LDF

QUOTE (witesoxfan @ Jul 30, 2014 -> 04:04 PM) Jose Quintana is closer to a #1 than a #3. I just don't see it, but I will respect yours and everyone opinion on this.

QUOTE (iamshack @ Jul 30, 2014 -> 03:51 PM) Here is probably the most in-depth article, and it has a lot of links and info from other sources of information as well. thanks

QUOTE (VAfan @ Jul 30, 2014 -> 03:49 PM) Still waiting for someone defending Robin to argue that he's helped the Sox win more games than they would have with an average manager. You can take whatever you want into account. Instead, all I've read is that, well, Bobby Cox and Joe Torre weren't great managers at first. Which seems to me a backhanded admission that Robin Ventura isn't a good manager now either. Sorry, but we aren't debating whether Robin Ventura might become a good manager at some hypothetical time in the future, AFTER he stops making the many poor decisions he's been making over the last 2+ years. We're debating whether Ventura is a good manager NOW, and I think those of us who argue he's below par are winning the argument rather handily. Also, to the reasons I gave above for why I think Robin costs the Sox games, I would add last season's horrible fundamentals. We had to be the worst team in baseball fundamentals. To me, that speaks volumes about a manager. Yes, the players execute, but it's the manager's job to get them prepared to play. sorry for interjecting on this discussion, but there are more to this then we know of. why would JR give robin the job in the first place without much experience? I wanted sandberg but was happy with robin. why, b/c he is there to manned the position until the sox can compete and I still think until that time, it is OJT.

QUOTE (witesoxfan @ Jul 30, 2014 -> 03:54 PM) How are you not sold on Quintana? What more can you possibly need to see? don't get me wrong I like Quintana but I really don't see him as a bona fide #2. more like a #3 and he is more valuable to any team and I am extremely happy he is with the sox.

QUOTE (StRoostifer @ Jul 30, 2014 -> 03:48 PM) Something like Montas last year, young and very raw? ohhh YES, great example

QUOTE (StRoostifer @ Jul 30, 2014 -> 03:46 PM) Agreed. Something tells me that if Danks and Beckham are traded, some fans will be very disappointed with the return. I'm expecting less and hoping for more. yep and I will go on record. it will be me. I like both players esp danks. his family gave up his initial agent (Scott B) in order to get signed by the sox. loyalty.

QUOTE (Charlie Haeger's Knuckles @ Jul 30, 2014 -> 03:36 PM) What a f***ing boring deadline. agreed, prob will wait to 1 hr before.

QUOTE (witesoxfan @ Jul 30, 2014 -> 03:40 PM) You get an A prospect for Jose Quintana (plus some). You might get a C- prospect for Gordon Beckham. you are prob right .... wishful dreaming..... maybe that is why I added salary help. oh I get it. now I know what you are reading. I meant minor league A prospect, not a graded A prospect. my bad.

QUOTE (RockRaines @ Jul 30, 2014 -> 03:30 PM) I dont think you need to pay a pitcher that much since we have legit #1 and #2 already in the fold. You dont pay a #3 pitcher that much money. I respect what you are saying, but I some what disagree. We have a #1 true and imho I am not sold on #2. I think the sox need to invest, if they can on a #1a. someone who can step in #1 if injury happens. something like philly did with lee and hamels.

QUOTE (southsider2k5 @ Jul 30, 2014 -> 02:59 PM) I worked in a pro shop at a local country club for a few summers when I was younger. He was a member at this place. He was a genuinely nice guy to all of us. ???

QUOTE (StRoostifer @ Jul 30, 2014 -> 03:26 PM) Which translates to : SF, A's etc are shopping at Kmart for blue light specials. offer salary help for a decent "A" prospect.

