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Legitimate chance of Sale trade to #Nationals per Rosenthal

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QUOTE (iamshack @ Dec 5, 2016 -> 01:39 PM)
I think it goes a little something like this:

 

Hahn - "Mike, you can offer Giolito and Robles all day long, but I've got to have Turner."

 

Rizzo - "If I'm giving up Turner, I can't give you Giolito OR Robles...and I'm not even sure I can get a sign off on Turner, to be honest."

 

Hahn - "You know our suite #, Mike."

 

Rizzo - "Rick, you've got to help me offset Turner if I'm going to move him..."

 

Hahn - "What about Melky?"

 

Rizzo - "Come on Rick. I need someone who will be here for at least a couple years. Give me Adam."

 

Hahn - Eaton is not off the table, but then I'm going to need Turner and your top 6-7 guys, Mike."

 

Edited for accuracy.

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QUOTE (iamshack @ Dec 5, 2016 -> 01:39 PM)
I think it goes a little something like this:

 

Hahn - "Mike, you can offer Giolito and Robles all day long, but I've got to have Turner."

 

Rizzo - "If I'm giving up Turner, I can't give you Giolito OR Robles...and I'm not even sure I can get a sign off on Turner, to be honest."

 

Hahn - "You know our suite #, Mike."

 

Rizzo - "Rick, you've got to help me offset Turner if I'm going to move him..."

 

Hahn - "What about Melky?"

 

Rizzo - "Come on Rick. I need someone who will be here for at least a couple years. Give me Adam."

 

Hahn - Eaton is not off the table, but then I'm going to need Turner and your top 3-4 guys, Mike."

 

I agree with this. but the white sox would be choosing to get a single high impact player over using Eaton to build depth. Some may oppose that and i understand why, but acquiring Turner, Giolito, Robles, and more is worth it. You can still try your damndest to turn around your scouting in next two years and trade some excess chaff for davidson level gambles.

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QUOTE (Rowand44 @ Dec 5, 2016 -> 01:36 PM)
With the strides Anderson has made every year at short, I wouldn't even think about about moving him around.

 

 

Anderson can probably play OF and 2B as well. If the Sox acquire another prospect who can play SS, then they should let the better defensive SS of Anderson and whoever the other prospect/player is, play SS and other guy to a different position. Not hard to do.

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QUOTE (iamshack @ Dec 5, 2016 -> 01:39 PM)
I think it goes a little something like this:

 

Hahn - "Mike, you can offer Giolito and Robles all day long, but I've got to have Turner."

 

Rizzo - "If I'm giving up Turner, I can't give you Giolito OR Robles...and I'm not even sure I can get a sign off on Turner, to be honest."

 

Hahn - "You know our suite #, Mike."

 

Rizzo - "Rick, you've got to help me offset Turner if I'm going to move him..."

 

Hahn - "What about Melky?"

 

Rizzo - "Come on Rick. I need someone who will be here for at least a couple years. Give me Adam."

 

Hahn - Eaton is not off the table, but then I'm going to need Turner and your top 3-4 guys, Mike."

 

Rizzo "Give me Adam" is way beyond a throw in to help offset a deal haha, it's a completely different trade negotiation.

 

Eaton is under contract for what amounts to pennies:

 

2017 28 Chicago White Sox $4,000,000 4.030

2018 29 Chicago White Sox $6,000,000

2019 30 Chicago White Sox $8,400,000

2020 31 Chicago White Sox *$9,500,000 $9.5M Team Option, $1.5M Buyout

2021 32 Chicago White Sox *$10,500,000 $10.5M Team Option, $1.5M Buyout

Earliest Free Agent: 2020

 

He is in his prime as well.

 

Eaton would like require Giolito and Robles (I've read internally the Nationals consider Lopez to have surpassed Giolito in the pecking order)

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QUOTE (dpd9189 @ Dec 5, 2016 -> 01:44 PM)
Anderson can probably play OF and 2B as well. If the Sox acquire another prospect who can play SS, then they should let the better defensive SS of Anderson and whoever the other prospect/player is, play SS and other guy to a different position. Not hard to do.

 

Anderson actually put up 1.21 Defensive WAR in 99 games in 2016, which is very impressive for a rookie

 

Hard to see them moving him off SS after that performance

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QUOTE (steveno89 @ Dec 5, 2016 -> 01:44 PM)
Rizzo "Give me Adam" is way beyond a throw in to help offset a deal haha, it's a completely different trade negotiation.

 

Eaton is under contract for what amounts to pennies:

 

2017 28 Chicago White Sox $4,000,000 4.030

2018 29 Chicago White Sox $6,000,000

2019 30 Chicago White Sox $8,400,000

2020 31 Chicago White Sox *$9,500,000 $9.5M Team Option, $1.5M Buyout

2021 32 Chicago White Sox *$10,500,000 $10.5M Team Option, $1.5M Buyout

Earliest Free Agent: 2020

 

He is in his prime as well.

