Sox, Cubs respond to Sun-Times column

[SSH2005]

Sox, Cubs respond to Sun-Times column

http://chicago.whitesox.mlb.com/cws/downlo...006/soxcubs.pdf

[DBAHO]

A joint PWN3ING. How long until Kotex Boy's Rebuttal I wonder.

[Wsoxmike59]

A joint PWN3ING. How long until Kotex Boy's Rebuttal I wonder.

 

I can still remember that douchebag Moronotti saying that "Chicago stops 5 minutes a day when Sosa comes to the plate"

 

When I read that idiotic statement of praise and worship Moronotti heaped upon the fraudulent slugger, I said "Yeah, only to curse him out though!" Effin Cheater and Fraud.

 

You could fit all the intelligent statements Kotex Boy has ever made regarding baseball on the back of a postage stamp!

[southsider2k5]

That is spectacular. Too bad a newspaper would never print something that is an intelligent rebuttal.

[Kyyle23]

This is gonna fire up Mariotti, I know that. He is going to be whining about this for months.

[WCSox]

Didn't read the Moronotti article, but I don't see how anybody can defend the way that Selig has handled the steroid issue.

[JoeBatterz]

Bud Selig might need steroids himself to help straighten out his neck muscles after twelve years of looking the other way

[RockRaines]

If anyone knows Mariotti, this is going to do nothing but make him feel like he has done his job. He wants reactions and press, good or bad.

[Texsox]

LMAO I love a good Mariotti rant.

[Balta1701]

I saw nothing in that Reinsdorf/Macphail piece other than the usual "passing the buck" that we've seen from almost every side on the steroid issue.

 

Selig knew it was a problem. But that mean players union wouldn't let us test for them.

 

Selig paid attention in 98, started an investigation, and the investigation was so fruitful that it only took 3 years and about 200 home runs each from Bonds and Sosa before they started a testing program.

 

Not to mention the fact that the first testing program was such an absolute f***ing joke that Reinsdorf's own team, the Chicago White Sox, staged a protest/revolt against the testing. They refused to take the first tests, so that their names would come up as positive tests, to try to guarantee testing the next year. This was Reinsdorf's own team doing the right thing revolting against the pathetic players Union and ownership testing agreements, and Reinsdorf still signs his name to a document defending that testing.

 

I don't like agreeing with Mariotti and disagreeing with JR, but I guess the fact that Macphail's name is on there makes me feel better about this. JR and AM are simply wrong, and they're just covering their asses.

[WCSox]

I saw nothing in that Reinsdorf/Macphail piece other than the usual "passing the buck" that we've seen from almost every side on the steroid issue.

 

Selig knew it was a problem.  But that mean players union wouldn't let us test for them.

 

Selig paid attention in 98, started an investigation, and the investigation was so fruitful that it only took 3 years and about 200 home runs each from Bonds and Sosa before they started a testing program.

 

Not to mention the fact that the first testing program was such an absolute f***ing joke that Reinsdorf's own team, the Chicago White Sox, staged a protest/revolt against the testing.  They refused to take the first tests, so that their names would come up as positive tests, to try to guarantee testing the next year.  This was Reinsdorf's own team doing the right thing revolting against the pathetic players Union and ownership testing agreements, and Reinsdorf still signs his name to a document defending that testing.

 

I don't like agreeing with Mariotti and disagreeing with JR, but I guess the fact that Macphail's name is on there makes me feel better about this.  JR and AM are simply wrong, and they're just covering their asses.

 

[YASNY]

I'm no big fan of Selig, but I believe his hands were tied by the union.

[Kyyle23]

I'm no big fan of Selig, but I believe his hands were tied by the union.

 

I dont know where I read it, but IIRC there was to be no labor deal unless steroid testing was left off the table when the last labor deal was negotiated, and the Union was pretty clear that if MLB was going to push for testing, then there would be a strike.

 

But I may not be recalling it correctly, its been a long time since I read any articles concerning the negotiation of the last labor deal.

[YASNY]

I dont know where I read it, but IIRC there was to be no labor deal unless steroid testing was left off the table when the last labor deal was negotiated, and the Union was pretty clear that if MLB was going to push for testing, then there would be a strike. 

 

But I may not be recalling it correctly, its been a long time since I read any articles concerning the negotiation of the last labor deal.

