Chisoxfn

QUOTE (fathom @ Jul 27, 2012 -> 09:53 AM) And Quintana and Reed? Shields will cost more than Greinke or Dempster, etc. I don't think so. Borjos and Conger, which it isn't clear whether the Angels have offered all of that or not, is not enough to land Greinke or Dempster. The Rays don't have to trade Shields though, however, it would appear the Rays would move him for a couple quality MLB pieces vs. your franchises #1 prospect.

QUOTE (fathom @ Jul 27, 2012 -> 09:46 AM) Tampa desperately wants a catching prospect In that instance, I could make a case that Flowers is about as good of a prospect as Conger. Some might not agree, but Flowers has more power potential and quite frankly is better defensively. Neither Conger/Flowers have proved much at the major league level. Flowers did show he can put up a solid OPS (last year). Hard to judge him this year since he's had limited at bats, but if I were the Rays (and having watched both players), personally, I'd go after Flowers.

QUOTE (Melissa1334 @ Jul 27, 2012 -> 09:44 AM) i think that would be a move that would help them next year and not so much this year. hes been bad , could they fix him right away this year? dont know 4.3 ERA this year in the AL East. He hasn't been bad. He's a significant upgrade over Humber and keeps the rest of the rotation in-tact. Next year he helps them again. So as far as I'm concerned, he helps the club this year and in future years. The dude has a career ERA in the AL (and in the toughest division in baseball) right at 4. 30 years old, 5 consecutive years with 200 innings. Dude is a horse. He is not an ace, but he'd be a great pick-up. And to be frank, if you get him without giving up anyone in the rotation, the club actually is better off (in terms of getting into the playoffs) then if you get Zach (but give up one of Q/Floyd).

QUOTE (southsider2k5 @ Jul 27, 2012 -> 09:43 AM) Can we beat Peter Burjos? I'd think the club could. Burjos is more ready to plug in, but it isn't like he's a potential superstar. Dude is hitting sub .240. He plays exceptional defensive and projects to be a nice leadoff hitter, but he isn't like a #1 ranked prospect or anything. It also depends on what the Rays want. Burjos has a lot more value then Mitchell but if you package Mitchell (or Walker) with other players, well, Sox can beat that offer. Heck, even Hank Conger, whose name has been thrown around, while once a highly rated prospect, is no longer thought of as highly as he was a few years ago (and even then, a lot of scouts thought he had holes). Conger/Burjos is not even close to the best the Angels can offer and the Sox can put together that type of package (now if they need those specific positions, that might be harder).

While everyone is fixated on Grienke, etc? Why not look into Shields. He's having a down year, probably in part because he threw 250 innings last year. He's signed through 2014 at very fair rates and has proven he can pitch in the AL. His numbers have been a little up and down, but worse case, he's a middle of the rotation innings eater and that is pretty valuable, especially when you have a few young guys in the rotation (Sale & Q). It also means the Sox can look at selling Floyd in the off-season for some other chips (if they want to put Castro or Molina in the rotation). And if you lose Peavy, the rotation is still in decent shape. I have no idea on the cost, but I'd be willing to give up some solid talent for Shields.

QUOTE (bigruss22 @ Jul 27, 2012 -> 09:21 AM) Damn I hope you're right, this Grienke business is killing me, if I'm giving up my future for a SP then it's one that doesn't have ANY questions about them. I agree with Rock. No way is Kenny purely fixated on Zack.

QUOTE (caulfield12 @ Jul 27, 2012 -> 09:21 AM) But would Greinke realistically even consider that offer? The only way would be if he tanked and we didn't make the playoffs. Then we wouldn't want him anyway. I doubt it. I think Greinke signs in Anaheim in the off-season.

QUOTE (HickoryHuskers @ Jul 27, 2012 -> 09:19 AM) Oh, I doubt it would be both. I don't think they get Floyd if they get Reed. If the Sox have to give up Reed, then Floyd probably goes somewhere else for a bullpen arm. Reed, Santiago, and a prospect isn't getting Greinke.

