vilehoopster

I hate to say it, but there's a lot of truth here. It would take more than a nice spring training to remove both the odor and the injury fear.

For the Sox to have a chance to win 63 (which I think is possible but doubtful), the Sox need at least three starters better than Perez, which I think is very possible.

Iriarte will go down to Charlotte and do just fine. He'll probably have a locker right next to Burke. But both of them will be very good pitchers in the future.

Really for a 23 year old on his 2nd ST appearance. That trade is looking just fine. Actually, I think he will solve this and turn out to be a very good pitcher for the Sox. (Just not today or anytime too soon.)

Did I miss it in this thread anywhere, but did anyone bring how well Martin pitched today, especially against a very tough set of six batters. I thought he looked outstanding, his 2nd game of the spring where he's been really good. Again, he wasn't throwing against minor league batters, but some really outstanding bats. I have to think right now (I know, only two short outings) that Martin has the inside track of being the opening day starter.

I just went and looked at the game stats. Amaya has been up three times with runners in scoring position and all three times he has struck out, all three times. If the Sox lose this game by a run or two (I know it's only spring training, but still) you can squarely put the blame on the loss on Amaya's shoulders. But really, I don't think that's true. I think the blame has to go to Sox management for ever wasting the time to sign him and play him this spring. Why waste at bats that could have gone to so many more deserving and real prospects. Why did we waste a second of spring training time on Amaya?

That has to be the 9 or 10th time this spring that Amaya has been up with runners in scoring position, and he has gotten out EVERY time. Am I correct, it's happened three times alone in today's game. Just cut him. He's terrible; he was terrible last year. Cut him.

Wow, he did not help himself today.

What other pitchers are we excited to see today? In a way, kinda all of them. I'm very curious about Smith, Booser, Leasure, Mason.

No one has mentioned him, but I think that there's a very real chance that Shane Smith could be in the starting rotation this year. His minor league stats are rather impressive. Also, as the # 1 Rule Five draft, I would think that means the Sox have some high expectations for him .

I have a question. I've thought this for years, but this spring with all the pitchers in camp and all the NRIs and all the position battles, this question seems more relevant than even in past years. But with so many players in camp, shouldn't that Sox be trying to play two split-squad games everyday or almost every day? I always wondered why there weren't more split-squad two-game days. Was it lack of pitching? Well, the Sox have plenty of pitchers they want to look at. Is it hard to find other teams to do this with? Are the games for spring training already scheduled and can't be changed? I really don't know much on this subject. Can anyone say why a team does or doesn't play more split-squad games?

I understand the appeal of Meidroth and his great OBP in the minors. But I still think that a lot the reasons why people are thinking he'll be the Sox starting 2nd baseman is "Second-String quarterback syndrome" (when a team is playing badly, fans always think the unknown player must be better than the present player). I still think that outstanding September earns Sosa a huge edge to be the Sox starting 2nd baseman this year. And yes, "Look at Meidroth's stats," you say. And they are impressive. But look at Sosa's stats from his last two years at Charlotte; they are also very impressive. Both years with an OPS well over .800. It's up to debate and fun to talk about. That's why Spring Training is exciting and gets us all talking.

You are showing your ridiculous anti-Getz bias trying make the DeJong signing sound like anything but a total win for Getz and Sox management last year. DeJong hit 18 home runs for a team starved, STARVED for power, and then he was flipped for a prospect. That was exactly what Getz and management was hoping to get out of that signing. A total win.

Yes, it's the strike zone.

A couple things before hand. I see Gallo being this year's Mousotakas, cut before the season starts. Last year Cease got traded before ST was over because he was really great in ST. I don't see that with Robert. He'll be completely unmotivated like he was as the trade deadline approached last year; this nick or injury and chasing balls low and away. He'll be starting in CF for the Sox, and we hope he shows something so we can trade him at the deadline. So, here's my lineup, (not so much bench pieces). 1. Vaughn at 1st 2. Drury at 2B. He will be this year's DeJoung. The Sox will hope he has 10 or 12 home runs by the deadline and they can flip him. Then it's Sosa 3. At SS will be Rojas to start the season. All this talk from Merkin and the Sox PR people that Colson has a great chance to leave ST as the starting SS is total BS, and the fact that they're all saying it, makes me really think it is BS. They want that extra year of control. When the time is over, then he'll come up. 4. Vargas at 3rd. Rojas will be the back up with Vargas doing some 1st and DH. 5. in LF, a platoon of Fletcher and Stater. 6. In CF, Robert until the deadline and Getz will be forced to give him away because his stats will be less bad than last year, but still not very good for him. Then Taylor. 7. LF - Benintendi 8. At catcher: first Lee and Thaiss. The two minor league guys will be up after the all-star game. Starting pitching -- I am really concerned with this. I keep hearing on various podcasts that it seems likely at Perez will be our opening day pitcher. If this is true, the rotation is in horrible shape, horrible. What is Perez? The 3rd, 4th, or 5th starter on a team with a real rotation? If we can't get, at least, two starters clearly better than Perez, our rotation will be terrible. I don't know; maybe the Sox will have him as their opening day starter to give him some false credit so we can flip him later. This is who I see as the Sox best starting pitchers in order: a. Cannon b. Martin c. Perez d. Wilson e. Burke But if anyone knows me on this board, I am a huge Thorpe fan. If he is not injured, (that is a big if) I see him as the ace of the staff when he comes up, maybe after a 3 or 4 weeks. I don't know about the bullpen. Let me use the same logic for Anderson as I did for Perez. If Anderson is our closer more than a few weeks into the season, the bullpen must be and will be absolutely terrible. So that's my opinion.

