vilehoopster

A couple things before hand. I see Gallo being this year's Mousotakas, cut before the season starts. Last year Cease got traded before ST was over because he was really great in ST. I don't see that with Robert. He'll be completely unmotivated like he was as the trade deadline approached last year; this nick or injury and chasing balls low and away. He'll be starting in CF for the Sox, and we hope he shows something so we can trade him at the deadline. So, here's my lineup, (not so much bench pieces). 1. Vaughn at 1st 2. Drury at 2B. He will be this year's DeJoung. The Sox will hope he has 10 or 12 home runs by the deadline and they can flip him. Then it's Sosa 3. At SS will be Rojas to start the season. All this talk from Merkin and the Sox PR people that Colson has a great chance to leave ST as the starting SS is total BS, and the fact that they're all saying it, makes me really think it is BS. They want that extra year of control. When the time is over, then he'll come up. 4. Vargas at 3rd. Rojas will be the back up with Vargas doing some 1st and DH. 5. in LF, a platoon of Fletcher and Stater. 6. In CF, Robert until the deadline and Getz will be forced to give him away because his stats will be less bad than last year, but still not very good for him. Then Taylor. 7. LF - Benintendi 8. At catcher: first Lee and Thaiss. The two minor league guys will be up after the all-star game. Starting pitching -- I am really concerned with this. I keep hearing on various podcasts that it seems likely at Perez will be our opening day pitcher. If this is true, the rotation is in horrible shape, horrible. What is Perez? The 3rd, 4th, or 5th starter on a team with a real rotation? If we can't get, at least, two starters clearly better than Perez, our rotation will be terrible. I don't know; maybe the Sox will have him as their opening day starter to give him some false credit so we can flip him later. This is who I see as the Sox best starting pitchers in order: a. Cannon b. Martin c. Perez d. Wilson e. Burke But if anyone knows me on this board, I am a huge Thorpe fan. If he is not injured, (that is a big if) I see him as the ace of the staff when he comes up, maybe after a 3 or 4 weeks. I don't know about the bullpen. Let me use the same logic for Anderson as I did for Perez. If Anderson is our closer more than a few weeks into the season, the bullpen must be and will be absolutely terrible. So that's my opinion.

Thanks for posting this. I'm always pessimistic with any arm soreness going into Spring Training. It seems like any more, at least, half the time it's ends up as TJS.

You beat me to this. I was gong to say, "You mean along with Thorpe?"

"His performance was, frankly, awful, and it was covered up by a tiny bit of good luck. He was really, really bad. Like, I can seriously say - I have never been more disappointed by a top 50 prospect. " June 22 - Det. -- 6 innings - 0 earned runs June 28 - Col. - 6 innings - 2 earned runs July 5 - Miami - 6.1 innings - 1 earned run July 10 - Minn. - 6 innings - 2 earned runs July 21 - @KC - 6 innings - 0 earned runs Then the elbow thing started and he had two bad games then stopped. Did Cease even sniff a stretch like that in his first two years?? Now quote me his BaBS oh, I'm sorry his BABIP. What a stupid stat that must be. So BABIP tells the story and not those 5 earned runs over 36 1/3 innings. This only reinforces my last claim: You totally misrepresent the facts to fit your negative agenda. You literally said, about those six games (in quotes above) "frankly, awful . . . never more disappointed in a top 50 prospect". How can you with a straight face type that up and then stand by it. You're continuing to make stuff up, finding silly stats, rather than admit; again, that Thorpe, Iriate, and Zavala are literally something, not nothing. You cannot win this debate, not with that stretch of games and Iriate's 55 ranking for MLB. They are something and the value of return on the Cease trade is still open for discussion.

