Lemon_44 Posted August 3, 2009 Share Posted August 3, 2009 how come it always seems like the Sox's top pitching prospects are being said to have fastballs that top out 3-5 mph faster in the minors than what they actually show up with at the MLB level. Nunez, i know it was his debut, looks like another in a long line of supposed flame throwers that didn't show anywhere near the kind of fastball they were reported to have. The gun today had him at 91-93 while it was reported that he could bring it at 96-97. It was the same thing with Poreda and goes all the way back to Massett coming up. Does US cellular have a slow gun or are these guys a bit overhyped. I know the be all,end all is not how hard you throw but i was kind of disappointed when his first fastball showed at 91 today when i was expecting to see at least 95. The main thing is he got the out and looked pretty poised but still.......... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chw42 Posted August 3, 2009 Share Posted August 3, 2009 QUOTE (Lemon_44 @ Aug 2, 2009 -> 07:27 PM) how come it always seems like the Sox's top pitching prospects are being said to have fastballs that top out 3-5 mph faster in the minors than what they actually show up with at the MLB level. Nunez, i know it was his debut, looks like another in a long line of supposed flame throwers that didn't show anywhere near the kind of fastball they were reported to have. The gun today had him at 91-93 while it was reported that he could bring it at 96-97. It was the same thing with Poreda and goes all the way back to Massett coming up. Does US cellular have a slow gun or are these guys a bit overhyped. I know the be all,end all is not how hard you throw but i was kind of disappointed when his first fastball showed at 91 today when i was expecting to see at least 95. The main thing is he got the out and looked pretty poised but still.......... This isn't always true... I read that Richard featured a 91 MPH fastball last year before he came up and that he was more of a sinker baller. Turns out he throws 94-96 instead... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
caulfield12 Posted August 3, 2009 Share Posted August 3, 2009 (edited) Adkins Diaz Barcelo (although injuries wrecked his stuff b4 the majors) Rauch (he was never a devastating FB type of pitcher, from the beginning...but especially after the labrum tear) Poreda Ginter Corwin Malone Brian West Royce Ring Joe Valentine Danny Wright could rush it up there b4 injuries wiped him out, too. Kip Wells always had "ace" stuff, just couldn't put it all together mentally. You could argue that Buehrle, Garland (sort of ours) and Josh Fogg all enjoyed success at the big league level because of pitches other than a 4 season fastball. Richard is a good counter-example here. Just maturity and maybe his almost Ivan Drago-esque (Rocky III reference) workout regimen. Edited August 3, 2009 by caulfield12 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
southsider2k5 Posted August 3, 2009 Share Posted August 3, 2009 QUOTE (caulfield12 @ Aug 2, 2009 -> 07:41 PM) Adkins Diaz Barcelo (although injuries wrecked his stuff b4 the majors) Rauch (he was never a devastating FB type of pitcher, from the beginning...but especially after the labrum tear) Poreda Ginter Corwin Malone Brian West Royce Ring Joe Valentine Danny Wright could rush it up there b4 injuries wiped him out, too. Kip Wells always had "ace" stuff, just couldn't put it all together mentally. You could argue that Buehrle, Garland (sort of ours) and Josh Fogg all enjoyed success at the big league level because of pitches other than a 4 season fastball. Richard is a good counter-example here. Just maturity and maybe his almost Ivan Drago-esque (Rocky III reference) workout regimen. I love the 90's strikes back... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pumpkin Escobar Posted August 3, 2009 Share Posted August 3, 2009 I cant assume we have a slow fun since guys like Matty and Jenks used to run it up there. It is odd though - especially seeing Masset poppin 99 out there in Cinci. Just bad guns maybe down in the minors, exaggerated reports, etc... - which isnt uncommon. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dasox24 Posted August 3, 2009 Share Posted August 3, 2009 (edited) QUOTE (caulfield12 @ Aug 2, 2009 -> 07:41 PM) Richard is a good counter-example here. Just maturity and maybe his almost Ivan Drago-esque (Rocky III reference) workout regimen. How dare you? Ivan Drago was Rocky IV. Clubber Lang = Rocky III... I pity the fool who don't know that Edited August 3, 2009 by dasox24 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Marky Mark Posted August 3, 2009 Share Posted August 3, 2009 (edited) Just lost a lot of respect for Caulfield Edited August 3, 2009 by Markbilliards Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
scenario Posted August 3, 2009 Share Posted August 3, 2009 Who was reporting that Nunez was hitting 96-97??? Not anyone here that I'm aware of. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JPN366 Posted August 3, 2009 Share Posted August 3, 2009 QUOTE (scenario @ Aug 2, 2009 -> 09:45 PM) Who was reporting that Nunez was hitting 96-97??? Not anyone here that I'm aware of. I never said anything like that, if I recall correctly. He may have touched 96 once or twice, but not a lot. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CWSOX45 Posted August 3, 2009 Share Posted August 3, 2009 QUOTE (Lemon_44 @ Aug 2, 2009 -> 07:27 PM) how come it always seems like the Sox's top pitching prospects are being said to have fastballs that top out 3-5 mph faster in the minors than what they actually show up with at the MLB level. Nunez, i know it was his debut, looks like another in a long line of supposed flame throwers that didn't show anywhere near the kind of fastball they were reported to have. The gun today had him at 91-93 while it was reported that he could bring it at 96-97. It was the same thing with Poreda and goes all the way back to Massett coming up. Does US cellular have a slow gun or are these guys a bit overhyped. I know the be all,end all is not how hard you throw but i was kind of disappointed when his first fastball showed at 91 today when i was expecting to see at least 95. The main thing is he got the out and looked pretty poised but still.......... You have to remember where the information is coming from. Not many reporters venture to Winston-Salem and Binghamton to get a look at most of these guys. Most of these reports written are taken from one or two scouts perspectives, and most of the time these reports are usually incorrect. While someone may say that Nunez hits 95 on the gun, that might be what he maxed out at, where as his average fastball range is 89-92. It's entirely possible. Just remember when you read reports on prospects to always take it with a grain of salt. Just because Baseball America claims a guy is the #1 prospect in the organization doesn't mean he's going to pan out to be an excellent Major League player. There are very few players that are actually worth all the hype and attention they receive while in AA. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
