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Let's go Rey get that 3rd out and limit the damage.

Smyly didn't throw a single pitch in the zone to Tim that AB. The 3-2 pitch was debatable and Timmy fouled it off but it was very similar to a previous pitch that was called a ball.

That's the old baseball way of thinking now it's different but I understand where you are coming from.

It's bad enough pitcher have to hit but damn ump that 2nd pitch was a strike ?

Thanks I think some times you get a bad rep for being negative about the front office but its all warranted.Your rep isn't warranted but the criticism of the FO is just to be clear. Everything you say in your post is true which was my point and many others at the start of the rebuild. They are half assing it as usual, unable or unwilling to spend it the areas that need spending when you decide to use young talent as a base for future success. Hahn may or may not have pushed for it but to me it's all on Jerry. He is the Chairman and I'm sure he takes his responsibilities to the rest of the ownership group more seriously than he takes doing what is truly necessary to build a winner. After all he won a World Series without all those things before. But sustained success is a different animal and according to Hahn rhetoric that is the goal and if you aren't going to spend on player payroll like teams with sustained winning like the Dodgers , Yankees Red Sox then you better spend it developing young talent to maximize it's value.

He is still my adopted prospect so I have a special place in my heart for him. Now we don't do adopt -a-prospect anymore.

But there is a lesson to be learned from Cleveland TB and Oakland. Is the goal sustained success or winning a World Series once in a while.? I'll take the World Series win . Only World Series wins count. Sustained success is just a footnote in franchise history books without a win in the World Series.

Well ,really the time to shift gears was at the start of the rebuild which would have meant overhauling the front office and getting modern in player development. Did you see what I wrote in the other thread about how the Astros signed Gerrit Cole or the number of high speed camera the Astros use throughout their system ? Can you honestly say the Sox could use that kind of approach with a FA pitcher ? They are woefully unprepared to sign anyone of consequence and even if Reinsdorf loosens the purse strings can he do it without imposing the constraints like the Machado contract offer ? It not even about acquiring premium talent. It's about using your resources and spending money to improve your chances to acquire that talent. It's not about how Chicago is a great town but how White Sox will do what it takes to modernize their thinking to develop talent from 15 year old intl talent to all talent throughout the system. I can't be confident they even know how to get premium talent or what to do with it even if the money offered is enough to acquire it.

I am down with this as minor league players are not ML players and should be subject to less criticism since they are so young and development IS NOT linear.

Well Josh Nelson is just reacting to what the Sox are leading him to think. You don't even have to have a negative attitude . All you have to do is see the road signs . I especially like the meeting with how the Astro's signed Gerrit Cole ,that was enlightening and how the Astros have 75 high speed cameras throughout their system when some teams are getting around to just having one. He's right in the sense that the Sox haven't picked a lane. Playing service time games with Robert and Madrigal makes me think they really don't want to contend next year so why should anyone think they will make a splash in Free Agency besides the low payroll ? They aren't serious about signing intl. talent, they won't have an extra team for that talent , they play service time games, they won't fully do what they have to do in scouting and development. Do things the right way to PROVE you want to win otherwise quit pretending you want to win by giving the car a crap engine but expecting it not to break down. Get in the fast lane or get off the highway.

I only read twitter when someone puts it in here so if you could be so kind I'd appreciate it.

We have all seen what losing Jimenez , Monacada and Anderson has done to the lineup and run production. Now let's say Robert and Madrigal both buck the recent trend of Sox rookies not doing so great and put up a combine 7/8 combined WAR. Then you also might have Jimenez improving like Moncada did this year plus Moncada could get even better. You also have Cease and possibly Kopech for the whole year and various guys coming back from injury. To keep Robert and Madrigal down for a combined 40/50 games would take a lot of production from the lineup. Now it's certainly possible Robert and Madrigal will need time to adjust so why do it after they come up and not this year? If the Sox FO thinks they can contend next year then the only answer is to bring them up this year. How confident can I be that the Sox will sign FA's to contend next year when so far their actions show me they are more interested in service time than contending ?