 

Eaton would like require Giolito and Robles (I've read internally the Nationals consider Lopez to have surpassed Giolito in the pecking order)

 

Right, and Turner is a near superstar level player that your best pitcher in AL on cost friendly deal couldn't land.

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QUOTE (steveno89 @ Dec 5, 2016 -> 11:44 AM)
Rizzo "Give me Adam" is way beyond a throw in to help offset a deal haha, it's a completely different trade negotiation.

 

Eaton is under contract for what amounts to pennies:

 

2017 28 Chicago White Sox $4,000,000 4.030

2018 29 Chicago White Sox $6,000,000

2019 30 Chicago White Sox $8,400,000

2020 31 Chicago White Sox *$9,500,000 $9.5M Team Option, $1.5M Buyout

2021 32 Chicago White Sox *$10,500,000 $10.5M Team Option, $1.5M Buyout

Earliest Free Agent: 2020

 

He is in his prime as well.

 

Eaton would like require Giolito and Robles (I've read internally the Nationals consider Lopez to have surpassed Giolito in the pecking order)

I know he is...of course the Nats are going to try and throw him in.

But he might just be what it takes to get them to move off the stalemate. Given what we think of Adam's value, I wouldn't be opposed to using him that way.

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Turner probably has more trade value than Eaton (not quite as established, but higher upside, cheaper, extra year of control).

Edited by bighurt574

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Turner is great, but chances are he isn't going to have a .388 BABIP ever agsin, and his homer rate should probably drop as well.

 

He still is top of the line, but moveable if you look at it realistically. If he hits .340 with 25 homers and 40 steals, you can't trade him. But .300 with 15 homers and 35 steals? It is the price you pay for the current version of Sale.

Edited by Dick Allen

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QUOTE (Dick Allen @ Dec 5, 2016 -> 01:49 PM)
Turner is great, but chances are he isn't going to have a .388 BABIP ever agsin, and his homer rate should probably drop as well.

 

He still is top of the line, but moveable if you look at it realistically. If he hits .340 with 25 homers and 40 steals, you can't trade him. But .300 with 15 homers and 35 steals? It is the price you pay for the current version of Sale.

 

The only thing I hope the Sox don't do is package Sale and Eaton together.

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QUOTE (bmags @ Dec 5, 2016 -> 01:43 PM)
I agree with this. but the white sox would be choosing to get a single high impact player over using Eaton to build depth. Some may oppose that and i understand why, but acquiring Turner, Giolito, Robles, and more is worth it. You can still try your damndest to turn around your scouting in next two years and trade some excess chaff for davidson level gambles.

 

Eaton is already a really good player in his own right.

 

Cost controlled for 5 seasons, trading him would likely hurt the White Sox far more than what they would receive in return for him. Prospects bust all the time, when you finally have a cheap all star player you should keep him.

 

The Nationals and Red Sox are primarily interested in Sale, adding Eaton into the mix pushes the deal into a whole new stratosphere of value that is not going to happen.

 

Washington is absolutely in win now mode with Harper hitting free agency in two years. White Sox can hold firm on their trade requests and put the Nationals into a difficult choice. They really do have to go for it and win now, because Harper is unlikely to be resigned.

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QUOTE (soxforlife05 @ Dec 5, 2016 -> 02:46 PM)
Nats don't have enough to get Sale + Eaton or Sale + McCutcheon

 

Best case is they significantly raise his price for the Red Sox

 

I disagree. I would take Turner/Robles/Giolito/Lopez plus 3-4 more of their top 10 prospects (Fedde, Kieboom, Dunning, Neuse, Stevenson) for both Sale & Eaton.

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QUOTE (NCsoxfan @ Dec 5, 2016 -> 01:55 PM)
I disagree. I would take Turner/Robles/Giolito/Lopez plus 3-4 more of their top 10 prospects (Fedde, Kieboom, Dunning, Neuse, Stevenson) for both Sale & Eaton.

 

I'll take Turner Robles Giolito Lopez for Sale only. None of those other prospects interest me that much.

Edited by soxforlife05

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QUOTE (soxforlife05 @ Dec 5, 2016 -> 01:53 PM)
The only thing I hope the Sox don't do is package Sale and Eaton together.

 

I'm with this unless they gave us Turner, Giolito, Robles, Ross, Cole, plus another few guys of our choosing.

Edited by Ro Da Don

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QUOTE (NCsoxfan @ Dec 5, 2016 -> 01:55 PM)
I disagree. I would take Turner/Robles/Giolito/Lopez plus 3-4 more of their top 10 prospects (Fedde, Kieboom, Dunning, Neuse, Stevenson) for both Sale & Eaton.

 

It would be a huge risk for both teams, but the Nationals may never have a better window than they do right now to win the next two seasons until Harper is likely gone

 

Standing pat really is not an option, and they do not have time to wait for players like Giolito/Lopez/Robles to develop into mlb contributors before Bryce is gone.

