Is that rumored or speculation by you?

It would make sense...they certainly don't need an OF'er

The trade is now official. Here's the full trade details (ESPN)

 

PHILLIES GET …

RHP Roy Halladay (from Toronto)

*RHP Phillippe Aumont (from Seattle)

*OF Tyson Gillies (from Seattle)

*RHP Juan Ramirez (from Seattle)

$6 million cash (from Toronto)

 

MARINERS GET …

LHP Cliff Lee (from Philadelphia)

 

BLUE JAYS GET …

*C Travis d'Arnaud (from Philadelphia)

*RHP Kyle Drabek (from Philadelphia)

*1B/3B Brett Wallace (from Oakland)

 

A'S GET …

*OF Michael Taylor (from Philadelphia via Toronto)

Edited December 16, 200916 yr by smalls2598

The trade is now official. Here's the full trade details (ESPN)

 

PHILLIES GET …

RHP Roy Halladay (from Toronto)

*RHP Phillippe Aumont (from Seattle)

*OF Tyson Gillies (from Seattle)

*RHP Juan Ramirez (from Seattle)

$6 million cash (from Toronto)

 

MARINERS GET …

LHP Cliff Lee (from Philadelphia)

 

BLUE JAYS GET …

*C Travis d'Arnaud (from Philadelphia)

*RHP Kyle Drabek (from Philadelphia)

*1B/3B Brett Wallace (from Oakland)

 

A'S GET …

*OF Michael Taylor (from Philadelphia via Toronto)

 

I'll be damned.. Phils lose Drebek but gain Aumont. Wow. They did very well. Oakland got involved too?! How bout that.

 

Mariners are very dangerous. Blue Jays did pretty well in the deal for the most part though I thought they would land one more good spect.

Edited December 16, 200916 yr by SoxAce

Halladay is more of an injury risk, not a large one but a risk none the less, but he is a horse.

How do you figure? Just based strictly on work load?

I'll be damned.. Phils lose Drebek but gain Aumont. Wow. They did very well. Oakland got involved too?! How bout that.

 

Mariners are very dangerous. Blue Jays did pretty well in the deal for the most part though I thought they would land one more good spect.

 

The Blue Jays did fantastic, actually. Kyle Drabek was supposedly untouchable. That's as good a haul as one could expect for a guy they were guaranteed of losing at the end of the year. The Phillies were the NL favorites with Lee. They're the prohibitive favorites with Halladay. And I think the Mariners are the front-runners in the AL west. And I still think they add a big bat before it's all said and done. It's amazing how quickly Jack Zduriki, or however the hell you spell his last name, has turned that franchise around after the mess Bill Bavasi created. As terrible as the Bedard trade was, I still can't get over Rafael Soriano for Horacio Ramirez.

Edited December 16, 200916 yr by Jordan4life

How in the hell did Phillies get Halladay and 6 mil, and 3 prospects?

 

That's something.

How in the hell did Phillies get Halladay and 6 mil, and 3 prospects?

 

That's something.

Well, they gave up both Drabek and Turner, the two best prospects in the deal, but pretty incredible that they managed to get cash in the deal.

I would say this was a bad deal for Philly, except for the fact that they have been virtually guaranteed to sign Halladay at a below-market price.

 

One of the more interesting deals in recent memory.

Jesus Christ the Jays got some nice young guys there, definitely did well for Halladay.

Halladay

Hamels

Happ

Blanton

Aumont

 

 

Yowza.

The Blue Jays did fantastic, actually.

Except swapping Taylor for Wallace...wtf?

Except swapping Taylor for Wallace...wtf?

Yeah, lame, but they needed the CI bat much more than another OF...

Man, ESPN hates the Sox. During the coverage they listed the 1-2 Punches in starting rotations for MLB staffs.

 

Mariners: Felix Hernandez, Cliff Lee

Red Sox: Josh Beckett, Jon Lester

Yankees: CC Sabathia, AJ Burnett

Giants: Tim Lincecum, Matt Cain

Cardinals: Chris Carpenter, Adam Wainwright

Phillies: Roy Halladay, Cole Hamels

 

How is Peavy, Buehrle/Danks/Floyd not on there? It's better than the Yankees (Burnett not bing that great), Phillies (unless Hamels returns to form), the Red Sox (I'd take Peavy over Beckett, and Danks/Floyd at times are just as good as Lester).

 

/southsidebias

 

Also, the Phillies made out like bandits in this trade...just wow.

 

And Wallace on the move again keeps reminding me of how loaded the top of the 2008 draft was: Slayer, Posey, Wallace, Alonso, Smoak...

Man, ESPN hates the Sox. During the coverage they listed the 1-2 Punches in starting rotations for MLB staffs.

 

Mariners: Felix Hernandez, Cliff Lee

Red Sox: Josh Beckett, Jon Lester

Yankees: CC Sabathia, AJ Burnett

Giants: Tim Lincecum, Matt Cain

Cardinals: Chris Carpenter, Adam Wainwright

Phillies: Roy Halladay, Cole Hamels

 

How is Peavy, Buehrle/Danks/Floyd not on there? It's better than the Yankees (Burnett not bing that great), Phillies (unless Hamels returns to form), the Red Sox (I'd take Peavy over Beckett, and Danks/Floyd at times are just as good as Lester).

 

/southsidebias

 

Also, the Phillies made out like bandits in this trade...just wow.

 

And Wallace on the move again keeps reminding me of how loaded the top of the 2008 draft was: Slayer, Posey, Wallace, Alonso, Smoak...