QUOTE (iamshack @ Jul 30, 2014 -> 02:31 PM) There is a guy who extrapolates statistics from the Cuban League to the Major Leagues and his numbers were comparable to Miguel Cabrera's numbers. I think we all sort of held that out as a lofty best case scenario (probably even we expected that was going a bit overboard). As of today, he is outperforming Miguel Cabrera with about 40 less PAs. Unf***ingbelievable. I hope you have his email or know what site he writes for..... I would LOVE to read more of his stuff.

QUOTE (RockRaines @ Jul 30, 2014 -> 03:19 PM) Or the injuries etc. Fact is that was what they thought the talent of the Sox would do. And they are in the hunt for the WC at least a year too early. I think thats pretty damn good. that hunt is hurting b/c the sox could've really used another high 1 rounder..... wish the sox had the mentality of a HOU, sCrub, or even the marlins, aim for high draft pick.

QUOTE (kev211 @ Jul 30, 2014 -> 03:17 PM) No one should be payed 25 million on this team. That's crazy. to get that ONE player whether it is a pitcher or positional player to put the team over the top, then yes. that is IF he can help to get the sox there. I was a major advocate of defending JR since this site started and before. I believe then and as I do now, JR will spend the money on good to great investment to an equally great rtn (playoff, world series and a great player). he did it with Jose A, he will not spend b/c fans expect him to.

QUOTE (witesoxfan @ Jul 30, 2014 -> 01:33 PM) His son is Bradley Salgado, reliever for Kannapolis. again many times for helping.

QUOTE (witesoxfan @ Jul 30, 2014 -> 02:50 PM) With Danks, if he's involved in rumors at all, he's going to be skipped. It doesn't mean he'll be traded, but if he is, it would really suck it pull him after the 2nd inning or something. If he takes the mound, I'd put the odds at 99.9999% he is not traded. agreed re winning 75 games or 81 does help, on paper very little but with a good P,R help with the excitement for next yr fan based. keep getting players in the FA's to help bridge the gap of prospects and emptiness. teams are always going to value draft picks but the sox need them to help build the systems. so suspect the sox of going for FA that have not been offer a QO. remember while the sox have wiggle room in the salary, I don't think they will go hog wild.

QUOTE (Eminor3rd @ Jul 30, 2014 -> 01:52 PM) This is where I am too. I would love for the team to convince Hahn that he needs to improve the MLB roster this offseason. While having a protected pick reduces the pain of signing top free agents, it also substantially reduces the incentive. we need players in the systems and with those players the sox can get the best to play while using the others to help get the missing positional player needed. in the meantime, supplant the lineup with a few FA's.

QUOTE (witesoxfan @ Jul 30, 2014 -> 01:42 PM) For the record, I do not support losing the rest of the way. I would not be upset with a top 11 pick, but I want them to end the year over .500. there several factors at play. 1 draft pick and 2 if the sox continues to due their best, it will help get the fans back and involved.

QUOTE (IowaSoxFan @ Jul 30, 2014 -> 01:40 PM) Who is this Japanese pitcher? From what I had read there isn't much coming out of Japan in the way of high end starting pitching for at least two more years. I was wrong, it is not a Japanese pitcher but a Korean pitcher, and I forgot that his American agent is Scott B, if I remember correctly. oh well sorry.

QUOTE (knightni @ Jul 30, 2014 -> 01:09 PM) Watched Lee Daniel's The Butler. It was a pretty good semi-bio pic. It's a good watcher but very Hollywood pumped up. I agree, it was a good movie.

QUOTE (caulfield12 @ Jul 30, 2014 -> 12:46 PM) Being inside the protected picks isn't going to matter that much, because we're not going after Lester, Scherzer or Shields. Same thing with Sandoval and Hanley Ramirez. Who else would we be interested in that's going to get a QO? Russell Martin, I guess. But 15 teams will be after a catcher. Yasmani Thomas and Rusney Castillo wouldn't be affected by being in the protected 10 picks. Same with the Japanese starting pitcher (although I think after what happened with Tanaka they would steer clear). Nelson Cruz should be on our target list...but for nothing more than a 2 year contract with an option for a third year. Victor Martinez...maybe? But probably going back to the Tigers in all likelihood. Seems we'll be picking through the bargain/flawed/damaged goods bin, looking at guys like Masterson, Colby Rasmus, Michael Morse, etc. what is going to be interesting is teams that may give their fa's a QO. I will write about this more as the season goes or in the offseason. with ref to the 2 Cubans and Japanese, I say sign Thomas and the Asian guy. I don't care about the injury to Tanaka, he was lights out before the injury.