I don't like repeating myself but in this instance I will keep doing it. I know many smart people here think playing the service time game is important and usually I do too. But I'll keep drilling my point into peoples heads Make up your damn mind White Sox ! Do you want to win in the next 5 years starting next year which would mean signing multiple FA's or do you want to have Robert and Madrigal for 1 extra year when Moncada Gio and Rey are all likely gone already ? To me it's a really simple answer.

You make very good points about how confusing it is to get a read on what exactly the Sox are doing or going to do. Do they contend in 2020 ? Some say yes they will sign FA's and go for it. However , then why hold Robert and Madrigal down? Why not get them up and acclimated for next year ? If held down how many combined games do they miss next year ? 40 ? 50 ? and then brought up to then get acclimated ? Does that sound like a team that wants to win next year ?

It is curious though that some of the decisions the Sox made on youngish players didn't work out all that well. I know many hate the catching abilities of Narvaez and hated Avi but they both have had decent seasons. Narvaez certainly was trending upwards when the the Sox traded him. Instead many thought we were selling high and thought he'd trend downward. He certainly had a good approach and his OBP clearly is a need on the Sox. Don't get me wrong I'm good with the trade. I too hated his defense but I wasn't convinced the Sox were selling high as many were. The Sox shouldnt be selling off pieces like that especially when they were light of OBP players and light on LH bats and he had improved offensively a few years in a row.. Same with Avi . They could've resigned him to the type of contract TB did because he had one great year no matter how lucky anyone thinks he was that year he was a proven talent. They got rid of guys in positions they still have black holes in which is OBP guys, LH quality bat and RF. How can I trust scouting and talent evaluation when they can't even evaluate their own that well ? They gave up so far 3 WAR (combined Narvaez and Avi ) and 4? years of control on Narvaez for 2 years of Colome in years they probably don't make the playoffs.

If the Sox were serious about contending next year they would bring up Robert and Madrigal now ,then spend freely in the off season FA market. I can't see doing one without the other. Why go hog wild in free agency if you aren't going to acclimate your best prospects to the majors ? Why have them miss the games early in the season next year ? If they miss 20 games each ( i have no idea how many they actually will miss) then you double it because its 2 players to a total of 40 games . Why have potentially very good players intentionally miss that many games if you are serious about contending ? We all know service time is important but you either make a choice to contend next year or not. Commit to it fully not half assed.. After all the main goal is to win a World Series not to have those guys for an extra year to maximize the window of contention when players like Giolito Lopez and Moncada will likely all be gone from the team by then.

The Chicago White Sox .. good for opposing pitchers stats .

Phil hitting has almost been as bad as the Sox. They've been making our relievers look good.

Double no no . Yes i'm jinxing them both especially No NO Nola

I look at it like this . There's no reason at all to prioritize the full control on Robert and Madrigsal. Since Moncada Giolito and Lopez are FA's in 2024 the window to a world title is before that unless the Sox have some more studs develop. The whole sustained success mantra is not realistic, Try to win a World Series in the next 5 years . Get Robert and Madrigal up now and get them acclimated. Start trying to win in 2020. Let the potential FA's the Sox might sign see them playand let them all play together asap.

Granted 2 years ago he had a draft pick attached to him but he ended up being really inexpensive but he is very consistently above average and definitely has 30-35 HR power. But next year will be 31 so I might question if signing him now would be as good an opportunity as it has been. Heck he might not even be available.

I wanted him the last 2 seasons but what do I know . He's only proven that he can hit and be semi versatile by playing 2nd base and you know he can play 1st base. He's also very high up among ML's this year for hard hit balls.

Strange game indeed, Most peculiar momma !

Hallelujah !

Well you do have a point . Plenty of guys were making outs.