 

I don't think most people know that the White Sox have 4 above average starters.

 

Man, ESPN hates the Sox. During the coverage they listed the 1-2 Punches in starting rotations for MLB staffs.

 

Mariners: Felix Hernandez, Cliff Lee

Red Sox: Josh Beckett, Jon Lester

Yankees: CC Sabathia, AJ Burnett

Giants: Tim Lincecum, Matt Cain

Cardinals: Chris Carpenter, Adam Wainwright

Phillies: Roy Halladay, Cole Hamels

 

How is Peavy, Buehrle/Danks/Floyd not on there? It's better than the Yankees (Burnett not bing that great), Phillies (unless Hamels returns to form), the Red Sox (I'd take Peavy over Beckett, and Danks/Floyd at times are just as good as Lester).

 

/southsidebias

 

Also, the Phillies made out like bandits in this trade...just wow.

 

And Wallace on the move again keeps reminding me of how loaded the top of the 2008 draft was: Slayer, Posey, Wallace, Alonso, Smoak...

 

Well if it's 1-2 punches, I could see how the Sox would be left off. Let's face it. As much as we all adore Buehrle, he's not, nor has he ever been, elite. He's just very good. I'd take all those guys listed (aside from probably Hamels/Burnett) over Mark without hesitation. And Danks and Floyd aren't better than Burnett and Hamels, even with Hamels having an off year. Now if ESPN was doing top rotations overall and the White Sox were left off, then you would have a legitimate beef. And yes, the 2008 draft should go down as the best of the decade. And you didn't even mention Tim Beckham, Brian Matusz and, the guy who I believe will be the best player from this draft, Pedro Alvarez.

Edited December 17, 200916 yr by Jordan4life

Well if it's 1-2 punches, I could see how the Sox would be left off. Let's face it. As much as we all adore Buehrle, he's not, nor has he ever been, elite. He's just very good. I'd take all those guys listed (aside from probably Hamels/Burnett) over Mark without hesitation. And Danks and Floyd aren't better than Burnett and Hamels, even with Hamels having an off year. Now if ESPN was doing top rotations overall and the White Sox were left off, then you would have a legitimate beef. And yes, the 2008 draft should go down as the best of the decade. And you didn't even mention Tim Beckham, Brian Matusz and, the guy who I believe will be the best player from this draft, Pedro Alvarez.

 

I agree fully. Peavy belongs on that list, but none of Buehrle, Floyd, or Danks is quite in that top aces argument.

Yeah, lame, but they needed the CI bat much more than another OF...

That doesn't justify trading a player of higher value for one of lower value. The Jays scouts and GM must see something beyond the stats or feel that Wallace being pushed a little more than Taylor puts them as roughly equals. But right now Taylor has shown more power, better walk rate, lower K rate, isn't as slow as Paul Konerko, and isn't as likely to be relegated to 1B/DH

I agree fully. Peavy belongs on that list, but none of Buehrle, Floyd, or Danks is quite in that top aces argument.

 

I will say that I'd rather have one ace (Peavy) and three above average starters (Buehrle, Danks, Floyd) over a dominant 1-2 anytime (unless that 1-2 is something freakish like '01 Johnson/Schilling).

Halladay

Hamels

Happ

Blanton

Aumont

 

 

Yowza.

 

I was reading there is a good chance Pedro returns this year, so you could probably swap out Aumont for the time being

I will say that I'd rather have one ace (Peavy) and three above average starters (Buehrle, Danks, Floyd) over a dominant 1-2 anytime (unless that 1-2 is something freakish like '01 Johnson/Schilling).

 

During the regular season probably, but during the playoffs , absolutely not.

During the regular season probably, but during the playoffs , absolutely not.

 

Aside from last year when they had way too many off days between games, having 4 good starters tends to be better in the playoffs than going to a 3 man rotation with 2 aces.

I will say that I'd rather have one ace (Peavy) and three above average starters (Buehrle, Danks, Floyd) over a dominant 1-2 anytime (unless that 1-2 is something freakish like '01 Johnson/Schilling).

 

You will win a lot more games in the long run that way.

During the regular season probably, but during the playoffs , absolutely not.

 

Well SP depth will be a lot more important come October now that they're going to have less off days during the playoffs. This past postseason was absolutely ridiculous. You're not going to be able to get away with 3-man rotations or being able to have your top pitcher go 3 times in a series if need be.

Well SP depth will be a lot more important come October now that they're going to have less off days during the playoffs. This past postseason was absolutely ridiculous. You're not going to be able to get away with 3-man rotations or being able to have your top pitcher go 3 times in a series if need be.

Depends on the pitcher. Didn't the Marlins wind up doing something similar with Beckett back in 03 before it really spread out?

Depends on the pitcher. Didn't the Marlins wind up doing something similar with Beckett back in 03 before it really spread out?

 

They brought Beckett outta the 'pen on 2 days rest in game 7 of the NLCS. That was a risky/desperation move that worked out. Not the same as what the Yankees were able to get away with due to excessive off days.

They brought Beckett outta the 'pen on 2 days rest in game 7 of the NLCS. That was a risky/desperation move that worked out. Not the same as what the Yankees were able to get away with due to excessive off days.

True, not the same thing, but Beckett also pitched the clincher in the WS on 3 days rest too IIRC. If I were the Yankees I might have done Captain Cheeseburger on 3 days rest for the whole postseason even if every series went the max.