 

And, if you remember, the reason there wasn't a strike is because the fans let both sides know they were about to kill their golden goose. There is no way Selig could have forced the drug testing issue on the union at that time.

[southsideirish71]

A joint PWN3ING. How long until Kotex Boy's Rebuttal I wonder.

 

His stubby little fingers are hard at work right now I am sure. He is probably asking Skip Bayless and Woody for some pearls of wisdom to attack the Sox and Flubs this year.

[WCSox]

IIRC, steroid use had been going on in MLB since at least the late '80s. The owners had to know about it by the early '90s or so. I don't see why Selig couldn't have pushed for steroid testing after the '94 strike.

[YASNY]

IIRC, steroid use had been going on in MLB since at least the late '80s.  The owners had to know about it by the early '90s or so.  I don't see why Selig couldn't have pushed for steroid testing after the '94 strike.

 

Because the '94 strike was the worst thing to happen to baseball since 1919. There was nothing but bitter contentiousness between the owners and the union and the fans were majorly pissed. They had to get back to playing baseball, not fighting anymore battles.

Edited April 6, 2006 by YASNY

[Balta1701]

IIRC, steroid use had been going on in MLB since at least the late '80s.  The owners had to know about it by the early '90s or so.  I don't see why Selig couldn't have pushed for steroid testing after the '94 strike.

He did, but the Union wouldn't have had it. But that doesn't mean that there was nothing he could have done...his hands weren't tied. Congress was already involved in the strike through talking about the anti-trust exemption...he could have voiced concerns there. He could have used his "Bully pulpit" commissioner's chair to actually make it an issue. He could have talked about it in interviews. Or started an outside investigation like he just did. Hell, in like 88, fans in Boston were chanting "Steroids" at Canseco.

 

There was plenty of time for Selig, plenty of time for every owner, and plenty of time for the Player's union to take steps to prevent things from getting "Barry Bonds" bad. And since none of them did anything...there's more than enough blame to go around.

[WCSox]

Because the '94 strike was the worst thing to happen to baseball since 1919.  There was nothing but bitter contentiousness between the owners and the union and the fans were majorly pissed.  They had to get back to playing baseball, not fighting anymore battles.

 

I agree with that to a certain extent, but the owners sure could've used the issue to demonize the MLBPA. Given that the owners took most of the blame for the strike in the eyes of the fans (particularly Sox fans), exposing the steroids issue to the public and blaming the MLBPA for stone-walling them during negotiations would've been a smart tactical move.

 

Much, if not most, of the blame should be placed on the shoulders of the MLBPA, but the owners could've done something in '94 or even before.

[YASNY]

I agree with that to a certain extent, but the owners sure could've used the issue to demonize the MLBPA.  Given that the owners took most of the blame for the strike in the eyes of the fans (particularly Sox fans), exposing the steroids issue to the public and blaming the MLBPA for stone-walling them during negotiations would've been a smart tactical move.

 

Much, if not most, of the blame should be placed on the shoulders of the MLBPA, but the owners could've done something in '94 or even before.

 

So why is Selig being the only one raked over the coals in here? Not one person has mentioned Donald Fehr.

[southsider2k5]

So why is Selig being the only one raked over the coals in here?  Not one person has mentioned Donald Fehr.

 

Who actively worked to PREVENT drug testing... unlike Bud Selig.

[WCSox]

So why is Selig being the only one raked over the coals in here?  Not one person has mentioned Donald Fehr.

 

Good point. He and Orza are more to blame than Selig.

[Rowand44]

Who actively worked to PREVENT drug testing... unlike Bud Selig.

Bingo. Fehr and Orza are at fault for the lack of a drug testing policy for so many years.

[YASNY]

Bingo.  Fehr and Orza are at fault for the lack of a drug testing policy for so many years.

 

That's the way I see it. As contentious as the 'relationship' between the owners and the union was back then, there was no way Selig could taken a hardline stand on this issue. Baseball, as we know, would be dead.

[Balta1701]

If there is 1 person in baseball who could hang a sign saying "The buck stops here", it's Bud Selig.

 

Don Fehr's job is not to protect the integrity of the game. Bud Selig's job is. That is the key difference. Don Fehr's job is to represent his players and make things as good as possible for them. Bud Selig's job is to protect baseball.

 

Fehr takes his share of the blame because he was wrong, but he's certainly no where near the man at the top of the blame pyramid in my book.