greg775

QUOTE (Papa Tru @ Sep 29, 2011 -> 07:00 AM) Yeah I know he has been pushing for that, but I think that was more about wanting to be wanted here than just about getting more money.. He wanted to have security of being manager here for the foreseeable future.. He didn't need to plead for anything as the Marlins job was waiting for him regardless.. Once he knew that he was no longer welcome here, he pretty much left on the spot.. He got a 4 year deal in the $12 million dollar range, that cant be substantially better than what he was already making here.. A four year deal? I was mocked for suggesting he'd get one. That's the last time I'll mention it, but since nobody congratulated me so I had to take credit myself since a lot of people on here think I am a moron who does not know baseball at all.

QUOTE (chw42 @ Sep 29, 2011 -> 05:24 AM) I would love to see a well-written and well-thought out essay on this matter by one of the Ozzie supporters on this board. But that will never happen... I don't think you guys want to read another essay on why I love Ozzie. Milkman approved of my long post in the other thread. I love Ozzie Guillen. You really want more of my reasons why??

Francona. It'd be asinine to not take the best available guy. Sox are too cheap to hire him??? Then the fans should not pay the outrageous parking prices and ticket prices AND BOYCOTT THE f***ING TEAM! We can get Francona. Get him!

QUOTE (iamshack @ Sep 29, 2011 -> 05:13 AM) So let me get this straight...if you are tasked to work with some complete asshat at work, and you cannot, that means that you should be fired along with the asshat? What the hell kind of sense does that make? It makes a lot of sense. KW hired that asshat. He did. Or Jerry did. Whatever. Kenny technically hired Ozzie and said publicly he was his "boss." Jerry told the two late last season or after last season to do better and make it work. It takes two to not tango. KW is just as much to blame of the fallout with Ozzie as Ozzie. You are totally taking KW's side on that??

If Francona gets fired, we'd be fools to not hire him. Cmon Sox. Wait a few weeks if Francona is available!

I have another question for you guys. Seriously, Atlanta and Boston did not make the playoffs after looking like they were locks. They blew it. Their fans bases must be furious, FURIOUS. So should their managers be fired??? Answer this please. Should Boston and Atlanta fire their managers. Those were EPIC failures in not making the playoffs. My point so many fan bases want to fire their managers. I think Ozzie is a good manager.

QUOTE (nitetrain8601 @ Sep 28, 2011 -> 10:52 PM) Greg, serious question, what would it take for you to stop supporting Ozzie Guillen? Like, what would he have to say and/or do for you to stop caring about him? QUOTE (NorthSideSox72 @ Sep 28, 2011 -> 11:17 PM) Greg- I want you to consider something. You seem like a very loyal guy. Loyal to players, coaches and managers that had a lot of meaning to the organization. Even well after their prime, you defend them. There is something good about that. But let me ask you this. Let's say you are in Jerry Reinsdorff's shoes. He too is a very loyal guy (which alone should tell you something here). The organization has had multiple disappointing years in a row, despite your spending of a lot of money. You've got two people under him, that over the past month, have done this: Person #1 offered to step down to a lower role due to the failures of the team. Person #2 asked repeatedly for a raise and a long term contract, despite those same failures. So, if loyalty is your game... which of those two do you keep? Because it seems to me that you are backing the wrong horse here, based on your own admitted tendencies. 1.) Good question. The problem is most of the stuff he says doesn't ever bother me because I think he is like a comedian, he puts on a show for the media. That money thing to me was like a stand up comedy act. I swear, whenever I listen to interviews, like 17 full minutes on mlb.com I hear a gracious Ozzie. What would he have to say? Well, it'd have to be in a setting where I believe he means what he says instead of is putting on a comedy act. I guess if he said in a 1-1 interview with ESPN that he hates all his players including Mark and Konerko and thinks all Chicago fans are full of s*** I guess I would start to hate him. 2.) OK I am in Jerry's shoes. Fair question. I think I stated in a few other threads weeks ago that if Ozzie got canned even he would think he deserved to be canned. And in one interview I saw he said indeed he didn't deserve to be here next year. He said, 'I didn't earn it," or something like that. But to answer your question ... If I am in Jerry's shoes, because I told the two of them they had to get along, they had to behave, they had to work together ... and because the two did not work together, I would replace both of them. They did not make it work. They blew it. And deep down they would know they both deserved to be fired. Now you imply that it would be easy for Jerry to keep Kenny because he offered to step down and Ozzie kept asking for more years and a raise. I might argue that he did it through the media and was "Ozzie being Ozzie." If in a 1-1 meeting with me, Jerry, Ozzie was that belligerent and/or cocky about getting a raise and more years, then yes I would fire him. But his media persona is quite different I am assuming than when he meets with Jerry. The bottom line is I know Ozzie deserved to get fired. But I think KW did too because of the fact the two of them COULD NOT AND WOULD NOT work together. I think both should be out the door. My desire to keep Ozzie as you all know stems from the fact I think he learned on the job here and is still young and will have a Hall of Fame career as a manager. I hate the fact he learned on the job here and now will be managing elsewhere. He got one title here, I think he'd have gotten more. Did he deserve to get fired? Yes. This year's April/May was inexcusable (even with Dunn n Rios) but KW also should be gone. If you have any other specific questions I will answer them as well.

