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He could pitch just OK somewhere between 2020 and 2021 where he might be just good enough to get the 160 innings or not make the 160 innings during the season. That's why I asked if playoff innings counted towards the vesting option. If he starts 30 games and averages 5 innings a game with a 4.25 ERA that isn't terrible in the AL and could warrant playoff starts beyond the 1st round depending on all the other starting pitchers availability. That would be 150 IP during the season but maybe a couple of playoffs start to push him beyond 160 . If the playoffs innings don't count towards the option that's the best situation I can come up with.

Of course I never made the point that it was choose Rodon or Keuchel at the exact same moment in time. The choice was the contracts at different points in time when one was trusted to be good over a long stretch ( 4yrs Max) while the other wasn't trusted to be good over a 2 yr stretch ( possibly one yr. if he opts out of the SF contract.)

Considering the rest of the year won't be an even 50/50 split with RHSP vs. LHSP AV will get a lot of starts against RHP as he should. As the AB's pile up for both Vaughn and Sheets there will be more data to make an informed decision . If Vaughn shows significant improvement against RHP while Sheets takes a big OPS drop against them I will be all for Vaughn on an everyday basis. But it's fair to say neither one should be in RF but that's what happens when you have too many 1B DH types. Vaughn will definitely get more starts in the OF than Sheets will since he's proven himself competent in LF.

And if Vaughn starts in RF are you going to say the same thing ? I mean I already said it sucks to have him in RF especially with Velasquez pitching.

It's the pitcher that is taking AB's away from righties this game. It's not just Vaughn. That's why we have Leury, Grandal and McGuire all in the lineup .

I'm not, I hope it does happen. I want him to earn his money. Don't want to root against him at all but I'm not expecting much.

LOL You don't want Sheets to get any AB's to see if that .900 OPS against righties wasn't a mirage ? I know it sucks to have him in RF but looks like TLR is getting the lefties in the lineup against a guy with a nasty slider. It will take a lot of AB's by both Sheets and Vaughn to see if things have changed for both of them.

Hey we agree. If he's good imagine how many innings he gets plus playoff innings . Do playoff innings count towards the options year ?

It's more about what have you done lately. Keuchel was always a soft thrower who was the definition of a pitcher, hit your spots keep hitters off balance. However any further reduction in his stuff or command and you have a terrible pitcher who, if bad again this year, cost you $54M for 2 bad years and 1 good year with his only attribute that he probably won't get injured. Rodon on the other hand almost single handedly rocketed the Sox to the best record in baseball in the 1st half and without him at his best in the 2nd half the Sox were a .500 team. Even if you matched the SF offer you already got a great 1/2 year from him with the promise of more great pitching ,with durability issues slightly lessened by the innings he pitched last year and his work to strengthen that part of his game. Compared to the Keuchel deal it wouldn't have been that bad. But we have already established how we both feel about Rodon. The only reason we disagree is because the Sox would rather pay out decent money 3yr. $54M w/option year for $20M on an older, durable, mediocre pitcher and hope he can be better than mediocre and stay healthy than pay out decent money on a younger, not so durable , great pitcher (recent greatness). Those seem to be our only 2 options since many years for great money isn't an option. Bad innings pitched is still innings pitched ,saves BP arms, but still costs you losses and he still has a chance to get hurt like any other pitcher. Good innings pitched gets you more wins but if you get hurt your replacement usually isn't going to get wins or save BP arms. We're both looking at "6 of one, half dozen of the other" situations, worse case scenarios.

They looked pretty good after his 1st year but the huge drop off last year hurt badly. Going forward you want him to be good of course but that might mean $20M on him next year.

It's pretty sad that Cueto on a minor league deal was better last year than Keuchel making $18M. 1.5 fWAR for Cueto in 16 starts and Keuchel .6 fWAR in 30 starts. Cueto also K's more and walks less per 9 IP than Keuchel. Of course JC pitched in SF while Keuchel pitched here so Cueto could be just as bad or worse here . His 1st year here was damn good but if his last 2 stink getting Wheeler instead of Keuchel could've made a big difference. Still it makes me wonder if the Keuchel durabilty and rep as a quality innings eater was more important at the front of the window than taking a shot on Rodon being excellent with durability issues smack dab in the middle of the contention window. Obviously the Sox were hoping Keuchel could be more valuable during the middle of the window but it hasn't yet. Chalk another one up (so far) for good money on mediocrity.

Someone who loves to troll Soxtalk and punk everyone here. Keeping Vaughn and getting rid of Sheets is some people's here wet dream. Sheets is the only guy standing in TLR's way of getting Vaughn 600 AB's.

The MTV Video Music Awards ?

Abreu, Anderson, Moncada and Giolito. If it was solely based on potential it would be different. Robert should be on it but we've only seen one 300 PA season from him at his near best. Can't get on Mt. Rushmore without MORE ! Cease is pretty close but also need MORE from Eloy. By the end of the year 1/2 of the 4 could be different.

For who ?

Even if he could I wouldn't expect great results since they have only had a month to work with him. Usually it take a decent amount of time for a pitcher to adjust to changes even if they are willing.

It's not exactly a novel idea for baseball minds to have come up with a better way to have handled him in 2021 if winning and the player's health meant anything.

It's a sweet idea but just totally made up by you. It's a theory. I have no idea why they would do that. Somebody in the front office is just a nice guy and really doesn't care that many would think it makes him look stupid. After all he's an MLB GM with a barren farm system who can easily afford to give up draft picks and make it easier for any team who could be your competition in the World Series or playoffs to sign one of the best pitchers in baseball . There is no world where this kind of business practice would be condoned. He's our GM yet with one decision he's making our farm worse and giving our competition a financial break .Sounds like he's working for the competition not the White Sox.

At The Hop came out the year I was born.

I would have given you a like except there were already 2 of them and I didn't want to mess up the 2 theme.

That's what I was thinking when I saw him assigned to A+ . Maybe it was because it had been a while since he actually played.However he did hold his own in Japan's Major Leagues in a SSS did he not ? That's where Ichiro and Ohtani and others have come from so not too big a step below MLB.

It was almost like the Sox didn't miss Moncada, Pollock, Kelly and Leury with as much as everyone contributed. Also Timmy just being Timmy and in the lineup is the best.

You know if ST was any indication of his approach I was actually impressed. I don't like to compare anyone with Robert but if it was Menechino and hard work from Robert that had him going the opposite way and cutting down on K's, that's exactly what I saw Micker doing. Still has a way to go but with his power if he can improve his hit tool and be more selective I like his chances.

Danny and the Juniors (Mendick, McGuire, Harrison, Engel) all did pretty good. Since I haven't seen anything about Kopech yet, it was a very nice outing by him also.

And with that Cubs logo that he has wisely took off his avatar.