Thanks for posting this. I'm always pessimistic with any arm soreness going into Spring Training. It seems like any more, at least, half the time it's ends up as TJS.

You beat me to this. I was gong to say, "You mean along with Thorpe?"

"His performance was, frankly, awful, and it was covered up by a tiny bit of good luck. He was really, really bad. Like, I can seriously say - I have never been more disappointed by a top 50 prospect. " June 22 - Det. -- 6 innings - 0 earned runs June 28 - Col. - 6 innings - 2 earned runs July 5 - Miami - 6.1 innings - 1 earned run July 10 - Minn. - 6 innings - 2 earned runs July 21 - @KC - 6 innings - 0 earned runs Then the elbow thing started and he had two bad games then stopped. Did Cease even sniff a stretch like that in his first two years?? Now quote me his BaBS oh, I'm sorry his BABIP. What a stupid stat that must be. So BABIP tells the story and not those 5 earned runs over 36 1/3 innings. This only reinforces my last claim: You totally misrepresent the facts to fit your negative agenda. You literally said, about those six games (in quotes above) "frankly, awful . . . never more disappointed in a top 50 prospect". How can you with a straight face type that up and then stand by it. You're continuing to make stuff up, finding silly stats, rather than admit; again, that Thorpe, Iriate, and Zavala are literally something, not nothing. You cannot win this debate, not with that stretch of games and Iriate's 55 ranking for MLB. They are something and the value of return on the Cease trade is still open for discussion.

"Right now, the White Sox seem really likely to have traded away Cease and Fedde and Kopech without literally anything of value in return." The exaggeration and ignoring of facts and reality by the doomsayers and complainers on this board is incredible, just incredible. Now I get the complaining about the Fedde/ Kopech trade; I can't start to justify that one. But again there is no real evidence that the Sox lost the Cease trade, none! It very possible that the Sox might resoundingly win that trade. The evidence for that being a Sox win is every bit as strong as the evidence that the Sox lost it. But still people with their negativity agenda have to continue to warp facts and info. First of all, that people are citing Steve Wilson as evidence that the Sox lost that trade, that is totally ridiculous. Wilson from the start was a 100% a throw-in of no value. People saying the Sox lost the Cease trade because Wilson was cut, is exactly like saying the Sox lost the Chris Sale trade because Victor Diaz never made it to the majors. Both players were throw-ins, none factors in the trades. So Thorpe and Iriarte are "without anything literally of value"? Really, really? Are you going to maybe admit that there's a little, tiny smidgen of exaggeration there, maybe some hyperbole, or a total misrepresentation of the true; because i'm going with the last one, the misrepresentation thing. It's funny how in "without anything literally of value", the poster is willing to declare a 20 year old prospect loaded with talent as a bust, but at the same time ignoring a five game stretch of pitching by Thorpe, as a rookie, that was way, way better than any sort of five game stretch Cease achieve in his first couple years. That five game stretch and Iriarte's 55 level fastball, slider, and changeup (that's right off MLB.com), and Zavala's athletic talent, I think that those are things literally very much of value. But go ahead and dismiss the trade as a loss because of Victor Diaz, oops, I meant Steve Wilson.

I'm surprised no one has brought up, what seems to me, to be the biggest problem in sports: NIL money and the open transfer rule. This combination is just ruining college sports because really now, at the end of every season, every single is player is a free agent who can dump whatever college he/ she is at and chase after a bigger payday from whatever school's NIL deal. Unless there's a way to solve or slow this, it is going to quickly drain away a huge appeal of college sports.

So, listening to REKAP podcast, and someone asked if Thorpe would be ready for spring training, and (I think) McGuffey answered that he heard or he thought that Thrope was TBD for spring training. Had anyone heard that? I had no idea. I thought that shutting him down and the elbow thing done, that he would be completely ready by spring. I saw this and thought he was good for spring. What happened? This is from CBS Sports, Dec. 11: White Sox general manager Chris Getz said Wednesday that Thorpe (elbow) is going through his normal offseason throwing program and expected to be 100 percent for spring training, Scott Merkin of MLB.com reports. Thorpe underwent surgery in early September to remove a bone spur in his right elbow but has apparently already made a full recovery. So what went wrong??