QUOTE (Steve9347 @ Sep 28, 2011 -> 10:03 PM) Steve9347 Steve H. I would like the world to know that this article suntimes.com/sports/7914554… by @cst_Cowley is a pile of garbage. I'd like the world to know I LOVED that article. See that's where we agree to disagree. I love Ozzie Guillen.

QUOTE (Kalapse @ Sep 28, 2011 -> 07:54 PM) Well, it's not Sandy as he's staying on as Acta's bench coach. Now what? Martinez and who? Wow. It must be Martinez then who they are targeting.

QUOTE (fathom @ Sep 28, 2011 -> 03:39 PM) Next year's starting rotation should be....IMO: - Sale - Peavy - Floyd - Humber - Stewart/Axelrod Lineup should be...IMO: - De Aza - Beckham - Konerko - Viciedo - Dunn - Rios - Ramirez - AJP - Morel Lillibridge platoon with De Aza, Flowers is back-up catcher Your starting rotation screams for a veteran inning eater like Mark. If EVERYTHING went well career-year wise your team could 'conceivably' contend. So why not have a guy like Mark anchoring your staff?

QUOTE (JohnCangelosi @ Sep 28, 2011 -> 07:47 PM) This is precisely why we're all kidding ourselves to think Martinez will be the guy, as much as we may want him, because I don't believe he's a yes man. Alomar it is I have no beefs with Sandy. Bring him in.

QUOTE (Harry Chappas @ Sep 28, 2011 -> 07:37 PM) as recently as August...hell the Detroit series in early September I still thought guillen was the best option....the b****ing about the contract prior to that series and then the manner in which he felt in my opinion that he was bigger than the team and the franchise is the reason I am glad he is gone He could have waited until tomorrow and sit down with JR and even KW decide if this thing was doable. To begin this process in September makes him look like an arrogant prick...then to resign with two days left makes him look even more childish and spoiled which I now believe was the bigger issue with the entire organization the last 3 years Put Ozzie in front of reporters twice a day (the pregame dugout sessions ... wow; and postgame) and you get Ozzie. He can't help himself. I realize he also gives Cowley stuff 1-1 that's calculated ... but because of his mouth, there was no way this was going to end well, unless the Sox quietly extended him 3-4 years back in June and no way that was gonna happen. I'm assuming the marlins' media will be 1/3 the size of the Chicago media and the opportunities for him to get in trouble with his mouth there will be much less.

QUOTE (RockRaines @ Sep 28, 2011 -> 07:33 PM) I can tell you stopped watching the Sox months ago. I admit my take on this one may be off base. Morel and Flowers aren't speed demons though, are they? I guess Beckham has potential to steal some bases. Lexi is not a base stealer IMO.

QUOTE (elrockinMT @ Sep 28, 2011 -> 04:04 PM) OK, I know we have one more game today, but I officially believe we are out of it for 2011. Can we all agree it will be an interesting off season and looking forward to starting anew in 2012? Today is the saddest day of the calendar year, the end of baseball season. However, because of our gawdawful season I stopped following the games about 2 weeks ago. It's no fun being irrelevant and irrelevant is more than 10 games out. I sure hope that doesn't happen to the Sox in May or June or July like it did to the Cubs. Seasons are no fun when you are out of it and no hope of getting back in it. That's why the rebuilding people need to realize what they are asking for. If we "rebuild" and are out 10 games out in early to mid June, there will be NOBODY at the Cell. I mean in theory it sounds like fun to follow the progress of the young players, but it's really not. It's fun to win.

QUOTE (JohnCangelosi @ Sep 28, 2011 -> 07:30 PM) Doesn't part of the decision figure into who will be Kenny's "yes man" and won't rock the boat? I don't see Martinez being that guy... Sandy won't rock any boats. Isn't he very likeable and very quiet?

QUOTE (Rowand44 @ Sep 28, 2011 -> 07:27 PM) No No No Do you not agree that this team is a disaster unless these guys lift and pull career high home run totals? Speed? . De Aza LF - good speed. 2. Alexei SS - can at least score on a single when he's on second; can't steal bases 3. Dunn DH (ugh) - slow as an ox. 4. Konerko 1B - oh so slow. 5. Viciedo RF - slow but can score from second on a single I think. 6. Flowers C - slow. 7.Rios CF - fast. 8. Morel 3B - slow. 9. Beckham 2B - can score on a single from second; can't steal. Quentin if he's here - slow. Can score on a single from second. I guess I could be mistaken about flowers and morel.

