Jordan4life_2007

QUOTE (jenks45monster @ Dec 28, 2009 -> 04:40 PM) The only decent answer so far! Edit: Besides JPN's. Well what's a 'decent' answer? You obviously wouldn't pose this question at the the of 2008.

This is almost as bad as the thread asking if Frank Thomas is a HOF. One injury prone year in which he still smacked over 20 HR's does not make me long for Chris Carter.

I love this board like a wife (even though I'm never in life getting married). Jason and Co. do an amazing job here. With that said, I like to frequent other message boards with regularity. I think it's good to get another fanbase's perspective on things. I like http://www.orioleshangout.com/, http://www.motownsports.com/forums/, http://www.philaphans.com/, http://sonsofsamhorn.net/index.php?. These are 4 of the best message boards out there. Like us, they're very in tune and dedicated to their teams. I know it's popular to despise Red Sox fans. But they're supremely knowledgeable and they know a s***load about Sabermetrics. I've learned a great deal from this board. Just wondering who from this great board visits other boards.

QUOTE (Thunderbolt @ Dec 26, 2009 -> 10:02 AM) It’s Ultimate Zone Rating and while the math behind it isn’t perfect it’s a lot more intuitive then a lot of people seem to think. Sabermetrics isn’t about a bunch of people holed up without a TV doing algebra in their basements. It’s about people who watch the game, and look deeper into it then the average fan. Hell, UZR and the fielding bible come from people who watch EVERY defensive play, and categorize it into statistical “zones.” It’s not like they ignore the action on the field if anything they add a heck of a lot more importance to it. I think Q was being just a bit sarcastic. And I can admit that I pretty much brushed off Sabermetrics at first when they started coming more and more to the forefront (I noticed this around 2004). As you said, it looked to me to be a bunch of nerdy guys who probably never had a GF in their lives, who had taken refuge in their basements. The thing that struck me about Sabermetrics at first is that they for the most part require you to really think. And being a brotha, I don't like to think. lol. At least not when it comes to sports. At first I just had no clue how these metrics were formulated. And even when I would try and get an explanation, I still couldn't fully grasp them. That was until I discovered fangraphs. That is one addicting ass site. And the writers over there do an excellent job of explaining in detail how these metrics work. Now there's a part of me that will always be an old school kinda fan. I mean s***, the manager of my favorite baseball team probably can't even spell Sabermetrics. But Saber stats are becoming more and more a part of how organizations are run and how players are evaluated. That's just fact. And I think the game in general is better off because of this.

QUOTE (SouthsideDon48 @ Dec 24, 2009 -> 10:40 PM) Ok, here's where I think the grey area is: Yes, Crede's stats were good for 2009...... but he only played in 90 games. I'd rather have someone who can play 150 games or so and not have to worry about constant DL stints. We can all agree with this. Problem is you said Teahen was a better defensive 3B than Joe Crede. Sorry, that's like saying Shaq is a better FT shooter than Steve Nash.

QUOTE (qwerty @ Dec 24, 2009 -> 06:38 PM) Crede was exceptional defensively last season. He just looked great out there. Crede had the second highest uzr/150 of all third baseman with over 1/3 of there games played at the position. His uzr/150 was 23.4 while posting a uzr of 12.5 in the 84 games played last season. Only jack hannahan posted a better uzr/150 at 27.7. Crede's glove has never been in question. I have no clue what the hell Southsidedon is talking about. Saying Mark Teahen is a better defensive 3B than Joe Crede is like saying Scott Podsednik's OF defense is superior than that of Franklin Gutierrez.

QUOTE (bmags @ Dec 23, 2009 -> 12:23 PM) Mark Buehrle was an anomoly, but people always bring him up. We've had 40 "mark buerhle's" come through our system since 2001. Josh Stewart ? = Mark Buerhle! I doubt Ely turns into anything special. Thank you. I obviously have no personal connection to John Ely. Even with that, I can go on and assume he's a swell guy. But his absolute maximum ceiling is that of a 5th starter. Just because he was our best pitching prospect (not counting Hudson) doesn't mean he was a legitimate prospect. I doubt he'd make a top 10 pitching prospects list for any other organization outside of maybe the Cardinals, Brewers or Astros.

QUOTE (Thunderbolt @ Dec 23, 2009 -> 10:38 AM) We have a half dozen Jon Links in our organization, and we have a couple of guys ahead or just behind Ely. Meanwhile, we don't have a Juan Pierre. Math works for me. I wish that were still the case.

QUOTE (SouthsideDon48 @ Dec 24, 2009 -> 03:52 PM) Crede would be a defensive downgrade over Teahen. He had a bunch of errors with the Sox in 2008 at a very alarming rate. He's just not the same player anymore and he no longer possess his gold glove-caliber defense capabilities. With such a bad back problem, I don't know why people doesn't realize this. At this point of Crede's career, his defense will start being worse than average because of his back, he's deteriorating. I'd prefer Teahen's defense over Crede's, and I'm not even a fan of Teahen. Teahen is in no way shape, or form, a better defensive 3B than Joe Crede. I have no idea how you would even hint at something so ludicrous.