"Right now, the White Sox seem really likely to have traded away Cease and Fedde and Kopech without literally anything of value in return." The exaggeration and ignoring of facts and reality by the doomsayers and complainers on this board is incredible, just incredible. Now I get the complaining about the Fedde/ Kopech trade; I can't start to justify that one. But again there is no real evidence that the Sox lost the Cease trade, none! It very possible that the Sox might resoundingly win that trade. The evidence for that being a Sox win is every bit as strong as the evidence that the Sox lost it. But still people with their negativity agenda have to continue to warp facts and info. First of all, that people are citing Steve Wilson as evidence that the Sox lost that trade, that is totally ridiculous. Wilson from the start was a 100% a throw-in of no value. People saying the Sox lost the Cease trade because Wilson was cut, is exactly like saying the Sox lost the Chris Sale trade because Victor Diaz never made it to the majors. Both players were throw-ins, none factors in the trades. So Thorpe and Iriarte are "without anything literally of value"? Really, really? Are you going to maybe admit that there's a little, tiny smidgen of exaggeration there, maybe some hyperbole, or a total misrepresentation of the true; because i'm going with the last one, the misrepresentation thing. It's funny how in "without anything literally of value", the poster is willing to declare a 20 year old prospect loaded with talent as a bust, but at the same time ignoring a five game stretch of pitching by Thorpe, as a rookie, that was way, way better than any sort of five game stretch Cease achieve in his first couple years. That five game stretch and Iriarte's 55 level fastball, slider, and changeup (that's right off MLB.com), and Zavala's athletic talent, I think that those are things literally very much of value. But go ahead and dismiss the trade as a loss because of Victor Diaz, oops, I meant Steve Wilson.

I'm surprised no one has brought up, what seems to me, to be the biggest problem in sports: NIL money and the open transfer rule. This combination is just ruining college sports because really now, at the end of every season, every single is player is a free agent who can dump whatever college he/ she is at and chase after a bigger payday from whatever school's NIL deal. Unless there's a way to solve or slow this, it is going to quickly drain away a huge appeal of college sports.

So, listening to REKAP podcast, and someone asked if Thorpe would be ready for spring training, and (I think) McGuffey answered that he heard or he thought that Thrope was TBD for spring training. Had anyone heard that? I had no idea. I thought that shutting him down and the elbow thing done, that he would be completely ready by spring. I saw this and thought he was good for spring. What happened? This is from CBS Sports, Dec. 11: White Sox general manager Chris Getz said Wednesday that Thorpe (elbow) is going through his normal offseason throwing program and expected to be 100 percent for spring training, Scott Merkin of MLB.com reports. Thorpe underwent surgery in early September to remove a bone spur in his right elbow but has apparently already made a full recovery. So what went wrong??

So, after Lenyn Sosa had that great September, really seeming to have put it together (.373 - .398 OBP - .566 SLG - .964 OPS). I just thought that the White Sox would finally have a clear answer (or at least clear leading candidate) for 2B going into spring training. I thought things looked good, but I admit it was a small sample size, but I have to believe that's the best month the Sox have gotten from a 2nd basemen in a loooong time. Well, I'm not really seeing that on this board that people see him as the starting 2B next year, and I'm really not getting that from the Sox podcast I've been listening to: (Garfien, REKAP, and FutureSox). All three of the podcasts seem to think there's a strong possibility/ likelihood that Meidroth with his excellent OBP skills will leave spring training as the Sox starting 2B. These podcasts state that Meidroth did it for an entire AAA season and now he's ready for the majors. I just find this interesting. It seems to strike me as 2nd-String quarterback syndrome (that the unknown guy has to be better than who we have). Yes, the Sox need people who finally make pitchers work and can get on base, but don't they also need power. Yes, they absolutely need power, so why is one strength, taking walks, more valuable than what looks like (he had 4 in September) 15 to 20 home runs in 2025. I just don't get this. Is it defense? How is a year at AAA a more telling sign than a good month in the majors? Is Meidroth better than Sosa on D. Is he or is it that 2nd string quarterback thing again? Just curious what people think. I just want to be talking Sox baseball.

Does anyone only see a minor league deal with Moncada also? I can't imagine anyone would guarantee him any money at all with his injury (and not caring) history.

