2025 WS- Dodgers/Blue Jays

[WestEddy]

32 minutes ago, WhiteSox2023 said:

You were commenting on how the Dodgers own the Japanese market.  It’s not hard when some owners bow out before the guy is even officially a free agent.

Wait a minute. Do you actually mean to say that when the White Sox were heading for a 100-loss season in 2023, when they had no hope for a salvageable 2024, when Reinsdorf had just fired his GM and VPBO were looking at another rebuild, and then said, no, we won't be bidding on Ohtani, THAT drove him to sign with the Dodgers? LMFAO!!

No, the White Sox haven't been active in the Asian market, much. The Dodgers have a legacy right now. There was a whole debate about how Sasaki didn't even seriously entertain any other teams' offers. Every single player transaction in the league doesn't have to be Jerry Reinsdorf's fault. 

[caulfield12]

51 minutes ago, WestEddy said:

You seem to be picking other things to argue that nobody mentioned so that you don't have to address the unassailable points I made. That's okay. 

The White Sox minor league rankings have been used as one of the primary supports or foundations of the rebuild over the last 2-3 years.

Since you keep circling around to bringing up the White Sox, I've noticed you seem truly anxious that the White Sox don't have a can't miss All-Star at every position in the high minors right now to ensure they'll start a dynasty, soon. And that they don't have a good 6-10 can't miss ace starters lined up to account for some injuries. It just seems weird that a truly elite system in the game doesn't have an heir apparent for the outfield ready to take over this next season. One would think they'd have 3 top 20 in the game prospects at AAA fight it out in spring training. 

You said, "You're making the argument that Betts, Freeman, Teoscar, Muncy (soon to be replaced by Murakami) and Ohtani should be blamed for wanting to play there."

No, I'm not. I've never said that. You just said that. I'm not you posting on your account. 

How many teams can produce prospects to displace three former/current MVPs including the greatest player in the history lol???

Nobody's asking for them to kick people off the team and sub in minor leaguers. If they had home-grown, perennial All-Stars at a position, they wouldn't have to go out and sign a free agent. It's one thing to develop guys that listicle writers fall in love with and overhype. It's quite another to develop a team that grows and graduates together. 

 

 

On any other team in baseball (other than the Dodgers), Hope and dePaula would be fighting it out for a starting outfield spot next year.

See Cubs, Caissie over Kyle Tucker because of the cost savings/opportunity cost.

Because the Dodgers are expected to win the WS every year...they might instead trade for a vet.

It's just like if they replace Muncy with Murakami.  They don't have to...Muncy has a club option at just $10 million, but they still might pull the trigger to upgrade before Max finally hits a cliff.

 

Ohtani Yamamoto and Sasaki all wanted to play where they could win a WS.

Period.

Absolutely zero to do with JR.  They probably don't even know that he exists, as far as they're concerned.

Toronto Giants Yankees Mets Padres all offered equal (or more) money for all of those guys.

 

https://www.mlb.com/milb/prospects/dodgers

7 outfield/SS prospects in their Top 10, including another Korean.

White Sox have Braden and Carlson and maybe Bonemer.

Edited November 3 by caulfield12

[WestEddy]

5 minutes ago, caulfield12 said:

On any other team in baseball (other than the Dodgers), Hope and dePaula would be fighting it out for a starting outfield spot next year.

See Cubs, Caissie over Kyle Tucker because of the cost savings/opportunity cost.

Because the Dodgers are expected to win the WS every year...they might instead trade for a vet.

It's just like if they replace Muncy with Murakami.  They don't have to...Muncy has a club option at just $10 million, but they still might pull the trigger to upgrade before Max finally hits a cliff.

Hope/dePaula would be a smarter move than tying up tons of money in Tucker. And Murakami's kind of an unknown at this point. 

[caulfield12]

2 minutes ago, WestEddy said:

Hope/dePaula would be a smarter move than tying up tons of money in Tucker. And Murakami's kind of an unknown at this point. 

Sure...that's why they can get him for only $175-225 million rather than $300+ million, which was the suggested price a year ago before he missed 2/3rds of the NPB season.

[caulfield12]

2 hours ago, WestEddy said:

Wait a minute. Do you actually mean to say that when the White Sox were heading for a 100-loss season in 2023, when they had no hope for a salvageable 2024, when Reinsdorf had just fired his GM and VPBO were looking at another rebuild, and then said, no, we won't be bidding on Ohtani, THAT drove him to sign with the Dodgers? LMFAO!!

No, the White Sox haven't been active in the Asian market, much. The Dodgers have a legacy right now. There was a whole debate about how Sasaki didn't even seriously entertain any other teams' offers. Every single player transaction in the league doesn't have to be Jerry Reinsdorf's fault. 