QUOTE (Dick Allen @ Jul 27, 2012 -> 08:52 AM) How happy is anyone going to be if the Sox trade any of the mentioned for Greinke and his issues either cause him to be average or the Sox don't win and he walks? KW has been grilled on this board for giving away crappy minor leaguers for major leaguers. Now many people want him to give up his top young players for a guy who is very talented, but a head case, and for 10 starts. If he doesn't lead to Sox to where they want to go and he skates away, it would be a huge error. I'd love the Sox to add Greinke, but it seems there is very little chance he'd be retained and I don't think 10 starts is worth Reed and more. Don't forget, if you are giving up Floyd, then it isn't as beneficial (in terms of making the post-season). 10 starts from Greinke are better then 10 starts from Floyd, however, best case Greinke wins 2-3 more of those starts (best case). He clearly makes you better after that. I'd have a different perspective if there was still draft pick compensation, but you get nothing. I just can't support this type of a move, not at this cost. If the Sox missed the playoffs, wow, it would be incredibly detrimental, especially since it is the young talent that has helped this club so much this year. For once, be patient Kenny. Try to strike on a replacement 5th starter or if you are going to give up major chips, get a starter whose cost-controlled and will be around for another year or two.

QUOTE (SOXOBAMA @ Jul 27, 2012 -> 08:49 AM) Its Greinke or nobody. We are going all out for Greinke, the Brewers want Reed. According to Heyman, he was on WSCR I just have a hard time giving up Reed and Floyd for 2 months of Greinke. Its just tough. I can probably live with that deal though, as long as the Sox reinvest and do something in the off-season to sign a pitcher. If the Sox were interested in signing Greinke to a 4yr 80M deal, then I'd be more on board.

Making isn't the hard part. Its the marketing of it that is hard.

QUOTE (JoeCoolMan24 @ Jul 26, 2012 -> 05:36 PM) Sox are facing future Cub Allen Webster right now. Webster having control issues. I'll be irritated if the PTBNL is Walker, Johnson or Snodgress.

I really hope the Sox aren't about to acquire one of these guys. I think the cost is way too severe. I like the currently assembled team and I'll take my chances on getting Danks back in August.

QUOTE (SOXOBAMA @ Jul 26, 2012 -> 09:32 PM) A Seattle top scout wouldn't be scouting the Sox, if it was for Figgins, bullpen help or even Vargas. He would be scouting our minor league system. It depends on what teams think of Q. If teams are pretty high on Q, then getting a major league cost controlled lefty who is a #3 starter. Well, thats pretty solid value right there. Add in a guy like Addy or Nate Jones, plus 2 of Mitchell, etc. And that isn't a bad haul. It isn't a great haul either though. But the Mariners would get some major league help. Problem is, I'm not dealing a guy like Felix unless I'm getting 2 very high upside guys and I don't know if the Sox can offer that. I guess if the deal is Quintana, Viciedo, Mitchell (or someone like him) and Nate Jones, the Mariners would be willing to accept. But at that point, I don't know if you've done all that much to help the team.

QUOTE (bucket-of-suck @ Jul 26, 2012 -> 11:10 AM) Don't have names. Posted exactly what I was told last night. My feelings are that because of a variety of factors (1st place/Tigers trade/attendance spike...etc) KW is really going after it this year and wants it done yesterday. I do think there are fans that will be upset about who goes. Some very real concerns throughout this thread. There is almost no trade involving Greinke that would make me happy. About the most I'd give up is Floyd/Mitchell. If they want some other mediocre prospects, fine, but anything more is too steap of a price for what I feel only marginally helps the Sox get into the post-season. Now if they do, Greinke does make them more legit contenders in the postseason. However, that is way too steap of a price. If the sox were 6 games up, I'd be more willing, but the downside is you give up everything and barely miss out on the playoffs or get into a one game wild card and lose (in which case, Greinke probably isn't starting that game anyway). If I'm giving up a package with one other good prospect, I'm giving it up for a guy like Johnson that I can at least spin a year from now if things aren't working well (and get the benefit of next year).

QUOTE (bigruss22 @ Jul 26, 2012 -> 08:43 AM) If a kid wants to stay there, they most likely are going to stay there, if none of these events had changed their mind a couple coaches won't do it. Illinois/any school recruiting there is for the kids who WANT to transfer, which I'm assuming is a vast majority of them. People are literally preventing the kids that dont' want anything to do with this from leaving the athletic facilities. It is pathetic. It is one thing if you reach out to a player who previously showed interest or you leave a call, but to seriously stalk every football player that comes out, thats pathetic, disgusting, and slimy.

