Look at Ray Ray Run

I don't need his FIP to be great. I also don't need it to be 4.8+. No matter how much weak contact you induce, no one is running an ERA a full run better than their fip consistently. Also, a lot of noise in weak contact through that kind of sample. His minor league track record was sparkling but he was traded by two teams. Thorpe needs another pitch.

I'm not drawing conclusions on Vargas, although concerned a little bit for the same reason his stock has dipped a bit. Thorpe is a pretty easy evaluation imo. I look over into the twins dugout and I see his ceiling sitting there in Chris Paddack and Paddacks fastball has always been better than thorpes even though it's also trash. Paddack fooled the league for his first trip through with an elite change up and then became what every other one pitch starter becomes.

More amazing that the White Sox have a GM that is less qualified than some people here are for that job.

Trout is still a star whenever he's on the field. This isn't a similar thing imo. Injuries suck, but no one is cursing trout being in the lineup when healthy.

He did not have 5 consecutive great starts. He had a FIP of 4.8ish before he ever got "hurt."

It's amazing to me how many Sox fans are fighting for the respect of Chris Getz.

I'm very aware of what it means. Drew thorpe has one plus pitch, with a subpar fastball as a starter. One pitch starters aren't a recipe for stardom. His entire value is tied to one pitch maintaining elite value and even then that makes him a #4. I was never impressed with thorpe this year as most of his success was just driven by good luck.

When aren't you deferring your opinions to someone else? Drew Thorpes ceiling is a #4.

The prospect ranking world is ripe with group think and are not an authority on evaluation imo.

The White Sox were horrible last year. This year, they're on pace to win TWENTY THREE fewer games than that horrible team. 23 games last year is the difference between the White Sox and the world series appearing diamondbacks (84 wins). Getz took the inferno and turned it into a nuclear explosion. That's not even to speak for the fact that there biggest problem is zero talent developed internally which was his main job prior.

... the guy said he didn't like the team he acquired, made a ton of changes and then fielded the worst team in mlb history. How is that a wash?

I'll say this though, jazz balling out in New York.

Yes, I frequently draw strong conclusions based on the outcome of one trade deadline where the two best players available weren't even dealt. Not like there were stars flying from one team to the next. Also, why would teams be more willing to move top 100 prospects at years end (which just happened this past off season) but not at deadline? This means nothing more than a lot of garbage was moved around.

As I said in my initial post, I want to keep him and still would try that at all costs. I'm just not dumb enough to think that if they don't trade him today, they're keeping him. They've announced to the world they're trading him.

Based on what I've read about Bannister, he wouldn't even want crochet to do that. They want to keep him throwing, just not a lot and at high stress (gtg there). Slowly Deload him without ever fully stopping. That means risk of injury and/or some arm fatigue and outcome regression. He's at the top right now, there's no where else for him to go. He can sustain it and continue to build value, but reality is he's gonna be innings capped ROY so not like he's going to establish himself as a work horse.

There's only risk in keeping him, no reward. Crochet leads MLB Pitchers in WAR. I think he's an incredible arm, and believe in everything he's doing, but it's still very possible he'll never be the best pitcher in the world for four straight months again in his life. In fact, it's more likely than not.

If they pay, grievances have a weird way of being forgotten. I'd love to keep Garrett. I just worry if they don't trade him it becomes a off-season best offer scenario and garrett will be worth less then.

If you're trading crochet, today is the time. Waiting until the offseason will reduce his value regardless of what some say.

Trevor rogers is terrible.

Yeah who needs crochet when you have stud trevor rogers

and CF is the weakest offensive position in baseball.

I just love to see Dave involved.

Since when did the Sox have to trade him today?

A white sox comp for vargas with the bat is Magglio. I'd say that might be his ceiling but we can dream on it.

Kind of a unfair comp since Baltimore is top six in both pitching and hitting WAR. The Mariners are 22nd in offensive WAR and 2nd in pitching. Mets on the other hand are 4th in offense and 29th in pitching.