Look at Ray Ray Run

I actually disagree here. All he has to do is add a little authority (not a lot) to his skill set and he becomes as 750/800 slashing 2nd baseman with GG defense and elite base running... while competing for batting titles. That's a consistent 4+ WAR player... well worth his draft slot. Also, let me add that the new baseball will greatly help someone like madrigal.. much more than it would an already powerful hitter. He should benefit significantly from it.

At this point its pitch selection not selling out that is his problem. His hands are so incredible that he can hit anything and everything whenever he wants. What his next step of development should be is identifying those pitches that he can hit with more authority and attacking those as opposed to attacking everything close to the strike zone. He's clearly talented enough to make contact on almost anything, so now he just needs to adjust to attack his pitch.

I understand the disappointment of some fans, but madrigal has been nearly as advertised so far... he just hasn't upped his hit authority to a level that enhances his hit tool to the fullest ability. Madigral has the lowest swing and miss and lowest strike out rate in all of professional baseball. He's not overmatched in the least bit at his level. His elite hit tool has been on full display but it's being dragged down by his lack of power right now. If madrigal goes to the AA and maintains baseballs lowest K and swing and miss rate then his overall production should remain nearly the same as it is now. He shouldnt see much regression between any level because his babip cant go much lower as their is a floor regardless of contact quality. Madrigal has been fine. His k-bb percentage is excellent. His base running and defense are both still excellent. Madrigal is about 5 mph of EV away from hitting 330 regardless of level; assuming he continues to not be overmatched which he has shown no signs of being yet.

I'm pretty sure when anyone says something in regards to rating a player or evaluating a player on here that it is an opinion. If itll clear up the confusion I'll go ahead and sign all my posts with "In my opinion" Going forward. - In my opinion

Sure, and I can make a case to support that. I prefer peaks. It's an argument that can certainly be made - you listed 6 hitters, i said I would take peak Frank Thomas over all of them. You laughed... now after further looking at the numbers it appears a case can be made for him as well as others. Hence how my opinion is subjective, but absolutely in the realm of reasonable thought. On that note, I dont want to debate Frank Thomas as willie May's all night. Tre fletcher is off the board so I no longer care about the draft. Have a nice night.

Fair point certainly. I'd argue Mays had the big advantage of not spending his entire career playing against a league that was 50% users... as well as playing in an era with less talent overall.

Lol it least it stemmed from an Andrew Vaughn discussion so its draftish

Lol yet you're laughing at me saying Frank is better... now its splitting hairs? So what were you laughing about exactly? People can be critical of me for a lot of things, but if I misunderstand or say something wrong I admit it and move on. You didnt understand the discussion, assumed I said Frank was better overall, laughed and were wrong. It's ok to admit it and move on. Frank is absolutely in the argument for top 5 right handed hitter of all-time, as I wrote and which triggered the discussion.

Seriously what are you citing? Do you even know what this discussion is about? No one is arguing Frank Thomas was a better overall player than willie Mays. Frank Thomas was a better hitter though.

As a right handed hitter? No one is talking about as an overall player. Pretty simple here, but franks career ops is 974 and Mays was 941. Frank had an ops north of 1000 7 times over a 10 year period. Mays did it 5 times in his career. Peak Frank Thomas (his 5 best years) are pretty much better than almost anyone who has ever played the game. What's funny is your a Sox fan and you're arguing against something that's pro-Sox that was actually true.

I really do too. Love that he wasnt throwing as hard as he could at showcases. Love that his best pitch is a secondary pitch right now. Obsession with velocity is overrated. Love that they took a kid with a nice fastball but advanced secondary.

I'd take peak Frank Thomas over ever single person you listed. DiMaggio played in an era where Frank Thomas wasnt allowed to play. So hard pass there. Aaron never peaked where Frank did. Mays all around was much better but as a hitter soley, during peak years, he was not frank.

A 20 power would likely never hit a mlb home run, let alone 18 of them. Pierre was weak but a 20 power is something youd assign to a high school kid who hits zero homers.

That kids 4 seam fastball had tail too it of like 6 inches. What in the fuck?

What's everyone's love affair with misner here?

I think most people understand how special one of the three greatest right handed hitters ever was.

No, a hit tool requires some power in it to produce a high average. An 80 hit tool with a 20 power would be a guy who would fight to hit 250. Contact quality is really important, and most people who can find contact consistently and play professional baseball will find enough power to hit for great average. That's why people are worrying too much about madrigal. He's not overmatched, he just doesnt have quite enough oooomph on his balls yet to boost his average but hes still getting to everything, putting it in play and not swing and missing. The next step in production will be learning to attach pitches he can drive while increasing his overall hit authority. The reason you take a 70+ hit tool early with power questions is that you need such little power for that grade to matter - below average league power and a 70 hit tool is an elite hitter.

What????? He has the lowest k-rate In ALL of professional baseball jack the lowest swing and miss rate as well (of thousands of professional baseball players). That is literally one of the main basis for hit tool. Power feeds into a hit tool to assist average, but putting every pitch in play and never missing is literally the definition of a hit tool. Madrigal hit tool had absolutely been a 70. The problem is his power hasnt come up yet.

I'm like 98% sure these player evals are prerecorded and these guys keep saying great picks despite not knowing where they're drafted.

Yankees drafting a north east kid. Jesus, probably a steal

Ftr Jack, Mike trout was by far the best high school player alive. It wasnt close but scouts thought far too much about his competition instead of his incredible production.

Comparing Andrew Vaughn to jered Mitchell is like comparing peyton manning to jamarcus russell.

Absolutely shocked to see theo reach for an arm. Reaching for a bat he loves makes complete sense. An arm though? His track record would say this is a disaster.

Just weird. Theo has 20 years of history saying he has no idea drafting arms... and 20 years showing his a position player savant and they draft the riskiest arm possible. Edit: I was gonna say, this made no sense.

The success of right handed high schoolers drafted near the top of a draft is near zero. Josh Beckett is the last one I can think of but I may be forgetting someone.