Rich Coutinho ‏@coutinho9 4h4 hours ago

To me if Cespedes options are dwindling (maybe Chisox Angels, poss O's if Davis does not sign there) Mets should pounce on it 2 years $30M

 

(Mets ESPN beat reporter ^)

Seems like only yesterday we had the humorous Sox Fest video panel with Avi, Eaton and his wife and a translator for Avi...

 

I'm sure any player on the White Sox would probably say the same thing about bringing in Cespedes or Upton without first reflecting on what it would mean to one of their teammates...maybe with the outfield, it doesn't feel like impugning Garcia directly, Melky or even LaRoche as much because at least two of those guys would see their playing time cut arguably.

 

Now if they were out there actively lobbying for the likes of Desmond, Alexei, Flores/Tejada, etc., to replace Saladino...that would be more of an issue.

 

That's Marcus Stroman, JD Martinez, and Cespedes today at a golf outing

That's Marcus Stroman, JD Martinez, and Cespedes today at a golf outing

 

Oh man, Stroman is going to the Tigers now too?!

Perhaps a better way to describe this circumstance is that the Sox need a big bat, who happens to be a decent outfielder, because the outfield is the place where the Sox have room for an addition. Ideally, he should be able to play right field, because the other two outfielders who are on the roster are not qualified to play that position.

That is why guys like Fowler and Parra are not good choices. They are not middle of the order, big run producers. Therefore, any suggestion of spending significant money, or sacrificing a draft pick, for such players simply does not make any sense.

 

Parra makes more sense because wherever he plays, he's going to improve the defense (assuming last year with more of an anomaly) and he doesn't cost the draft pick, so it's more about how much are you willing to pay him...and how much is the improvement there versus adding a starting pitcher or SS to replace Saladino.

 

With Fowler, he's going to cost you Samardzija's pick in the comp round, so essentially you're trading the rights to Fowler (who will get something like 3 years and $40-45 million) for the four players we dealt for Shark and you're losing $10-12 million of short and long-term impact from the lost draft pick, so it's actually costing you $50-60 million AND Semien/Bassit/Phegley/Ravelo if you look at inflows/outflows of talent onto the roster directly related to Shark.

 

If you keep the draft pick, at least you can argue that's a fair rate of return for those four guys...at least it's an argument that has solid points on both sides.

 

Not to mention Fowler's not an above-average defender in CF, and then you're forcing Eaton to move to RF or moving both outfielders to different positions. None of those would seem ideal.

Edited January 12, 201610 yr by caulfield12

I think the sox are out of Cespedes and Upton just working on plan B now.

 

More twitter junk...

https://mobile.twitter.com/ChicagoSports17/...727379893530625

Rich Coutinho ‏@coutinho9 4h4 hours ago

To me if Cespedes options are dwindling (maybe Chisox Angels, poss O's if Davis does not sign there) Mets should pounce on it 2 years $30M

 

(Mets ESPN beat reporter ^)

Lol at this guy thinking 2/$30M would get it done. Maybe if he's desperate he'd take 2/$50M or a bit less, but that dude is off on Cespedes' likely AAV by 50% or more.

I think the sox are out of Cespedes and Upton just working on plan B now.

 

More twitter junk...

https://mobile.twitter.com/ChicagoSports17/...727379893530625

Quite the source. His next tweet is "@chuckgarfien what are the sox gonna do"

Edited January 12, 201610 yr by Jose Abreu

I never heard this. What I heard happened was Hahn wanted Middlebrooks and KW wanted Avi. Both players aren't good. Luckily they did well with Montas/Wendelken.

 

Maybe Hahn asked for Middlebrooks but he turned out as bad as Avi. Rede Sox did not offer Middlebrooks and obviously Iggy was available.

 

http://m.mlb.com/news/article/55318198/

 

For weeks, Cherington had spoken with the White Sox about Peavy. But the clubs didn't have a direct match. The Red Sox had no interest in including Middlebrooks in that swap.

 

 

 

 

 

Parra makes more sense because wherever he plays, he's going to improve the defense (assuming last year with more of an anomaly) and he doesn't cost the draft pick, so it's more about how much are you willing to pay him...and how much is the improvement there versus adding a starting pitcher or SS to replace Saladino.

 

With Fowler, he's going to cost you Samardzija's pick in the comp round, so essentially you're trading the rights to Fowler (who will get something like 3 years and $40-45 million) for the four players we dealt for Shark and you're losing $10-12 million of short and long-term impact from the lost draft pick, so it's actually costing you $50-60 million AND Semien/Bassit/Phegley/Ravelo if you look at inflows/outflows of talent onto the roster directly related to Shark.

If you keep the draft pick, at least you can argue that's a fair rate of return for those four guys...at least it's an argument that has solid points on both sides.

 

Not to mention Fowler's not an above-average defender in CF, and then you're forcing Eaton to move to RF or moving both outfielders to different positions. None of those would seem ideal.

 

 

You present an interesting perspective, by adding all of the cumulatively related previous moves to your analysis. However, I think those moves are not relevant. What they did to acquire Samardzija is "water under the bridge". All that matters now is the potential loss of a draft pick, the dollars involved in a free agent contract, and the way a possible acquisition might contribute to this current roster.

On a scale of 0 to 100, where 0 means that the Sox have absolutely no chance at him and 100 means that they're getting him for sure, how confident are you guys feeling right now about the Sox ability to get Cespedes?