So, after Lenyn Sosa had that great September, really seeming to have put it together (.373 - .398 OBP - .566 SLG - .964 OPS). I just thought that the White Sox would finally have a clear answer (or at least clear leading candidate) for 2B going into spring training. I thought things looked good, but I admit it was a small sample size, but I have to believe that's the best month the Sox have gotten from a 2nd basemen in a loooong time. Well, I'm not really seeing that on this board that people see him as the starting 2B next year, and I'm really not getting that from the Sox podcast I've been listening to: (Garfien, REKAP, and FutureSox). All three of the podcasts seem to think there's a strong possibility/ likelihood that Meidroth with his excellent OBP skills will leave spring training as the Sox starting 2B. These podcasts state that Meidroth did it for an entire AAA season and now he's ready for the majors. I just find this interesting. It seems to strike me as 2nd-String quarterback syndrome (that the unknown guy has to be better than who we have). Yes, the Sox need people who finally make pitchers work and can get on base, but don't they also need power. Yes, they absolutely need power, so why is one strength, taking walks, more valuable than what looks like (he had 4 in September) 15 to 20 home runs in 2025. I just don't get this. Is it defense? How is a year at AAA a more telling sign than a good month in the majors? Is Meidroth better than Sosa on D. Is he or is it that 2nd string quarterback thing again? Just curious what people think. I just want to be talking Sox baseball.

Does anyone only see a minor league deal with Moncada also? I can't imagine anyone would guarantee him any money at all with his injury (and not caring) history.

Let me deal with some of the people who question that I question WAR. First of all I think you guys that don't understand what WAR is. So many of the factors you talk about that go into WAR are absolutely arbitrary, someone's opinion. Arbitrary - adj - based on random choice or personal whim, rather than any reason or system. Whether I runner took 2nd base on Benintendi that an average right fielder would have prevented is totally a conjecture and opinion, completely a guess and assumption. "Well, a RF with a better arm would have held that guy to one base." But how do you know that RF with the better arm would have gotten the jump on the ball that Benintendi got from his experience playing RF? Maybe that other RF would have gotten to the ball half a second later, so his arm would not have mattered. Total conjecture and opinion. The same with base running. Of course guys run faster than Vaughn (and Abreu), but how do you know that this WAR object player might not have been thrown out at 2nd and 3rd, when Vaughn would have stayed at 1st and not run his team out of an inning: arbitrary. You are stating that WAR is a stat that absolutely quantifies the value of a player when a large portion of the data that goes into that stat is largely unquantifiable. Defense, running the bases, holding a guy to one less base, etc. ; those type of things are COMPLETELY based on the eye test, conjecture, and opinion, exactly what WAR says it removes. Did you guys ever understand that about WAR? I don't think I'm the one that doesn't understand WAR NEXT - Of course Abreu had a low OBP when he led the AL in RBIs. He was not there to get on base; he was there to put the ball in play, to drive the ball hard, and get people home, which he did better than anyone else in the AL that year. It kills me when people say RBIs is "meaningless stat". The goal of the game is to score runs. Bringing in runs is, arguably, the most important stat for a runner: scoring himself and others. RBIs shows who is a clutch hitter and able to get the job. Anyone who says RBIs don't matter, again, is not seeing the forest for the trees. (You're ignoring what's important to make some other minor/ silly point.) Are you really going to argue that depending on where you bat in the order, that is all that matters for RBIs, and that all players on a team or in the league (leading the AL) are equally good at driving in runs, so who you bat at 3rd or 4th doesn't matter. Let's just have the guy with the best OBP bat 4th, he'll lead the league in RBIs. Now - back to my main point on WAR, my example. I will admit that Yolmer Sanchez won the Gold Glove at 2nd in 2019. But still be honest with yourself and think: do you really believe that Abreu with 33 hrs and leading the league in RBIs was responsible for only 1.1 more wins for the Sox than Yolmer that year? Do you really believe that is correct and true? You have to be able to see that cannot be correct, and at least, a little bit question WAR as a stat.

I haven't posted one of my anti-War rants in a while, maybe it is time again. But I'm sorry, any stat that shows two guys who far and away led their team in home runs and RBIs as negatives to the win total of the team is just ridiculous. In 2019 (according to fangraphs) Abreu hit 33 HRs and led the league with a 123 RBIs. He had an war of 1.9 - One Point Nine after leading the league in RBIs. What a joke! How can anyone see an example like that and not question, at least, the validity of WAR. That same year Yolmer Sanchez had a war of 0.8. Really?? Abreau (the year before he won MVP) was only responsible for one more win for the Sox than Yolmer Sanchez?? Again, how can you see that and not question the validity of war? War is a can't see the forest for the trees stat. That everyone just accepts War as an absolute measure of a player's value strikes me as silly.