QUOTE (witesoxfan @ Jul 30, 2014 -> 01:22 PM) It will be 11 due to the Astros incompetence. It is normally the top 10 that are protected. If a team does not make a qualifying offer, the free agent is not subject to a first round pick. many thanks.

QUOTE (DirtySox @ Jul 30, 2014 -> 11:54 AM) I absolutely support losing in this situation. for me, I am split on this. on 1 hand I am saying play your best every time out. on the other hand, yeah that high pick does entice me. several months ago, if anyone would have said that the sox can be contending for the WC, I would have laugh in disbelieve.

QUOTE (caulfield12 @ Jul 30, 2014 -> 12:09 PM) 1) Relievers are fungible Who were the five best non-closer relievers in baseball last season? About about in 2012? And in 2011? The list in 2013, judged by ERA+ is Neil Cotts, Luis Avilan, Alex Torres, Craig Breslow and Tanner Scheppers. In 2012, it was Scott Atchison, Eric O'Flaherty, Darren Oliver, Robbie Ross and Jake McGee. In 2011, it was David Robertson, O'Flaherty, Scott Downs, Mike Adams and Greg Holland. One name duplicated on the lists, which looked at relievers who did not have a start, threw at least 50 innings with an ERA+ of 150 or better and less than 10 saves. In 2014, none of the players from 2012 fit that criteria, much less make the top five. That's despite lowering the inning cap to 30 for the current season, too. The point is that relievers are fungible. They rarely sustain success from year to year. Remember when Mike Adams was a setup man extraordinaire? Outside of San Diego, he's proven just as unreliable as any other non-closer. Closers, too, will often be unreliable, which is why so many teams look to bolster their bullpen as they try to contend. Who would have thought two years ago that Koji Uehara would become unhittable or that Zach Britton would turn into a great closer for the Orioles? But, that success rarely lasts. With someone like Houston's Tony Sipp, what are the chances that he's able to remain this good for multiple seasons? What are the chances he pitches like he did in 2013 with Arizona or his 2010 or 2012 seasons in Cleveland? If teams are lucky, they nab one reliable closer for a two-year stretch. That's what Houston did with Chad Qualls and why they're likely to keep him around next year, too. But, counting on multiple guys performing that well? It's asking for trouble. Houston's not going to just give Sipp away. After all, he's cheap and under team control past this season. But, if a contender needs a lefty and is willing to give up talent for him? They make that move 10 times out of 10. www.crawfishboxes.com You likely won’t find a reliever cracking the top 10, but closers David Robertson, Francisco Rodriguez, Casey Janssen and Rafael Soriano have been excellent, while Luke Gregerson and Andrew Miller have been lights out in a setup capacity. www.mlbtraderumors.com (Tim Dierkes power ratings for FA's) thanks for the article, man I wish I could write like that or even have the command of the king's language like that

QUOTE (GreatScott82 @ Jul 30, 2014 -> 11:15 AM) One thing I worry about with us winning lately is that first round pick next year. I'm pretty sure the top 10 first round picks are protected, anything beyond that and the Sox will lose their first round pick next year if they sign a type-A Free Agent. As much as I want us to sign Shields, I would hate to sacrifice such a high pick. As of right now the Sox are the 11th pick. Not that I support losing in any way, but the Sox can truly benefit from being in that bottom 10. Another first round pick AND some decent FA signings and we will be in much better shape next season. it is 10 now being protected, I always thought it was 15? also, how does the QO comes into effect if the team doesn't offer it?