QUOTE (KyYlE23 @ Dec 24, 2009 -> 06:38 AM) I dont know about you guys, but I was really nervous going into the first game vs Boston, but once they brought out the whoopin stick, I kind of had this feeling of euphoria throughout the rest of the playoffs and world series. It was like it made sense to me that they were supposed to, and were going to win. I cant explain it, but when things happened(like Buehrle saving game 3, Konerkos Grand Slam, Credes GW double, Pods Walkoff) it felt like it was supposed to happen and I wasnt so much surprised as I was elated. Such an awesome season I was actually more nervous before game 2 than I was before game 1. You just couldn't help but expect a major letdown after such a flawless performance in the first game. And when we fell behind 4-0 early, you just assumed we were going back to Boston 1-1. But when Gooch hit that 3-run shot off Wells in the 5th inning, that's when it 'hit' me that this wasn't going to be like past years. That this might just be our year. And El Duque's 6th inning in game 3 all but sealed it for me. It was a foregone conclusion after that.

They've got my vote. That team could pitch it and catch it better than any team of the last 10 years. I think the offense underachieved for the most part (down years from Rowand, Uribe in comparison to what they did in 2004, and no big Frank most of the year). But man did they get hot late in Sept and through the whole playoff run. It was beautiful to watch. How often do you see a team play at the absolute peak of their capabilities in the playoffs? Not often.

QUOTE (quickman @ Dec 23, 2009 -> 12:49 PM) I am sure its because of the high ceiling and great potential he has. Maybe he will suddenly change and concentrate on baseball rather than women, or maybe he will cut down on his swing or maybe the coaching in KC is better than ours. I am sure there will be some moronic explanation of why he has failed, because it couldn't be because he sucks. This might have been a popular rebuttal in 2006 or 2007. Now? I think we all realize Brian is a bust of a prospect with the maximum upside of a 4th outfielder.

QUOTE (Steve9347 @ Dec 23, 2009 -> 06:18 PM) Any smart FA would look at our coaching situation and GarPax's inability to build a contender and stay far, far away. There are too many other options. The 2010 situation is going to be eerily similar to begging FAs (T-Mac, Hill) to sign with us, but then having to throw money at E-Rob. Ugh. E-Rob. "The curse of Michael"? I think it's getting to that point. This teams looks years away from contending for anything outside of the 7th/8th spot in weak conference outside of the top 3 or 4.

QUOTE (SoxAce @ Dec 23, 2009 -> 06:02 PM) If the playoffs started today, we wouldn't even be in the playoffs, which is regressing from last season. I didn't expect this team to be a top team, even with the hot start we had against top teams early, but I didn't expect this team to be this bad either. Hell I thought we were a 6th or 7th type seed (progressing from last season) because of the horrid Eastern Conference. We can't even match the 8th spot as of right now and I know we are still a game back or something like that. We've done this for the last 4 or 5 years, no (save 2007)? Up and down all year until a strong push the last month. I really don't care about winning 45 games when we're a lock to get bounced in the first round by any of the conferences elites.

QUOTE (Balta1701 @ Dec 23, 2009 -> 05:31 PM) CBS headline: "Del Negro unable to control Bulls" I have no problem with those that want VDN gone. But it bothers me very much that it seems to be popular opinion that this would be a much better team with a different coach. There's no coach, past or present, that would take this particular team past the first round. Orlando, Cleveland, Boston and Atlanta. We're miles behind any of those 4 teams regardless of who's the coach. The one guy that should really be on the hotseat is John Paxson. But Jerry Reinsdorf is loyal to a fault. Paxson would have to quite before Jerry let him go.

Laroche has some of the most ridiculous 1st half/2nd half splits I've ever seen. I wouldn't touch him.

QUOTE (SoxAce @ Dec 23, 2009 -> 05:19 PM) I don't think that he's "spooked" more or less that he knows who is worthy of the hype and who isn't. I'd probably believe you if he didn't keep Beckham as far as top spects go and guys like Richard, McCarthy, etc.. were pretty good for us at one time.. I was exaggerating a little. But I'm sure it's always in the back of his mind. I have to disagree with you about Beckham. He was a pretty safe bet from day 1.

I've got no problem with this piece. We pretty much know what we're getting from Peavy/Buehrle. I, like many here, believe that neither Danks or Floyd have reached their full potential. Pretty scary considering both have easily established themselves as above average starters the last two years. If I'm right, will EASILY have the best rotation in baseball.

QUOTE (Chisoxfn @ Dec 21, 2009 -> 12:30 PM) Your 2000 Chicago White Sox I don't know about you guys, but for me, that was my 2nd favorite team of the decade. A young, up and coming team that just burst on the scene and flat out won a ton of games. The playoffs were a disappointment but with the farm system BA was hyping I thought we were on the verge of a dynasty. I agree 100%. Well, I don't know about dynasty. But that team definitely appeared to have staying power. Mostly due to what we thought at the time was an absolutely loaded farm system. It was right around that time that I discovered Baseball America. The way they hyped up guys like Jon Rauch, Joe Borchard, ect, how could one not get excited? In fact, I think that is why Kenny trades prospects like Oprah inhales cheeseburgers. He's probably forever spooked by all those 'can't-miss' guys we had at that time and looks to trade prospects the second they reach peak value.