 

For fun, a mega blockbuster that resulted in the Nationals acquiring something like: Sale, Eaton and Robertson would position them very well to go for it in 2017 and 2018

 

Eaton could handle center field, although he is a beast in right, and replace the offense lost by Turner

 

Sale gives them the best rotation, when healthy, in baseball

 

Robertson helps solidify the bullpen after Melancon signed with San Francisco.

 

Note: This will not happen, but fun to think about

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QUOTE (raBBit @ Dec 5, 2016 -> 01:43 PM)
"Cold water Scott Merkin" was right all last year when he was the cold water guy and now he's singing a different tune.

 

Didnt say he was wrong Rabbit. Just that he throws the cold water. Not always fun

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QUOTE (soxforlife05 @ Dec 5, 2016 -> 03:03 PM)
I'll take Turner Robles Giolito Lopez for Sale only. None of those other prospects interest me that much.

 

That's a bad trade for them & unrealistic thinking by us. If I'm wrong, beers of your choice on me.

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Here's how I see it...there is a gap in the valuation of a guy like Turner in that one side sees 6 years of control of an all-star-caliber player as being worth more than Sale alone and the other side that says "I need to see a LOT more before I'm buying that."

 

The Nats feel Sale may be worth Turner or Turner and something very marginal. The Sox say give me Turner plus 2-3 other top 25 in the MLB guys.

 

This gap needs to be bridged.

 

The way you do it is to bring back another guy from the Sox who has a lot of "projected value," in Eaton. That way the Nats can sell him as the replacement for losing Turner while also bringing back Sale. The White Sox capture an MLB-ready star to appease their fans as well as adding the depth and talent to their farm system necessary for a rebuild.

 

Hell, I'd even throw in Robertson for another one of their top 15 guys.

 

Sale/Eaton/Robertson for Turner/Giolito/Robles + 2 more top 10 and 2 top 20 prospects.

Edited by iamshack

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QUOTE (soxforlife05 @ Dec 5, 2016 -> 01:46 PM)
Nats don't have enough to get Sale + Eaton or Sale + McCutcheon

 

Best case is they significantly raise his price for the Red Sox

 

McCutchen's value is way down, he performed pretty close to his contract last season and only has two years of control left. I think the Nats could easily make a deal for Sale and then make a play for McCutchen with what is left over, and more than likely without giving Turner up in either deal.

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QUOTE (iamshack @ Dec 5, 2016 -> 02:10 PM)
Here's how I see it...there is a gap in the valuation of a guy like Turner in that one side sees 6 years of control of an all-star-caliber player as being worth more than Sale alone and the other side that says "I need to see a LOT more before I'm buying that."

 

The Nats feel Sale may be worth Turner or Turner and something very marginal. The Sox say give me Turner plus 2-3 other top 25 guys.

 

This gap needs to be bridged.

 

The way you do it is to bring back another guy from the Sox who has a lot of "projected value," in Eaton. That way the Nats can sell him as the replacement for losing Turner while also bringing back Sale. The White Sox capture an MLB-ready star to appease their fans as well as adding the depth and talent to their farm system necessary for a rebuild.

 

Hell, I'd even throw in Robertson for another one of their top 15 guys.

 

Sale/Eaton/Robertson for Turner/Giolito/Robles + 2 more top 10 and 2 top 20 prospects.

 

That proposal hugely undervalues Eaton, who posted a 6.23 WAR this season and has average 5 WAR the past three seasons.

 

Turner looks like a great prospect, but the White Sox would be giving up way too much by including him in negotiations

 

On his own, an Eaton package would likely have to start with Giolito/Lopez and Robles plus another good prospect or two

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QUOTE (IowaSoxFan @ Dec 5, 2016 -> 02:13 PM)
McCutchen's value is way down, he performed pretty close to his contract last season and only has two years of control left. I think the Nats could easily make a deal for Sale and then make a play for McCutchen with what is left over, and more than likely without giving Turner up in either deal.

 

If we don't get at least Turner Giolito Robles for Sale I won't like the deal. If we don't get Turner at all I don't see the point in making the trade. Don't like their secondary prospects either from what I've looked at so far. Dunning could be ok but he's 2+ years away.

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QUOTE (steveno89 @ Dec 5, 2016 -> 12:15 PM)
That proposal hugely undervalues Eaton, who posted a 6.23 WAR this season and has average 5 WAR the past three seasons.

 

Turner looks like a great prospect, but the White Sox would be giving up way too much by including him in negotiations

 

On his own, an Eaton package would likely have to start with Giolito/Lopez and Robles plus another good prospect or two

Maybe so, but I think if you want Turner plus 2 or 3 of their remaining top guys I think you're dreaming.

 

As I said, this is the middle ground.

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QUOTE (soxforlife05 @ Dec 5, 2016 -> 02:16 PM)
If we don't get at least Turner Giolito Robles for Sale I won't like the deal. If we don't get Turner at all I don't see the point in making the trade. Don't like their secondary prospects either from what I've looked at so far. Dunning could be ok but he's 2+ years away.

 

Nats are not trading Turner, Giolito and Robles in a package for any one player. I would fire a GM for doing that

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