Sasaki looked very seriously at SD and Toronto....

[caulfield12]

https://sports.yahoo.com/article/dodgers-bad-baseball-why-world-160635412.html

“Small market owners would tell you the Dodgers should be cheaper. If the Dodgers didn’t try so hard at roster construction it would be easier to keep up. Is that how competition works?

The Dodgers won the World Series because they’re the most expensive team. And because they are good at spending money – which, as the New York Mets demonstrated this season, is not always a given. Even the fans and defenders would have to agree. It’s impossible to separate the strength of the club – an All-Star squad of nine-figure free agents – from the success. It costs a lot to be the premier destination in the sport. To pay Mookie Betts what the Red Sox wouldn’t. To pay Freddie Freeman what the Braves wouldn’t. To pay for practically an entire ballot of Cy Young contenders, something that means it’s not too much of a problem if some of them have to spend the bulk of the regular season on the injured list.

And then there’s Ohtani. For six seasons the second coming of Babe Ruth languished on LA’s other team. Even alongside the unassuming greatness of Mike Trout, Ohtani on the Angels never made it to the national stage of the postseason. That’s a problem with baseball; it takes more than one or two elite players to build a winning club.

Baseball fans loved Ohtani when he was an Angel. But now they love him and they get to watch him start Game 7 of the World Series.”

[caulfield12]

https://global.espn.com/mlb/story/_/id/46813024/world-series-2025-clinching-night-mlb-champions-clinching-night-yamamoto

Jeff Passan article on Yamamoto and his pitching guru/mentor in Osaka...

 

https://www.si.com/mlb/los-angeles-dodgers-baseball-modern-dynasty-2025-world-series-win-digital-cover

Edited November 3 by caulfield12

[WhiteSox2023]

5 hours ago, WestEddy said:

Wait a minute. Do you actually mean to say that when the White Sox were heading for a 100-loss season in 2023, when they had no hope for a salvageable 2024, when Reinsdorf had just fired his GM and VPBO were looking at another rebuild, and then said, no, we won't be bidding on Ohtani, THAT drove him to sign with the Dodgers? LMFAO!!

No, the White Sox haven't been active in the Asian market, much. The Dodgers have a legacy right now. There was a whole debate about how Sasaki didn't even seriously entertain any other teams' offers. Every single player transaction in the league doesn't have to be Jerry Reinsdorf's fault. 

I said Reinsdorf didn’t even fake interest in the best player in the history of baseball.  What I said was true, and it was pathetic.

[caulfield12]

2 hours ago, WhiteSox2023 said:

I said Reinsdorf didn’t even fake interest in the best player in the history of baseball.  What I said was true, and it was pathetic.

We're going to hear a lot about how passing the Twins for fourth place is the next indicator of progress.

But it's far from guaranteed.

[WestEddy]

6 hours ago, WhiteSox2023 said:

I said Reinsdorf didn’t even fake interest in the best player in the history of baseball.  What I said was true, and it was pathetic.

No, it wasn't. They were staring into the jaws of another rebuild just then. It would have been pathetic to pay lip service to pursuing a player who would have zero interest in their situation at that time, or for the next 5 years. 

People get mad because the front office won't "tell them the truth", yet when they do, they fall on the ground and weep for hurt feelings. 

[caulfield12]

7 minutes ago, WestEddy said:

No, it wasn't. They were staring into the jaws of another rebuild just then. It would have been pathetic to pay lip service to pursuing a player who would have zero interest in their situation at that time, or for the next 5 years. 

People get mad because the front office won't "tell them the truth", yet when they do, they fall on the ground and weep for hurt feelings. 

It's a violation of the Collective Bargaining Agreement to publicly utter those words.

And how did it benefit the fan base in any way?

(Did the Royals ever make a statement saying they couldn't afford to extend Bobby Witt, Jr.?)

Jud demoralizing to hear it said about.

Everyone in the world knows he could only realistically sign with 4-5 teams, although some might argue it's actually closer to 13-14 teams.

[WhiteSox2023]

11 minutes ago, WestEddy said:

No, it wasn't. They were staring into the jaws of another rebuild just then. It would have been pathetic to pay lip service to pursuing a player who would have zero interest in their situation at that time, or for the next 5 years. 

People get mad because the front office won't "tell them the truth", yet when they do, they fall on the ground and weep for hurt feelings. 

The Sox are in a perpetual rebuild these days because Jerry refuses to spend money and likely won’t at all until he sells the team in 2029.

When the best player in the history of baseball becomes available, you should have some interest.  Jerry doesn’t need you making excuses for him.

[caulfield12]

22 minutes ago, WhiteSox2023 said:

The Sox are in a perpetual rebuild these days because Jerry refuses to spend money and likely won’t at all until he sells the team in 2029.