QUOTE (bmags @ Dec 23, 2009 -> 05:07 PM) J4L, #7 was spot on! Great pick! Hawk's call on that one was magical. I was in shock. PK of all people. He had been SOOOOOOOOOO bad. I'll never forget that one.

I'm not mentioning anything from 2005. WAY too easy. My top 10 in no order: 10:The game against Indians at home right after completing a perfect 7-game sweep on the road against those same Indians and Yankees in 2000. The reception the team got that night had me shaking like a leaf. 9: Carlos Lee's walkoff slam against the Cubs in 2001. 8: The comeback against the Cubs in 2002 in which we were down 8-0 and won like 12-9 or something close to that. 7: The game against the Twins in 2003 in which Konerko, who was doing his best Brent Lillibridge impression to that point in the season, hit a two out, game-tying HR in the bottom of the 9th to send the game into extras. Then the greatest player in franchise history ended in the 12th. 6: Jose Valentin mocking Sammy Sosa's HR trot in I believe 2003? 5: Jose Valentin's walkoff vs the Cubs in 2003. 4: Joe Crede's slam against Chad Qualls in 2006 that tied the game at 5. It was so eerily similar to PK's slam. 3:Mark's no-hitter vs the Rangers. 2: Mark's perfect game against the Rays. 1: Wise's catch that saved Mark's perfect game. Honorable mention: Not White Sox related, but Steve Bartman and game 6 of '03 the NLCS will always have a special place in my heart.

QUOTE (Mattchoo @ Dec 19, 2009 -> 01:56 PM) I don't think it was that bad of a package. I agree that maybe I valued Morel too high in the trade proposal, however, in the deal I proposed we would be taking Chris Young off their hands and his $6.25M salary and mediocre-ness. In the deal I proposed, the Padres save about $7.5M, get two of our top 5 prospects (4 of our top 10), and a young solid starter in Floyd for a reasonable price the 3 years. Seems like fair value to me. Regarding Mitchell, you are correct that you can't trade him until 1 year after being drafted, but isn't possible to make him a PTBNL? Chris Young is hot garbage. But it's not like his contract is that detrimental. And his contract is up after '10 anyway. That package just isn't anywhere near enough. If you're trading a player of Gonzales' caliber, you're looking for instant impact talent. Floyd (the new Floyd) would obviously flourish in the NL and in that park. Flowers would give them a near major league ready prospect. But his value lies in if he can stick at catcher. And that's still up in the air. Mitchell is at least 2 years away, maybe longer. Yes, you definitely value Morel too high. Sure, in our paper thin system he's a top 10 prospect. Not saying much. Retherford and Nix would just be throw-ins. If that's the kinda package it took AGON would've been traded weeks ago.

QUOTE (Rowand44 @ Dec 19, 2009 -> 01:29 PM) I agree with your overall point but I'd definitely take Mark over Burnett and I'd also bet a lot of money that Danks will be our 2nd best if not best overall pitcher this season. Mark's near pinpoint control gives him the edge on Burnett (who's always had control problems). And I agree with you on Danks. I feel he's primed to really bust into elite territory in 2010.

QUOTE (Mattchoo @ Dec 19, 2009 -> 09:45 AM) , thinking about the Sox trading for Gonzo again this morning.... (someone slap me).... I came up with this Adrian Gonzalez and Chris Young for Gavin Floyd, Tyler Flowers, Jarred Mitchell, Brent Morel, and either CJ Retherford or Jason Nix (if SD wants a player that should be playing right now) Obviously trading Gavin Floyd is not ideal, but I think he has a ton of value based on performance vs. contract. Chris Young appears to be really over paid and not even as good as Floyd in comparison. Thoughts? LMAO! The Padres would laugh, puke, laugh some more, puke and then laugh some more if we offered that for AGON. I believe we can't trade Mitchell even if we wanted to because you can't trade guys you drafted until they've been in your organization 1 full year. Somethin' like that. The ONLY legitimate pieces in that proposal would be Floyd and Flowers. And the Padres could get MUCH, MUCH, MUCH more than that. Morel had a nice year. But he'd have to rake at AA over a full season before anybody considers him a legitimate prospect. Retherford? Nix? lol. C'mon now.

QUOTE (Eminor3rd @ Dec 18, 2009 -> 11:29 PM) Bottom line is, we need a serious hitter. A star player. We clearly can't afford one, so it'll have to come via trade. I still think there's a chance Jenks goes. I think they got Putz so he could set up Thornton. Freddy Dolsi could fill the missing short relief spot. Ideally, they get someone to overpay for Linebrink instead, but that's just wishful thinking. We're not getting anything remotely close to a star for Jenks, if we were to trade him. His trade value is shot. If this were 2007, we could get a killing. But between his declining performance/stuff, escalating salary, weight/conditioning issues (Ozzie and KW being so vocal about the weight/conditioning certainly doesn't help), there's no market for him.