QUOTE (RockRaines @ Sep 28, 2011 -> 07:20 PM) I've backed Ozzie for years, but its hard to believe you still love the guy after he just quit on the team and left for more money. I guess now that the shock has worn off (More the reality has set in than shock) and it's becoming old news, I'll stop repeating my positions on Ozzie now as I did on Bobby and Dye and Wise eventually. I'm not even tempted to repeat my reasons for loving Ozzie after reading the last two posts, so I guess I'm about done on commenting on Ozzie.

QUOTE (southsider2k5 @ Sep 28, 2011 -> 04:18 PM) There is always someone... My guess is it'll be Quentin if he's still with the team. I would guess it'll take a while to fry the new manager, but this board watches games pretty closely. He is inevitably going to call for the bunt and, barring a turnaround in the reliability of our pitchers, he will choose the wrong relievers and/or leave starters in too long once in a while. So I guess the manager will catch it some, but not as much as Oz cause Sandy will be almost mum compared to Ozzie. He's known as very soft spoken isn't he?

QUOTE (RockRaines @ Sep 28, 2011 -> 06:13 PM) The lineup I somewhat expect to see: 1. De Aza LF 2. Alexei SS 3. Dunn DH (ugh) 4. Konerko 1B 5. Viciedo RF 6. Flowers C 7.Rios CF 8. Morel 3B 9. Beckham 2B Pitching Buehrle Peavy Sale Humber Axelrod/Stewart Pen Ohman Stewart/Axelrod Reed Santiago Frasor Santos Crain But that team you list will include players we get for Danks and Floyd. Are you saying those will be minor leaguers? You lineup looks like the team. Seriously will it be the slowest team in the history of baseball? Those guys better hit a ton of home runs. Very very slow. Maybe slowest team in Sox history?

QUOTE (Jordan4life @ Sep 28, 2011 -> 06:30 PM) Greg reminds me of that little f***er Gizmo from Gremlins. Somebody got him wet and it's spawned new gregs and chaos. One greg I can deal with (and let me reiterate that I like greg). But 5-10 gregs is too much. You guys that follow individual posters and their positions slay me. I can't even tell you the positions of certain people on things my memory is not that good. I recognize fathom cause he is the king of the game threads and I pm'ed Jordan a few times so I recognize him. And caufield because he has that wild job overseas. And Milkman because he hates me because I disagree with his positions on everything. I have noticed a few people back Ozzie, not many. I can't tell u any of their names. Why don't you just read each thread for what it's worth. What about my position on Ozzie upsets you so much? I applauded those on the board who hate KW as well. It's easy to put the poster on ignore as well.

QUOTE (IowanSoxFan @ Sep 28, 2011 -> 04:53 AM) Favorite White Sox player of all time. All pitchers should copy his style. Get the ball and deliver it with confidence. Hope we sign him to a 2-3 year deal. Just do it Jerry. I'd think if St. Looie lets Pujols walk, it's a natural they'll outbid the Sox for Mark. Why wouldn't they?

Good post caufield. Here's another good column by espn chicago. Kenny has some rebounding to do. He's been rotten of late. http://espn.go.com/chicago/mlb/story/_/id/...-kenny-williams

QUOTE (Thunderbolt @ Sep 27, 2011 -> 11:47 PM) The clips i've seen so far have managed to make me really angry. Every Cubs fan who threatened his well-being at the game and in the years after should be rounded up and kicked in the nuts. It makes me physically ill to watch the replay now, and just watch the poor guy shrink into his seat and try to disappear. I feel sorry for him. He was in the wrong place at the wrong time. Almost all fans go for the ball (unfortunately). We've seen it time and again. Fans interfering. And dads dropping their kids to chase foul balls, etc.

I didn't think I was giving in. I would think most of my haters would think I haven't budged after presented their "facts, stats" thus their hatred of me grows. You must see me waffling somewhere. I'm really not crazy about Alomar being our new manager. Royals went with an inexperienced catcher once, during a rebuild in Pena, and he was a disaster. If the Red Sox blow it and their fans are imploding why can't we steal their manager just as the Marlins swooped in on Ozzie? If the Twins hate Gardy, why can't we steal him? He's experienced as well. People mock me like when I said if Guillen is so s*** why will Florida give him 4 years? Four years? I was mocked. And what is it ... four years and this disgrace of a manager is now also one of the highest paid in baseball by a cheap team. And the Sox let him go? Smart move.

QUOTE (Papa Tru @ Sep 28, 2011 -> 06:13 AM) There was no point in firing Ozzie if you keep KW on board.. this team is mediocre thanks to his poor moves, that's not going to change next year with someone new leading the team.. Amen. Post more often. Some of us blame players; some blame managers/coaches. It's to each his/her own.