When the best player in the history of baseball becomes available, you should have some interest.  Jerry doesn’t need you making excuses for him.

Or you should be asking why you can't afford $46 million (inflation adjusted) when he's bringing in $100-150 million in additional revenues ally himself for LA.

His contract more than pays for itself.

And that's not counting all the other Japanese and Korean players now even more likely to join the Dodgers.

 

"How do you give a guy $325 million without ever throwing a pitch in MLB?"

— Josh Reddick (@JRedDubDeuce) December 22, 2023

 

Well, the answer to that for LA is all explained in the Jeff Passan article copied above.

 

"Watching people work at his clinic in Osaka is special," said Galen Carr, the Dodgers' vice president of player personnel and a fixture in international scouting. "They do things with their bodies -- contortions and twisting and balance and strength -- and it's body weight, not stuff we do here. And somehow that kid throws 98 and he's 5-10. ... Maybe we can learn something from him."

Andrew Friedman, the Dodgers president of baseball operations, wasn't sold until he saw it himself. At the Kyocera Dome in Osaka, he watched Yamamoto long-toss from the right-field corner to home plate. Yamamoto wasn't taking crow hops or hurling parabolic throws. "I wish someone had videoed me watching that before the game," Friedman said, "because my mouth was agape." Even if the list of short, slim, front-line right-handed pitchers could be counted on one hand, the Dodgers were already perfectly happy to get into the outlier business, giving Ohtani a 10-year, $700 million contract Dec. 9.

Edited November 3 by caulfield12

[WestEddy]

13 minutes ago, caulfield12 said:

And how did it benefit the fan base in any way?

You're kidding, right? Like, you're struggling to argue with anything. People here still openly weep about Reinsdorf saying this wasn't a rebuild. They still act like they're paralyzed by confusion over that remark. "We have a seat at the table" is posted at least once every couple of days here. Tell me how "Anybody would have great interest in Ohtani" helps anybody. 

 

14 minutes ago, WhiteSox2023 said:

The Sox are in a perpetual rebuild these days because Jerry refuses to spend money and likely won’t at all until he sells the team in 2029.

When the best player in the history of baseball becomes available, you should have some interest.  Jerry doesn’t need you making excuses for him.

Jerry also doesn't need you whining because he didn't give you another punch line to whine about for the next 6 years. It's a good thing that Chris Getz is doing such a great job pointing this franchise in the right direction that you only have nonsense to complain about anymore. 

[caulfield12]

13 minutes ago, WestEddy said:

You're kidding, right? Like, you're struggling to argue with anything. People here still openly weep about Reinsdorf saying this wasn't a rebuild. They still act like they're paralyzed by confusion over that remark. "We have a seat at the table" is posted at least once every couple of days here. Tell me how "Anybody would have great interest in Ohtani" helps anybody. 

 

Jerry also doesn't need you whining because he didn't give you another punch line to whine about for the next 6 years. It's a good thing that Chris Getz is doing such a great job pointing this franchise in the right direction that you only have nonsense to complain about anymore. 

All of these things were better off left unsaid.

You know which phrase is the most popular to repeat?

 

“I don’t have a lot of time left. I don’t want to go through a long rebuild. I only expect to be here another 10 years,” Reinsdorf said during a rare media session.

.....

“That moved me to the thought — what is it I owe to the fans? I think one of the things I owe the fans is to get better as fast as we can possibly get better. Speed is of the essence. I don’t want a long-term proposition.

“It became clear to me that he [Getz] would be one of the major candidates, alongside these other candidates. And then when I started thinking about the SPEED (my emphasis) I owe the fans, I realized that if you bring in somebody from the outside, it’s gonna take him a year, he’s gonna have to evaluate everybody in the organization. So you’ll lose a year."

 

 

Well thank god we have Getz so we can compete in 2029 now instead of 2030!!!

How the HELL are they acting like speed of the rebuild is a priority????

Total unadulterated B.S.

 

Edited November 3 by caulfield12

[WestEddy]

4 minutes ago, caulfield12 said:

All of these things were better off left unsaid.

You know which phrase is the most popular to repeat?

 

“That moved me to the thought — what is it I owe to the fans? I think one of the things I owe the fans is to get better as fast as we can possibly get better. Speed is of the essence. I don’t want a long-term proposition.

“It became clear to me that he [Getz] would be one of the major candidates, alongside these other candidates. And then when I started thinking about the speed I owe the fans, I realized that if you bring in somebody from the outside, it’s gonna take him a year, he’s gonna have to evaluate everybody in the organization. So you’ll lose a year."