 

For me, I'd have to go with 50 right now. I feel as if it could go either way.

You present an interesting perspective, by adding all of the cumulatively related previous moves to your analysis. However, I think those moves are not relevant. What they did to acquire Samardzija is "water under the bridge". All that matters now is the potential loss of a draft pick, the dollars involved in a free agent contract, and the way a possible acquisition might contribute to this current roster.

 

and also what matters Lillian, is how my stomach continues to churn during this long drawn out process.

 

On a scale of 0 to 100, where 0 means that the Sox have absolutely no chance at him and 100 means that they're getting him for sure, how confident are you guys feeling right now about the Sox ability to get Cespedes?

 

For me, I'd have to go with 50 right now. I feel as if it could go either way.

 

I guess the longer it takes the more pessimistic I get. Wondering if JR will pay the big bucks for Cespedes. So I'm in the 30's. Hope I'm wrong!!

 

I honestly think Fowler + SS + Starting pitcher is better than just getting Cespedes. It'd be nice to get a big bat, but we have a decent amount of power as is. To get a guy who can hit you 15-20 homers, get on at .350-.375 clip, and play CF somewhat adequately would be huge. Getting a SS and another starter to sure up the rotation also makes your team much more well rounded.

yeah 30's, i dont see the sox spending the most they've ever spent on a player in their entire history on cespedes

 

not even upton honestly and he's probably worth more due to his age even though i'd prefer cespedes

I love how people go back and hate the package we gave for Samardzija. It was worth the risk. At the time, not a bad trade, and honestly, all of the players we gave up are/were easily replaceable.

I honestly think Fowler + SS + Starting pitcher is better than just getting Cespedes. It'd be nice to get a big bat, but we have a decent amount of power as is. To get a guy who can hit you 15-20 homers, get on at .350-.375 clip, and play CF somewhat adequately would be huge. Getting a SS and another starter to sure up the rotation also makes your team much more well rounded.

 

We do not have a decent amount of power.

We do not have a decent amount of power.

 

Abreu and Frazier alone can account for 60.

 

We're not going to lead the league in homers or anything, but I think we have enough power to compete as is. We're probably better off getting a guy who is good at getting on base with decent power as opposed to someone who can hit 30 bombs, but might only get on at a .300 clip.

I love how people go back and hate the package we gave for Samardzija. It was worth the risk. At the time, not a bad trade, and honestly, all of the players we gave up are/were easily replaceable.

 

What did we honestly give up in that package? lol.

 

Semein- Can't field to save his life.

 

Bassett- Had Montas, Danish, Johnson, Adams, & now Fullmer all in front of him.

 

Phegley- Nothing more than a questionable backup catcher with 1 impressive minor league stint.

 

Ravelo- Maybe the most promising prospect & not even in their top 10.

 

I see nothing worth b****ing about.

Abreu and Frazier alone can account for 60.

 

We're not going to lead the league in homers or anything, but I think we have enough power to compete as is. We're probably better off getting a guy who is good at getting on base with decent power as opposed to someone who can hit 30 bombs, but might only get on at a .300 clip.

Abreu and Frazier get you 60, but the rest of the team gets you what... another 60? I mean, Eaton is literally our 3rd best home run hitter.

What did we honestly give up in that package? lol.

 

Semein- Can't field to save his life.

 

Bassett- Had Montas, Danish, Johnson, Adams, & now Fullmer all in front of him.

 

Phegley- Nothing more than a questionable backup catcher with 1 impressive minor league stint.

 

Ravelo- Maybe the most promising prospect & not even in their top 10.

 

I see nothing worth b****ing about.

Yup I agree.

Abreu and Frazier get you 60, but the rest of the team gets you what... another 60? I mean, Eaton is literally our 3rd best home run hitter.

Hopefully Melky increases his number

Abreu and Frazier get you 60, but the rest of the team gets you what... another 60? I mean, Eaton is literally our 3rd best home run hitter.

 

I'd say Lawrie should be good for 15-20. You'll probably get 15 out of the catcher platoon. Melky should be good for 12-15. Eaton should be good for 12-15. Those 4 alone can get you 60.

 

I'm not saying we don't need anymore power. I just feel like on base percentage is a bigger need than power for this team.

What did we honestly give up in that package? lol.

 

Semein- Can't field to save his life.

 

Bassett- Had Montas, Danish, Johnson, Adams, & now Fullmer all in front of him.

 

Phegley- Nothing more than a questionable backup catcher with 1 impressive minor league stint.

 

Ravelo- Maybe the most promising prospect & not even in their top 10.

 

I see nothing worth b****ing about.

 

 

You can't discount the fact that the jury's still out on Semien as an everyday player. If he was on the White Sox and had the season he just had for Oakland, his trade value would have been higher than Micah and arguably Thompson simply because of the position he plays, if nothing else (and better offensive numbers arguably at USCF compared to the Coliseum).

 

It's not so much individual players in this case, but the fact that our overall depth is decreasing and decreasing to the point where it's difficult to imagine a trade for any impact bat without giving up Anderson/Fulmer and Adams at the very least.

 

 

http://espn.go.com/mlb/stats/batting/_/pos.../qualified/true

Semien had the 6th highest WAR among all qualified SS's in MLB at 2.7 and barely made the league minimum.

Edited January 12, 201610 yr by caulfield12