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Jack Parkman

Offseason trade idea: Sox-Reds

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The Sox have a glut of RHP and OF, the Reds have 3 third basemen. India can be traded after the WS. The Sox and Reds should talk about a 2-1 swap of a RHP and OF for either Suarez or Senzel, or a RHP for India. This makes almost too much sense not to happen, not unlike Quintana to the Cubs. 

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I think the price on Suarez, given his contract, would be outrageous. Like, Luis Robert and Dylan Cease +++ kind of outrageous.

 

Senzel and India, I can see, though 

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24 minutes ago, Jose Abreu said:

I think the price on Suarez, given his contract, would be outrageous. Like, Luis Robert and Dylan Cease +++ kind of outrageous.

 

Senzel and India, I can see, though 

Senzel is a top 10 prospect, his cost would be just as outrageous.  We should be aiming a little lower if we do a prospect for prospect swap.

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Eugenio Suarez is one of the best hitters in the game. He's not going anywhere and is their building block.

 

Nick Senzel is a top 5ish top 10ish prospect and would cost a boat load as well. He is to them as Eloy is to us in a sense.

 

So, this doesn't make much sense.

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How about Moncada and Burger for Senzel? Moncada is a 70 grade prospect according to Fangraphs and Senzel is only a 60. The Sox can throw in Burger as a sweetener. 

Yolmer Sanchez can take over second until Madrigal is ready. Davidson can play third until Senzel is ready for a call up in early 19. 

 

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I think a guy like Colton Welker from Colorado would be more obtainable in a trade. To be honest Cincinnati would be dumb to trade Senzel and I don't see any way they trade him regardless of Suarez.

Edited by BlackSox13

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Senzel is completely blocked by Votto and Suarez. If Suarez is a building block for them, they have no place for Senzel because good luck getting a team to take Votto's contract. They're not exactly negotiating from a position of strength here. Someone has to go. 

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1 hour ago, Jack Parkman said:

Senzel is completely blocked by Votto and Suarez. If Suarez is a building block for them, they have no place for Senzel because good luck getting a team to take Votto's contract. They're not exactly negotiating from a position of strength here. Someone has to go. 

You won't want to hear this but he's not blocked and it appears Cincinnati has already figured it out. Senzel has 28 games at second base this year and only 14 at third base. I'd guess they plan to sell high this winter on Gennett to get a starting pitcher and play Senzel at second next year. There's no chance Cincinnati would keep the 28 year old Gennett over the 23 year old Senzel.

https://www.baseball-reference.com/register/player.fcgi?id=senzel000nic

 

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49 minutes ago, BlackSox13 said:

You won't want to hear this but he's not blocked and it appears Cincinnati has already figured it out. Senzel has 28 games at second base this year and only 14 at third base. I'd guess they plan to sell high this winter on Gennett to get a starting pitcher and play Senzel at second next year. There's no chance Cincinnati would keep the 28 year old Gennett over the 23 year old Senzel.

https://www.baseball-reference.com/register/player.fcgi?id=senzel000nic

 

Well then, never mind. Move along. 

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1 hour ago, yesterday333 said:

what about India? What would it take to get him?

Perhaps a package of ReyLo and Walker/Call/Cordell would get it done? I like ReyLo but I'd be willing to part with him if they believe India is a long term fit at 3B. Seems India should be a fast riser too with a possible MLB debut in 2020 like Madrigal.

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3 minutes ago, JUSTgottaBELIEVE said:

Perhaps a package of ReyLo and Walker/Call/Cordell would get it done? I like ReyLo but I'd be willing to part with him if they believe India is a long term fit at 3B. Seems India should be a fast riser too with a possible MLB debut in 2020 like Madrigal.

We really can’t afford to trade Lopez at this point in time IMO.  We need to start building some certainty in the rotation and he’s closer to filling the #3 spot than Giolito is.

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7 minutes ago, JUSTgottaBELIEVE said:

Perhaps a package of ReyLo and Walker/Call/Cordell would get it done? I like ReyLo but I'd be willing to part with him if they believe India is a long term fit at 3B. Seems India should be a fast riser too with a possible MLB debut in 2020 like Madrigal.

What am I missing here? Why in the hell would the Reds all of a sudden want to trade the guy that they just drafted in the top 10 a month ago? What good does that do them?

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Its because they have 3 3rd basemen and could use pitching and OF help. Apparently we have had talks with teams regarding prospect for prospect swaps. It seems their other 3b would require too much to get them so that leaves India.

