currently struggling coming back from TJS and sporting an 8.42 ERA)...

[Chimpton]

18 minutes ago, caulfield12 said:

We'll see if they can win a game against the woeful Marlins this weekend.

After Meyer, they're facing Edward Cabrera (6.29 ERA) and Sandy Alcantara (who might be the biggest "get" on the trade market, but he's currently struggling coming back from TJS and sporting an 8.42 ERA)...

We all know that struggling pitchers become Cy Young contenders when they pitch against the White Sox.

[The Mighty Mite]

The Sox could have won all three games, I’m seeing guys at the plate with horrible at bats swinging at pitches head high or down in the dirt,  granted some are just plain bad hitters but maybe try something different like maybe a bunt or working the count, they have no idea what manufacturing runs mean. How much longer before they give Elko a shot.

Edited May 8 by The Mighty Mite

[socksless joe]

8 hours ago, Lip Man 1 said:

But remember..none of this NONE of this is his fault in the minds of some. 😉

Pretty much none does. The fault belongs to the chairman and none other. We will never know if Getz is a good or bad GM. Never ever.

When there is a new owner there will be a new from office. With some pitchers a catcher and what is in our minor leagues we hopefully won't have much to complain about.

 

[Kyyle23]

6 hours ago, kitekrazy said:

and probably never.........I guess if appeases the prospect humpers.   Next season they will find someone else really bad at baseball to replace him.  They hare hoping for a naive GM not named Chris Getz. 

Talking about trading Robert isn’t prospect humping.  It’s facing the reality that Luis is not staying past his current contract and understanding that he is gonna walk out the door with zero compensation to the Sox if you do not do so 

in the rankings of baseball fans/people, the “I just don’t get it, I don’t understand why you have to trade a guy” people are far below the “prospect humpers”

[CaliSoxFanViaSWside]

9 hours ago, caulfield12 said:

Did some math/s...

In 81% of their games, or 30/37, they're averaging 2.48 runs per game.  67 runs scored.  Good for a 3-27 record.  A robust 10% winning percentage.

In the other 7 games, they've scored 61 runs on 8/11/10/9/8/8/7 runs scored in those specific games.   Unsurprisingly resulting in a 7-0 record.

 

They've scored 5 runs twice, 1-1 in those games.

They've scored 4 runs twice, 0-2 in those games

They've scored 3 runs eight times, 2-10 in those games.

They've scored 2 runs five times, 0-5 record.

They've scored 1 run five times, 0-5 record

They've been shut out 4 times as well.  0-4 record

 

A scintillating 2-26 when they score 0-4 runs!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

 

And yet we clearly need more of Nick Maton, Jacob Amaya, Palacios and Vaughn....and are not even willing to try Elko, Julks, Fletcher or utility guy Tristan Gray

 

No need to rush things. It's a long season.Give everyone a chance to turn things around. Imagine the haul we'll get for Robert and the others once they get hot !

Obviously I'm being sarcastic. Apparently there's a problem. Apparently the budget is tied to attendance. Attendance depends on a winning or at least a youthful impactful product. But they still need to find ways to get more prospects. Robert  needs to get and stay hot. For that to happen more often pitchers have to feel threatened by the hitter following him in order to stop walking him. I know that's not Vaughn. Pitchers know it's not Vaughn .Quero hasn't hit any HRs yet.  They need a power hitter behind Robert and the closest thing the Sox have to that is Elko yet he remains in the minors while the Sox wait for his stats to cool down instead of giving him a reason to get excited and contribute and feel his improvement means something to a team struggling to score runs and win. And quite possibly also help Robert be better and get Sox fans a little more willing to show up when the weather is nicer.

Can't say I blame anyone for not wanting to help JR, but maybe think of it as helping the future of the Sox and it's future owner. If there's room in the budget you can't beat fun at the old ballpark. I know it's more fun when the team you root for wins but if you're bringing young children they care more about just having fun with mom and dad.

Of course a picnic at your local park is a lot less expensive. Bring a bat and a ball of some kind. Treasure those moments.They don't last long. We tend to get a little manic about our team .

[Quin]

14 hours ago, WhiteSox2023 said:

Some teams draft a Bobby Witt.  Others draft Colson Montgomery.

The Sox were like, 4 games from drafting Witt. The Royals just sucked more that year.

[T R U]

I understand that the majority of this roster is junk but I can't understand why a guy like Palacios is leading off, ever. We need all the offensive help we can get and this is the guy you want getting the most at bats?

