CaliSoxFanViaSWside

QUOTE (witesoxfan @ Feb 14, 2014 -> 04:19 PM) Is Adam Dunn hurting the rebuild right now? I know a certain someone that would say "Yes, yes, a thousand times yes." What happened to the " I mayy not agree with what you're saying but will defend to the death your right to say it" ?

QUOTE (RoundingThird @ Feb 11, 2014 -> 10:21 AM) Actually it was 4. He said he would have listed Abreu 2 behind Tanaka, but excluded them for their age. The other 3 were Johnson, Semien, and Davidson. Actually excluded them because " I do not rank players with experience in a foreign major league as prospects ".

Spring training and baseball can't come fast enough.

QUOTE (southsider2k5 @ Feb 7, 2014 -> 12:30 PM) Jerry Crasnick ‏@jcrasnick 38m Bronson Arroyo could have a clearer picture where he'll land by the end of today, says a baseball source. D-backs

Although Kiner never got the notoriety of someone like Stan Musial he was another fromer great who was known as a gentleman . Started his broadcast career with the White Sox ( so theoretically this could be in PHT). He then joined the Mets for their inaugural season and broadcast for over 50 years. He was dapper and kind hearted and dated such legendary actresses as Elizabeth Taylor and Janet Leigh. You would never know he was a HOF'er by his demeanor , he never flaunted it. He lived a full long life doing something he loved. Condolences to his family and friends of which there were many. This is a piece on him. http://www.nydailynews.com/sports/baseball...ticle-1.1605138

Probably doesn't deserve it's own thread so I'll put it here. MLB has the ongoing Face of MLB series where they match up the Face of a Franchise against another Face of the Franchise.Paul Konerko lost to Clayton Kershaw by only 4% in what I thought would be a landslide for Kershaw. Surely with the help of Soxtalk we could've pulled off the upset. But , alast,here was no support here.

QUOTE (Dick Allen @ Feb 5, 2014 -> 01:18 PM) The old I'm not saying he's going to be good, but I will argue and tell you that you are wrong if you say any different routine. A 10 game stretch in AAA. That is what you are basing this on? I think he can be a decent relief pitcher some day. As a starter, I don't think he will make it. My opinion. Maybe it is wrong. We will see. The old you said he was a dime a dozen and it just isn't a 10 game stretch ,it's his last ten starts in AAA before he was recalled. I'm just trying to say he isn't a dime a dozen. He worked his way up the minor league ladder and had the best stretch of that career at the highest level of the minors before he was brought up I am not predicting his future like you are I'm just saying he's more than worthy of getting a shot.26 is not old for a pitcher figure out how to use his stuff to get hitters out. Why pay big money for the type of production it's possible to get for much cheaper ? I'd even suggest if Jimenez was available at 2yrs $18M I'd do that. Maybe the Sox wouldn't. And I never said you were wrong. We disagree on him , there's a difference.

QUOTE (Dick Allen @ Feb 5, 2014 -> 01:02 PM) Just look at Charlotte's staff. Jason Berken had a lower ERA. Charlie Leesman had a lower ERA. Check out Dylan Axelrod's minor league career. It is quite impressive. 10 starts in a row similiar stats. I have not seen one example yet. You have 30 AAA 2013 staffs to chose from to cherry pick exactly as I did all you want . Surely you can prove to me Rienzo is a dime a dozen. I'm not saying Rienzo is guareenteed any future success as a ML either. Just show me those 12 2013 starters AAA starters who had a similiar 10 game stretch.

QUOTE (Dick Allen @ Feb 5, 2014 -> 12:36 PM) You really shouldn't cherry pick minor league stats to determine major league success. Do you know Lance Broadway had a 2.75 ERA in AA as a 22 year old.?Did you happen to see Nestor Molina's stats when he was acquired? What matters is how it translates to MLB. Rienzo doesn't have great stuff or great command. He will soon be 26 so you would think the learning curve is flattening out. He may have a decent career as a relief pitcher. I gave you a similiar opportunity to cherry pick since you said he was a dime a dozen . You have all of AAA for every major league team in 2013 to do so. So you refuse to back up your point . That's OK I expected that.