QUOTE (aboz56 @ Jul 26, 2012 -> 09:18 AM) I'm only back to harass Jason. Hahaha. Harass away. I hate seeing Buerhle pitching for Miami. He should always be in a Sox uniform and I really hope that a few years from now he's back.

QUOTE (Dick Allen @ Jul 26, 2012 -> 04:32 AM) JR on MB56 from ESPN.COM: "The only thing I can tell you is when Mark told me he had a $56-million, four-year contract offer, I told him he should take it," Reinsdorf said. "I really told Mark he had to take it. At this stage of your career, it's more money than you're worth. He said he was going to take it, but he'll back in four years." I really love Mark.

QUOTE (NorthSideSox72 @ Jul 26, 2012 -> 06:40 AM) Floyd, one of Mitchell/Walker/Thompson, and one of the young relievers NOT named Reed. That should do it. That is an awful lot to give up for a guy that is going to walk. I'd give that up for Josh Johnson. I'm not doing it for Greinke. That really hinders the club in the off-season. I don't think they have enough internal arms to replace Peavy and Floyd in next years rotation (albeit, they obviously could make another move).

QUOTE (southsider2k5 @ Jul 26, 2012 -> 09:57 AM) Bob Nightengale ‏@BNightengale The #Angels were rebuffed by the #Rays in their pursuit of James Shields, offering speedy OF Peter Bourjos, but the Rays want more in return Bourjo's has some nice tools for a potential leadoff hitter, but the production hasn't exactly been there. Getting Shields for Bourjos would have been very foolish of the Rays and a major coup for the Angels. That said, I think Bourjo's is a quality chip the Angels have to offer the Marlins and/or Brewers in the competition for Greinke/Johnson.

QUOTE (Reddy @ Jul 25, 2012 -> 11:42 AM) are the muslims operating a business that is privy to anti-discrimination laws or a private religious institution that can do whatever it wants? I might be mistaken but the owner making a statement of his belief and actually violating anti-discrimination laws are 2 very separate things. Has there been any cases about Chik-fil-a not hiring gays, etc. Him saying that he doesn't believe in marriage, yada yada yada, is not an anti discrimination violation.

http://www.chicagonow.com/chicago-bulls-co...-the-2014-plan/ Good article from Doug on the Bulls being caught "in between". Thought Kyle/Wharris would enjoy it too. I definitely can see his points (and this is coming from someone who personally finds this 2014 hogwash). I think the Bulls should do everything to get Dwight.

QUOTE (chw42 @ Jul 25, 2012 -> 02:55 PM) Does JR own the majority of the Bulls or does he own the majority of the White Sox? I remember he actually owned quite a bit of one of the teams, but can't remember which. I don't think he owns the majority of either team. In fact, I thought it was the same ownership group which owned both teams, with similar percentages, but I might be wrong.

QUOTE (Jordan4life @ Jul 25, 2012 -> 02:33 PM) fixed for accuracy. Jordan was paid a lot of money at the end of his run.

QUOTE (KyYlE23 @ Jul 25, 2012 -> 02:26 PM) I know, they are perfect and faultless in your eyes. You don't have to keep reiterating it, I look forward to the next glowing report about this offseason They are one of the winningest franchises and were rebuilt into a title contender each of the past 2 years. This is the NBA, the vast majority of the league would be extremely envious of the Bulls. You also have to be careful you don't go crazy and turn into the Knicks. Knicks always pushed and so far it has done nothing but hinder them (vs. help them). I really think the Bulls would have beaten the heat. Not sure how they do against OKC, but this would all be a moot point if Rose doesn't go down. Rose now is down, you can't just magically rebuilt and make things better overnight. The reality is the management you are bashing built a legit title contender this past year (and the vast majority of NBA analyst would agree, based upon their commentary all of last year). How would the Lakers look if Kobe went down for the year. Same with the Heat and Lebron. Nothing they could do would make them contenders again.