The roster sucks, but you can still make better decisions in regard to lineup construction and we just aren't. There is some different oddball lineup seemingly every day. I don't get it. 

[caulfield12]

Batters CWS	B	HR	RBI	SB	AVG	OPS
MeidrothSS	R	0	2	3	.245	.627
Vargas, M3B	R	2	12	1	.225	.653
QueroC	S	0	8	0	.291	.736
Robert Jr.CF	R	5	16	15	.190	.642
Vaughn1B	R	3	14	0	.182	.506
PalaciosDH	L	1	4	0	.179	.535
Sosa, L2B	R	2	10	0	.246	.594
BaldwinLF	S	3	15	2	.250	.667
Taylor, MRF	R	1	6	3	.197	.588

[CaliSoxFanViaSWside]

2 hours ago, socksless joe said:

Pretty much none does. The fault belongs to the chairman and none other. We will never know if Getz is a good or bad GM. Never ever.

When there is a new owner there will be a new from office. With some pitchers a catcher and what is in our minor leagues we hopefully won't have much to complain about.

 

I agree. Look at Venable . You can question his lineup or decision making all you want but he's got  nothing to work with. Getz has no money to work with so he's reduced to signing AAAA types or veterans who had a bad year looking for playing time so they can keep getting a sweet payday. Even that $800K minimum wage is  like hitting the lottery to working stiffs. You can't look good signing those types of players ever . Of course there are other things he does. He makes trades. Seems like he can make a good trade when he has a great player if the Crochet trade means anything. Prospects are a crapshoot in trade just like in the draft. The younger they are the more chances to fail or succeed they have. Scouting and development means more than ever . I guess that's why he hired people he thinks will help with that and revamped R & D and doing more internationally to attract more Dominicans. He's made internal changes that are very hard to judge for a number of years. Internationally players who make the majors and have some good years are key yet that could take years to know unless you get a guy like Tatis, Jr who blossomed  very quickly .But the Sox only had him for a very short period  of time before a smarter GM swiped him. Things like that tend to happen when you lack experience , or make personnel decisions on your own. Unfortunately 1st time GMs are Rookies too. The veteran GMs will try to pull the wool over your eyes . Trades will look really bad unless those young prospects produce immediately. Braden Montgomery, Meidroth , Teel , Gonzalez so far so good. Thorpe, Zavala, Iriarte not so good. Jeral Perez, Vargas, Albertus kind of a mixed bag right now but it looked really bad for a while.

It does get frustrating for fans because there is just so much failure when all you bring in are failed MLB players looking to prove they belong. Good players make coaches look good, bad players make everyone look bad. Most of them aren't prospects any more but in their prime years those AAA types in their mid to late 20s with perhaps one or 2 last shots, while at their physical peak, to find the magic. It mostly never happens. Turning turds into silver is a tough way to get a good reputation. You're lucky even with their willingness to try new things to find a way to unlock the talent. The talent is just likely not good  enough.

We call it rearranging the deck chairs on the Titanic for good reason. They all look the same and moving them around on a sinking ship isn't going to avert the disaster .

It's hard to see a rhyme or reason most of the time when you focus on the terrible players , losses piling up and the movement or lack of movement of those chairs. It's a rinse and repeat cycle that still leaves us with that sinking, we're doomed, feeling.

[caulfield12]

Maton Thaiss Amaya Rojas your bench...yikes

Thaiss and Rojas are fine...but the other two have to go.

Rojas is going to have to play SS more and more....or he just plays 2B when they pull the plug on Sosa.

[Kyyle23]

13 minutes ago, CaliSoxFanViaSWside said:

I agree. Look at Venable . You can question his lineup or decision making all you want but he's got  nothing to work with. Getz has no money to work with so he's reduced to signing AAAA types or veterans who had a bad year looking for playing time so they can keep getting a sweet payday. Even that $800K minimum wage is  like hitting the lottery to working stiffs. You can't look good signing those types of players ever . Of course there are other things he does. He makes trades. Seems like he can make a good trade when he has a great player if the Crochet trade means anything. Prospects are a crapshoot in trade just like in the draft. The younger they are the more chances to fail or succeed they have. Scouting and development means more than ever . I guess that's why he hired people he thinks will help with that and revamped R & D and doing more internationally to attract more Dominicans. He's made internal changes that are very hard to judge for a number of years. Internationally players who make the majors and have some good years are key yet that could take years to know unless you get a guy like Tatis, Jr who blossomed  very quickly .But the Sox only had him for a very short period  of time before a smarter GM swiped him. Things like that tend to happen when you lack experience , or make personnel decisions on your own. Unfortunately 1st time GMs are Rookies too. The veteran GMs will try to pull the wool over your eyes . Trades will look really bad unless those young prospects produce immediately. Braden Montgomery, Meidroth , Teel , Gonzalez so far so good. Thorpe, Zavala, Iriarte not so good. Jeral Perez, Vargas, Albertus kind of a mixed bag right now but it looked really bad for a while.