danman31 Posted August 3, 2009 Share Posted August 3, 2009 QUOTE (Lemon_44 @ Aug 2, 2009 -> 07:27 PM) how come it always seems like the Sox's top pitching prospects are being said to have fastballs that top out 3-5 mph faster in the minors than what they actually show up with at the MLB level. Nunez, i know it was his debut, looks like another in a long line of supposed flame throwers that didn't show anywhere near the kind of fastball they were reported to have. The gun today had him at 91-93 while it was reported that he could bring it at 96-97. It was the same thing with Poreda and goes all the way back to Massett coming up. Does US cellular have a slow gun or are these guys a bit overhyped. I know the be all,end all is not how hard you throw but i was kind of disappointed when his first fastball showed at 91 today when i was expecting to see at least 95. The main thing is he got the out and looked pretty poised but still.......... According to Baseball America Nunez's fastball is 92-94 and touches 95. 96-97 should not have ever been said or reported. I've never heard that. 91-93 vs. 92-94 is nothing. Poreda topped out at 97 like the scouting report said. He didn't sit at 97, but topping out is different. That's where the problems start. Someone reads "fastball topped out at 95" or "touches 95" and expects to see 95 all the time. That's just not how it works. It may not even be you. Someone else saw a report of him hitting 96 on a good gun on a good night for him and worded their report poorly or someone didn't quote it properly. It's like a game of telephone. QUOTE (CWSOX45 @ Aug 2, 2009 -> 11:02 PM) Most of these reports written are taken from one or two scouts perspectives, and most of the time these reports are usually incorrect. While someone may say that Nunez hits 95 on the gun, that might be what he maxed out at, where as his average fastball range is 89-92. It's entirely possible. I wouldn't say most of the time they are incorrect, but obviously they can be. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
scenario Posted August 3, 2009 Share Posted August 3, 2009 One of the things many fans are not aware of with Poreda... He can hit high 90's when pitching out of the windup... but not out of the stretch. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
caulfield12 Posted August 3, 2009 Share Posted August 3, 2009 QUOTE (Markbilliards @ Aug 2, 2009 -> 09:21 PM) Just lost a lot of respect for Caulfield I should have known better...I have the "workout" tape of all-time with that soundtrack. My favorite, Eye of the Tiger, of course. Brigitte Nielsen used to be "hot" but she's so horrible now...and Dolph Lundgren always reminds me of the time when he, Seagal, and Jean Claude Van Damme were the at the top of action genre after Stallone and AH-NULD. NOW BACK TO OUR REGULARLY SCHEDULED THREAD. Yes, so strange to see Aardsma, Masset, Frank Francisco (was our property briefly) and McDougal all prospering. Four POWER RH arms, our biggest weakness currently. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lemon_44 Posted August 3, 2009 Author Share Posted August 3, 2009 i was basing it on the thread on page 2, the SN:scouting report on Nunez. It says a plus fastball(94-96) and a slider that is his key pitch to having success. I'm sure he may have been a little tight considering it was his ML debut but i didn't see anything close to what i'd consider a plus fastball. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
3 BeWareTheNewSox 5 Posted August 3, 2009 Share Posted August 3, 2009 What did Boone Logan used to throw here? I was listening to the Braves-Dodgers on ESPN Radio and they said he hit 97 and such (I don't think I remember him throwing that hard here? May help the US Cell gun theory if so), still didn't really help him tho Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
danman31 Posted August 3, 2009 Share Posted August 3, 2009 QUOTE (Lemon_44 @ Aug 2, 2009 -> 11:58 PM) i was basing it on the thread on page 2, the SN:scouting report on Nunez. It says a plus fastball(94-96) and a slider that is his key pitch to having success. I'm sure he may have been a little tight considering it was his ML debut but i didn't see anything close to what i'd consider a plus fastball. 94-96 might be pushing it, but you turned 94-96 to 96-97. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dick Allen Posted August 3, 2009 Share Posted August 3, 2009 (edited) QUOTE (scenario @ Aug 2, 2009 -> 11:34 PM) One of the things many fans are not aware of with Poreda... He can hit high 90's when pitching out of the windup... but not out of the stretch. I wondered why he would start an inning out of the stretch considering he was a starter, then when Torres had a start, he was always in the stretch. I just assumed it was something the White Sox may be doing with minor leaguers. I do know, some guys get their mechanics all screwed up with a wind up. I don't know why they wouldn't want him throwing 97 unless he cannot throw a strike. Edited August 3, 2009 by Dick Allen Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hogan873 Posted August 3, 2009 Share Posted August 3, 2009 QUOTE (3 BeWareTheNewSox 5 @ Aug 3, 2009 -> 12:36 AM) What did Boone Logan used to throw here? I was listening to the Braves-Dodgers on ESPN Radio and they said he hit 97 and such (I don't think I remember him throwing that hard here? May help the US Cell gun theory if so), still didn't really help him tho From what I remember, Logan could throw mid 90's, but not as consistently as Thornton does. I don't think he used his fastball as much, either. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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