QUOTE (The Ultimate Champion @ Feb 5, 2014 -> 12:31 PM) He has very underwhelming stuff. MR or 5th starter and probably trade bait IMO. Paulino is a lot more interesting than he is to me, but he's still kind of a hope and a prayer. He would need to look pretty good to get the option picked up. The next member of the rotation is probably Beck in the eyes of the org which is why the signed the placeholder. If you sign a much better player then you likely end up with a good problem - IF nobody gets hurt. Otherwise you just end up with 5 starters when Beck is here because someone is on the DL. The worst realistic outcome of signing either Santana or Ubaldo is having them be bad pitchers for us. A 3-year deal plus their experience in the league mitigates a lot of that risk. If they're even average, at these supposed salaries, they are definitely movable and bring back something worth mentioning. Of course you're entitled to your opinion . Keith Law said his cutter is "definitely a major league pitch" and as I said before in the game threads many of us were impressed with his curve. It was a big breaking overhand curve that reminded me of Bobby Jenks curve. We're in a rebuild, that much is clear and Rienzo needs every opportunity to show if he can add to his repetoire and continue to progress. He just seems like the kind of guy if , in another organization , people would see those last 10 starts and be fawning over him but with us , an organization that seems to do a good job developing pitchers , he becomes a dime a dozen.

Just to expand more on what I said about Rienzo earlier his last 10 starts at AAA before his call up he went 5-3 with a 1.64 ERA . I have no idea what Dick meant by a dime a dozen in referring to Rienzo ,but I would like to challenge him to find a dozen starters in AAA with similiar numbers. 10 starts 66 inings pitched 69 K's 24 BB and that 1.64 ERA also holding opponents to a .192 BA. I will even give him the whole year at AAA to find a simliar stretch of 10 games for a dozen AAA starting pitchers. You cannot use Erik Johnson since he is with the Sox.

I thought Rienzo looked pretty good last year except that he had the same problem as Santiago and that was throwing strikes. He had a heluva 2nd half in the minors last year and everyone was surprised he had such a good curve ball in the game threads when he came up even though his cut fastball was supposed to be his best pitch. He has a legit chance to be a back of the rotation starter. This is what you do when you go young. You find out what you have. Saying the Sox should already know what they have is like saying they can predict his future and everyone including us and the Sox brass can only speculate on that.

QUOTE (witesoxfan @ Feb 4, 2014 -> 11:09 AM) I genuinely don't think you understand the definition of the word cheap. If Adam Dunn is not cheap, then neither Ervin Santana nor Ubaldo Jimenez are cheap. They will be making the same amount of money, roughly. I think cheap for Jimenez and Santana would fall in the 2 yr. under 9M a yr. or less category. Garza got 4yrs. AAV $13M .

We've got 2 guys in that core who have been compared to Miguel Cabrera in Abreu and A. Garcia , even if Garcia's was based more on looks than ability . But still if either one or both of them come close to duplicating Cabrera's numbers then we've really got something. Also might as well add Phegley and Beckham to the core since it's not impossible that they have good enough years and are young enough that they can be considered part of the future. Or if Carlos Sanchez and Micah Johnson both hit .333 this year and pitchers have an Erik Johnson type year you can add them too since you'll be subtracting whichever ones you listed in the current core bust. So many unexpected things could happen. Conor Gillaspie could hit .280 and 20HR's . You never know.

QUOTE (LittleHurt05 @ Jan 30, 2014 -> 03:44 AM) True story. I believe the Cards crappy shortstop made a huge error too. And Wong got picked off.

QUOTE (LittleHurt05 @ Jan 29, 2014 -> 05:02 PM) I disagree, do you remember the Pirates & Cardinals trade rumor threads last season? Everyone was sure the Sox would wipe out both teams' minor league systems at the trade deadline. Maybe the Cards and Pirates should've parted with some prospects since neither won the World Series

We might see a return of Grady's Ladies .

QUOTE (joeynach @ Jan 24, 2014 -> 03:53 PM) I am not a big fan of this move nor Robin Ventura. He hasn't shown me anything of substance to prove he a good in game manager, situational analyzer, or open and willing to employ the tactics of modern metrics and theory. In fact I think he has proven the exact opposite, I dont believe he values outs and has shown a willingness to give them away (bunts, steals, sacrifices), especially early in the game. I don't believe he is a real student of the game at this point, I thought his support of the now departed Jeff Manto and his vocal stance against working counts, walks, and OBP was a big organizational mistake. I would have been happy to see Hahn let RV play out his contract for this year while he seeks "his guy" next offseason. Maybe someone who is more progressive in his tactics and someone that the new young players that Hahn has brought in can relate too. Out of everything said so far I'm closest to agreement on this. I don't think you publicly criticize any of your coaches so his support of Manto doesn't bother me.. The team defense falling apart is very irksome. As far as valueing outs, that's a tough call when your offense is bad . Do you play for an early lead or try to manufature runs with sacrifices ,steals and hit and runs or do you just let guys swing away? So many close games we lost still didn't provide an answer . When it was apparent the Sox were going nowhere, I hated seeing the same lineup every day. What better time to see how players respond in different roles ? Took Robin forever to give Viciedo an extended chance in the middle of the lineup and why did De Aza always have to hit leadoff when he was one of a few guys showing any power and hit well with RISP ? Seemed like Robin was more like Ozzie in that he managed from his gut more than relying on any kind of advanced metrics, but again, it's so hard to tell when your team sucks and most things you try fail, such as pinch hitting. But still I would've liked to see more pinch hitting . Have to play matchups regardless of fail rates because things can turn around just as fast as they failed , but you never know if you don't try.