It does get frustrating for fans because there is just so much failure when all you bring in are failed MLB players looking to prove they belong. Good players make coaches look good, bad players make everyone look bad. Most of them aren't prospects any more but in their prime years those AAA types in their mid to late 20s with perhaps one or 2 last shots, while at their physical peak, to find the magic. It mostly never happens. Turning turds into silver is a tough way to get a good reputation. You're lucky even with their willingness to try new things to find a way to unlock the talent. The talent is just likely not good  enough.

We call it rearranging the deck chairs on the Titanic for good reason. They all look the same and moving them around on a sinking ship isn't going to avert the disaster .

It's hard to see a rhyme or reason most of the time when you focus on the terrible players , losses piling up and the movement or lack of movement of those chairs. It's a rinse and repeat cycle that still leaves us with that sinking, we're doomed, feeling.

 

[caulfield12]

16 minutes ago, CaliSoxFanViaSWside said:

I agree. Look at Venable . You can question his lineup or decision making all you want but he's got  nothing to work with. Getz has no money to work with so he's reduced to signing AAAA types or veterans who had a bad year looking for playing time so they can keep getting a sweet payday. Even that $800K minimum wage is  like hitting the lottery to working stiffs. You can't look good signing those types of players ever . Of course there are other things he does. He makes trades. Seems like he can make a good trade when he has a great player if the Crochet trade means anything. Prospects are a crapshoot in trade just like in the draft. The younger they are the more chances to fail or succeed they have. Scouting and development means more than ever . I guess that's why he hired people he thinks will help with that and revamped R & D and doing more internationally to attract more Dominicans. He's made internal changes that are very hard to judge for a number of years. Internationally players who make the majors and have some good years are key yet that could take years to know unless you get a guy like Tatis, Jr who blossomed  very quickly .But the Sox only had him for a very short period  of time before a smarter GM swiped him. Things like that tend to happen when you lack experience , or make personnel decisions on your own. Unfortunately 1st time GMs are Rookies too. The veteran GMs will try to pull the wool over your eyes . Trades will look really bad unless those young prospects produce immediately. Braden Montgomery, Meidroth , Teel , Gonzalez so far so good. Thorpe, Zavala, Iriarte not so good. Jeral Perez, Vargas, Albertus kind of a mixed bag right now but it looked really bad for a while.

It does get frustrating for fans because there is just so much failure when all you bring in are failed MLB players looking to prove they belong. Good players make coaches look good, bad players make everyone look bad. Most of them aren't prospects any more but in their prime years those AAA types in their mid to late 20s with perhaps one or 2 last shots, while at their physical peak, to find the magic. It mostly never happens. Turning turds into silver is a tough way to get a good reputation. You're lucky even with their willingness to try new things to find a way to unlock the talent. The talent is just likely not good  enough.

We call it rearranging the deck chairs on the Titanic for good reason. They all look the same and moving them around on a sinking ship isn't going to avert the disaster .

It's hard to see a rhyme or reason most of the time when you focus on the terrible players , losses piling up and the movement or lack of movement of those chairs. It's a rinse and repeat cycle that still leaves us with that sinking, we're doomed, feeling.

Rodon in 2021 and Profar last year (steroids)...hard to think of many under $3 million.

The Rays stuck with Aranda through two really disappointing years...but he was already in their system.

 

Really comes down to the draft.  Jaren Duran in the 7th round and Campbell in the 4th?  Tanner Houck 12th round.  That's almost unreal success for the Red Sox outside of the first 2-3 rounds.

Edited May 8 by caulfield12

[The Mighty Mite]

38 minutes ago, caulfield12 said:

Rodon in 2021 and Profar last year (steroids)...hard to think of many under $3 million.

The Rays stuck with Aranda through two really disappointing years...but he was already in their system.

 

Really comes down to the draft.  Jaren Duran in the 7th round and Campbell in the 4th?  Tanner Houck 12th round.  That's almost unreal success for the Red Sox outside of the first 2-3 rounds.

I always liked Aranda, never got much playing time but now that he’s a regular he’s producing, I’d take him over Vaughn in a heartbeat.