Let me deal with some of the people who question that I question WAR. First of all I think you guys that don't understand what WAR is. So many of the factors you talk about that go into WAR are absolutely arbitrary, someone's opinion. Arbitrary - adj - based on random choice or personal whim, rather than any reason or system. Whether I runner took 2nd base on Benintendi that an average right fielder would have prevented is totally a conjecture and opinion, completely a guess and assumption. "Well, a RF with a better arm would have held that guy to one base." But how do you know that RF with the better arm would have gotten the jump on the ball that Benintendi got from his experience playing RF? Maybe that other RF would have gotten to the ball half a second later, so his arm would not have mattered. Total conjecture and opinion. The same with base running. Of course guys run faster than Vaughn (and Abreu), but how do you know that this WAR object player might not have been thrown out at 2nd and 3rd, when Vaughn would have stayed at 1st and not run his team out of an inning: arbitrary. You are stating that WAR is a stat that absolutely quantifies the value of a player when a large portion of the data that goes into that stat is largely unquantifiable. Defense, running the bases, holding a guy to one less base, etc. ; those type of things are COMPLETELY based on the eye test, conjecture, and opinion, exactly what WAR says it removes. Did you guys ever understand that about WAR? I don't think I'm the one that doesn't understand WAR NEXT - Of course Abreu had a low OBP when he led the AL in RBIs. He was not there to get on base; he was there to put the ball in play, to drive the ball hard, and get people home, which he did better than anyone else in the AL that year. It kills me when people say RBIs is "meaningless stat". The goal of the game is to score runs. Bringing in runs is, arguably, the most important stat for a runner: scoring himself and others. RBIs shows who is a clutch hitter and able to get the job. Anyone who says RBIs don't matter, again, is not seeing the forest for the trees. (You're ignoring what's important to make some other minor/ silly point.) Are you really going to argue that depending on where you bat in the order, that is all that matters for RBIs, and that all players on a team or in the league (leading the AL) are equally good at driving in runs, so who you bat at 3rd or 4th doesn't matter. Let's just have the guy with the best OBP bat 4th, he'll lead the league in RBIs. Now - back to my main point on WAR, my example. I will admit that Yolmer Sanchez won the Gold Glove at 2nd in 2019. But still be honest with yourself and think: do you really believe that Abreu with 33 hrs and leading the league in RBIs was responsible for only 1.1 more wins for the Sox than Yolmer that year? Do you really believe that is correct and true? You have to be able to see that cannot be correct, and at least, a little bit question WAR as a stat.

I haven't posted one of my anti-War rants in a while, maybe it is time again. But I'm sorry, any stat that shows two guys who far and away led their team in home runs and RBIs as negatives to the win total of the team is just ridiculous. In 2019 (according to fangraphs) Abreu hit 33 HRs and led the league with a 123 RBIs. He had an war of 1.9 - One Point Nine after leading the league in RBIs. What a joke! How can anyone see an example like that and not question, at least, the validity of WAR. That same year Yolmer Sanchez had a war of 0.8. Really?? Abreau (the year before he won MVP) was only responsible for one more win for the Sox than Yolmer Sanchez?? Again, how can you see that and not question the validity of war? War is a can't see the forest for the trees stat. That everyone just accepts War as an absolute measure of a player's value strikes me as silly.

"Most of us wanted to see him gone but on a team starved for HRs he's the grass isn't always greener or better the devil you know than the devil you don't choice." I agree with this idea. I get that people are disappointed with Vaughn (and Benintendi too). I blame both of them, with their terrible starts last year, as much an anyone for why the Sox set the all-time loss record. And with Vaughn, we expected so much more from him. But they both were far and away the best (or least bad) power/ home run hitters on the team last year, and probably the same for the upcoming year. So with that said, I don't understand this mentality of "dump Vaughn or don't resign him", or "we should DFA/ flip Benintendi" people. The Sox don't have anyone, anyone for next year with near their power and ability to drive in runs. Why would we just want to get rid of guys (even diappointing/ ungood guys) when the Sox don't anyone else close to as good. Is the goal of these to see the Sox only win 40 or so game again next year? Sometimes it's really hard for me not to believe the people who make these statements about dumping or flipping the Sox better (or again, less-bad) players want the Sox to lose so that they have more ammunition to complain with.

I have only listened to half of it so far, and I usually try to be more opitmistic than other posters on this forum, and I generally defend Getz (What could/ can he do with Jerry stuff?). But what I've heard so far is just general cooperate level "stay the course" and "it's gonna take time" stuff. We've heard it all before FROM HIM over and over. I know he wouldn't go on a podcast to get destroyed, but I really felt both questioners were really throwing him softball questions.

I agree with this 100%. If the guy is good or really good, maybe the Sox should do something really crazy and keep him to help win some more games. When did winning games not become the goal; but instead, the goal became stocking the minors with players who MIGHT be good in a two or three years.