QUOTE (Chilihead90 @ Jan 22, 2014 -> 12:29 PM) So the Yankees are paying $175M over the course of 7 years, or about $25M a year if you spread it out evenly...... Good f***ing luck, jackwagons. Now add in what the Yankees have to pay MLB for going over the luxury tax level and being a repeat offender doing it.

QUOTE (CyAcosta41 @ Jan 22, 2014 -> 07:51 AM) LOVED that the Sox (apparently) pursued this guy hard - within their organizational limits; VERY GLAD they didn't chase beyond any kind of common sense. There's risk and then there's foolish risk. There are 2-3 teams in all of baseball who can take enormous risk, yet their virtually bottomless war chest allows them to avoid out-and-out catastrophe if it plays out badly -- the Yankmes, the Dodgers, and (probably) the Bosox. Objectively, if we take Hahn at his word (and there is no reason not to at this point), the Sox offered competitive financial terms, and presented the intangibles in the most positive possible light that allowed for the possibility of Team Tanaka to value these subjective considerations as they chose to do so. There was ample reason to believe that subjective factors would play a part. Great. Be in the mix on the objective and let Team Tanaka ultimately decide how they weigh the entire package. My guess is that some of these factors played a part, but, at the end of the day, total guaranteed years won out. That's life. No regrets from having a sensible approach and losing because someone else did something that you'd never be willing to do (and certainly NOT with this team at this time). Can't guarantee the results, gentleman; just the process. Despite being a long-time good karma guy who rarely wishes anyone ill, I hope Tanaka bombs miserably and the Yankmes have to chew on this for years to come. Money like this is crazy money (all sophisticated value of WAR notwithstanding) for a human who throws with a flesh and bone arm who has NEVER thrown a pitch in major league baseball. To me, Abreu money - given today's relative dearth of true power - was well within the bell curve of sensible risk. This? Crazy risk. Take half of what you were willing to spend on this guy, plow it into a million other areas of the organization, and I feel so much better about our long-term chances. I'd love to see this turn out badly so that there is at least MORE of a chance that the financial giants out there have to think a little harder about whether they want a Tanaka situation on their hands. Market correction is sometimes an overall good thing. Also as much as I want to see ARod gone, now I have a need to see him come back next year so the Yanks are stuck paying him till his contract runs out in 2017.

QUOTE (TaylorStSox @ Jan 22, 2014 -> 07:54 AM) If the Sox signed him and he's a bust. It's financially crippling. As I've said all along, and why I never cared to really follow this deal, that's a lot of money to pay for a prospect. I wouldn't even consider half that for a superstar in the draft. Hell, I wouldn't want to commit that type of money to an All Star. The Sox don't have the market to absorb huge risks and fail. I think he will pitch very well but he has a ton of mileage on his arm already. Unless he has a bionic arm ,throwing that splitter is going to catch up with him eventually. I say he doesn't make it halfway through that contract with shoulder or elbow surgery and the opt out clause will never be used.

Tanaka Loses his head

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gEmJ-VWPDM4

.301/ .360 OBP/ .910 OPS 37 HR/ 108 RBI

QUOTE (Chilihead90 @ Jan 9, 2014 -> 10:55 PM) Man, I had no idea that Tanaka has to be signed by Jan. 24th. I was thinking that was the deadline for teams to say if they wanted to bid the $20M or not, and then there would be a separate negotiation window. Now that I know this thing only has 2 weeks left, I'll actually pay attention more when I see stories on this. Excited for this to be over. Soxfest also starts the 24th of January. You can look at it 2 ways. The Sox are showing interest so they can say they showed interest at Soxfest when he eventually signs with the high bidder or they do sign him and Soxfest is a Hahn lovefest. The Phil Rogers article ( http://chicago.whitesox.mlb.com/news/artic...p;vkey=news_cws ) compared the career innings piitched by Tanaka as a 25 year old to Frank Tanana at the same age. Tanana ended up with shoulder surgery . Tanaka/Tanana ,very similiar name. Draw you own conclusions.