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The Sox aren't trading for a guy like Senzel or India.  Those guys would require so much capital as to be practically untouchable.  Think of a 3B more in the Ryan Cordell mold of impressive numbers, but less regarded.  Maybe someone blocked at the major league level.  We aren't dealing for a top 50 prospect without giving up a big time guy in return.

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12 minutes ago, Chicago White Sox said:

We really can’t afford to trade Lopez at this point in time IMO.  We need to start building some certainty in the rotation and he’s closer to filling the #3 spot than Giolito is.

I hear you but as the Kopech/Eloy saga plays out, the biggest thing it's telling me is that the contention window timeline is pushed back in the mind's of the front office (one year at least). Best case scenario, the team is competitive in 2020 so we still have nearly a year and a half to figure out who from this current group of prospects are viable rotation pieces. Rodon is a given (unless traded or injured) and hopefully they can find another 2-3 reliable options from the group of - Giolito, Kopech, Cease, Dunning, Hansen, Stephens, Flores, etc. Then fill in the other 1 or 2 spots with veteran FA's, if needed. It just seems 3b is a black hole in the org right now, possibly more so than any other position.

Edited by JUSTgottaBELIEVE

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1 minute ago, southsider2k5 said:

The Sox aren't trading for a guy like Senzel or India.  Those guys would require so much capital as to be practically untouchable.  Think of a 3B more in the Ryan Cordell mold of impressive numbers, but less regarded.  Maybe someone blocked at the major league level.  We aren't dealing for a top 50 prospect without giving up a big time guy in return.

Gotta give something to get something. In addition to India, I'd explore the cost of obtaining Hayes (Pirates - hopefully they see Moran as the long term solution at 3B) and Welker (Rockies - extend Arenado). Also, I don't think India will be untouchable by any means.

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7 minutes ago, JUSTgottaBELIEVE said:

I hear you but as the Kopech/Eloy saga plays out, the biggest thing it's telling me is that the contention window timeline is pushed back in the mind's of the front office (one year at least). Best case scenario, the team is competitive in 2020 so we still have nearly a year and a half to figure out who from this current group of prospects are viable rotation pieces. Rodon is a given (unless traded or injured) and hopefully they can find another 2-3 reliable options from the group of - Giolito, Kopech, Cease, Dunning, Hansen, Stephens, Flores, etc. Then fill in the other 1 or 2 spots with veteran FA's, if needed. It just seems 3b is a black hole in the org right now, possibly more so than any other position.

I don't think that they'll get an offer for Rodon this offseason, they might but I don't think any team will bite yet. But if he's still rolling next year at the AS break, with him only under team control through 2021, the fact that the "window has been pushed back by a year at least" as you say it is going to make moving Rodon awfully tempting. Long enough of a run of success + the White Sox's window...

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9 minutes ago, Balta1701 said:

I don't think that they'll get an offer for Rodon this offseason, they might but I don't think any team will bite yet. But if he's still rolling next year at the AS break, with him only under team control through 2021, the fact that the "window has been pushed back by a year at least" as you say it is going to make moving Rodon awfully tempting. Long enough of a run of success + the White Sox's window...

Agreed. I wouldn't be surprised if they did but presumably they would get at another 1-2 high end pitching prospects in return that could help fill out the future rotation.

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Prospect.for.prospect.trades.don't.happen. I'm not sure how often this has be to said here (minus the change of scenery ones when guys are already about 24/25).

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42 minutes ago, soxfan2014 said:

Prospect.for.prospect.trades.don't.happen. I'm not sure how often this has be to said here (minus the change of scenery ones when guys are already about 24/25).

Rick Hahn has said theyve had discussions about prospect for prospect trades and would likely revisit them in the off season. so we are just discussing what could be a possibility...

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45 minutes ago, soxfan2014 said:

Prospect.for.prospect.trades.don't.happen. I'm not sure how often this has be to said here (minus the change of scenery ones when guys are already about 24/25).

Hahn is the one who said they're being discussed and will be re-visited in the winter 

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Yes, Hahn definitely said this was something discussed, but what I am going at is two middle of the list guys aren't getting you a top of the list guy.  If you want a top 50 talent, you will have to trade a top 50 talent to get it.

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1 minute ago, southsider2k5 said:

Yes, Hahn definitely said this was something discussed, but what I am going at is two middle of the list guys aren't getting you a top of the list guy.  If you want a top 50 talent, you will have to trade a top 50 talent to get it.

What about Rutherford and an arm for India? Would we be willing to do that?

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