Has anyone else noticed that since NIL and everyone is paying their players, that SEC football is all of a sudden very average at best? It was ironic to hear Saban complaining about players getting paid with NIL money and teams buying players when he and Alabama (and the rest of the SEC) have been paying players illegally for years and years. Off google but shortened with AI: Saban worries that the current NIL landscape allows wealthier schools and alumni networks to provide significantly more lucrative deals to players, creating a "caste system" where some programs have an unfair advantage. Again, my evidence is that the SEC has been embarrassed this year in bowl games. Why is that? Because now paying players is out in the open and everyone is paying their players, not just the SEC

MLB.com put out a video of the top-five White Sox outfield assists from '24. In the few games he played, Fletcher has three of the five shown on the video. I think that says something, especially to all the people saying his defense is terrible, especially when talking about his defense in right field. https://www.mlb.com/whitesox/video/white-sox-s-top-5-outfield-assists-of-2024?t=statcast

Unless the White Sox sign some real quality (or even moderate quality) free agents (does anyone start to think that will happen?), doesn't it seem that the Sox have to do every thing they can do/ give every chance they possibly can to make Vargas and Fletcher passable/ solid/ good major league players. The Sox have to have both of those guys in the lineup starting with spring training and into, at least, the first couple months of the season, maybe longer if we have a cold spring. It just seems that for either or both those guys to have a chance with the Sox, they have to believe the Sox are behind them and that they can make mistakes without being on the chopping block if they/ either one have a crappy spring training or April. If for no other reason, it seems that Sox management would really, really want both to succeed to justify the trades for both of them. And let's be honest, giving up Fedde and Kopech for Vargas is going to take a lot of justification because that trade looks awful, awful right now. Some have suggested that Fletcher will share right field with Slater, which I guess would be fine, a solid outcome for the trade. But I would think the Sox are hoping that Fletcher will take over right field completely. Does anyone not see this happening?

https://www.mlb.com/news/2024-25-mlb-free-agent-fits-for-every-team MLB.com put out of list of "One free agent suggestion for every team". Now Merkin wrote the blurb for the Sox in this MLB article, but I agree with it 100%. I would love for the Sox to sign and bring back Jose Quintana. Like Merkin, I'm not optimistic the Sox management would be willing to put up the money, but I have such fond memories of Quintana that I would really enjoy seeing him in a Sox uniform again. In all honesty, I'm not sure that Quintana would be really much better than whoever the Sox have slated at the bottom of their rotation, but still, I would really like to have him back here throwing for the White Sox. One thing about Quintana, and Sale too. When they were throwing for the Sox, I used to feel so sorry for them both because they always seemed to get so little offensive support. They both seemed never to get enough runs to help them out if they made the slightest mistake while pitching for those old Sox teams. The funny thing is that that Sox lineup and offense back when they both threw for the Sox would be like a Murderers Row compared to the Sox bats/ offense in '24 and probably in '25.

I know many people will go off on this, but I would like to see the Sox resign Chris Flexen. Some people made this joke earlier on this board, but it's probably more or less true: Flexen is probably too expensive for the Sox for this year.

Wasn't the Rule Five guy Shane Smith taken with the idea he would become a starter? Should he be on this list? I think at the very least, Smith sees himself as a starter next year. Didn't I see that in a couple articles after the Sox selected him?

Do the dimensions of the park matter when you never lift the ball and are always hitting it hard through the infield? I remember a month or so listening to the Chuck Garfien podcast with new director of hitting Ryan Fuller. Fuller talked at length about this and that he can do to help a player, and one of the thinks he talked about was getting a player to lift the ball more. I wanted to ask if he discussed lifting the ball with Eloy in his short time there. Somehow I would bet he did. Between the Sox and the Orioles coaching staff, how many players and coaches preached, talked, and worked with Eloy to try to get him to lift the ball more? What do you think: 15 to 20? It never sunk in.

That there is an off-season, two-page, 34 reply thread on this board about a Sox announcer misprononucing a name during a basketball game just shows how hard people are looking for things to complain about. It's just ridiculous. We get it: you're unhappy about the team and the 121 losses. But then again, after you post a few hunderd times (no hyperbole with that few hundred times number, it might over a thousand for few) that Getz, Riensdorf, Sox players and management all completely suck; after doing that over and over and over . . . I guess you're forced to find something new to complain about.

Oldsox and I had the same question at the same time.

So, are you, and Callis, thinking Montgomery are SS or 3rd? If at SS, isn't that hole/ problem solved? As for 2nd base, after Sosa's September, doesn't it also look like the Sox might have very well solved their 2nd base hole? So why Meidroth?

So we should trade Robert to get a young outfielder loaded with offensive and defensive potential? Does anyone else see a weakness in this logic?