 

Well thank god we have Getz so we can compete in 2029 now instead of 2030!!!

How the HELL are they acting like speed of the rebuild is a priority????

Thank you. You're proving my point. I agree with you, this was best left unsaid. 

[Harry Chappas]

Has anyone brought up the runner at third topic of him sliding.  I know the secondary lead was bad but if he doesn't slide he is safe.  He should have listened to Hawk.   Kind of the flip of the Jeter play. 

That was a great world series but is tarnished for me as I just can't back the Dodgers 

[WestEddy]

17 minutes ago, Harry Chappas said:

Has anyone brought up the runner at third topic of him sliding.  I know the secondary lead was bad but if he doesn't slide he is safe.  He should have listened to Hawk.   Kind of the flip of the Jeter play. 

That was a great world series but is tarnished for me as I just can't back the Dodgers 

Maybe it's just instinct. Or not realizing bags were loaded and there was a force out, not a tag play. 

[Harry Chappas]

31 minutes ago, WestEddy said:

Maybe it's just instinct. Or not realizing bags were loaded and there was a force out, not a tag play. 

Similar to the Brewer player not taking the HBP, instincts are one thing but awareness is another.   The coach especially at the MLB level needed to do a better job with that situation.

I also thought with 1st and 3rd, a squeeze would have been a good call with Vladdy at third or getting the guy on first moving.  You knew the pitch was going to be a breaking ball down in the zone to get the grounder and avoid the sac fly option.  It was a pitcher is impeccable control.

I know, all hindsight. 

[southsider2k5]

6 hours ago, caulfield12 said:

We're going to hear a lot about how passing the Twins for fourth place is the next indicator of progress.

But it's far from guaranteed.

People over-estimating the Twins then.  They are going to be awful, on top of maybe still having more selling to do.  Their farms system is deeper and better at the top, but that will take a couple of years to get to.

[WhiteSox2023]

2 hours ago, WestEddy said:

You're kidding, right? Like, you're struggling to argue with anything. People here still openly weep about Reinsdorf saying this wasn't a rebuild. They still act like they're paralyzed by confusion over that remark. "We have a seat at the table" is posted at least once every couple of days here. Tell me how "Anybody would have great interest in Ohtani" helps anybody. 

 

Jerry also doesn't need you whining because he didn't give you another punch line to whine about for the next 6 years. It's a good thing that Chris Getz is doing such a great job pointing this franchise in the right direction that you only have nonsense to complain about anymore. 

101-223.  Great job indeed.  Nonsense?  No.

[caulfield12]

2 hours ago, Harry Chappas said:

Similar to the Brewer player not taking the HBP, instincts are one thing but awareness is another.   The coach especially at the MLB level needed to do a better job with that situation.

I also thought with 1st and 3rd, a squeeze would have been a good call with Vladdy at third or getting the guy on first moving.  You knew the pitch was going to be a breaking ball down in the zone to get the grounder and avoid the sac fly option.  It was a pitcher is impeccable control.

I know, all hindsight. 

Varsho was striking out a ton, though...

[caulfield12]

2 hours ago, southsider2k5 said:

People over-estimating the Twins then.  They are going to be awful, on top of maybe still having more selling to do.  Their farms system is deeper and better at the top, but that will take a couple of years to get to.

Depends on Walker Jenkins' health and whether Ryan/Lopez (and maybe even Buxton) are all traded?

Holding onto Buxton after a healthy productive year?...been there, done that with Luis Robert.

[caulfield12]

The Dodgers acquired Rojas from the Miami Marlins in January 2023 for infielder Jacob Amaya, who since has been with three other organizations and is now a free agent. But Rojas isn’t the only Dodger who joined the team as a modest acquisition.

Through superior player development, the Dodgers often turn minor moves into mini-coups. Reliever Will Klein, who pitched four scoreless innings to close out the 18-inning victory in Game 3, is one example — he arrived from Seattle in a June trade for lefty Joe Jacques. Third baseman Max Muncy, who hit the eighth-inning home run in Game 7 that pulled the Dodgers within 4-3, is another. The Dodgers originally added Muncy as a minor-league free-agent signing in April 2017. His home run was the 16th of his career in the postseason, a franchise record.

https://www.nytimes.com/athletic/6770381/2025/11/02/los-angeles-dodgers-world-series-champions/?source=athletic_pulsenewsletter&campaign=15400823&userId=310262

Edited November 3 by caulfield12

[kitekrazy]

21 hours ago, southsider2k5 said:

Most prospects are overrated and overhyped in the long run.

yet we put so much faith in that, it's what fans of habitual losing teams do, the media and bloggers do the same. Bad habits are hard to break.  We equate the draft like it's the NFL or NBA,  Baseball has a much larger margin for error.