Princess Dye

QUOTE (RockRaines @ Oct 7, 2011 -> 11:35 AM) According to "sources" on one side was Ozzie and his family, on the other side was the entire White Sox organization including a 20+ year pitching coach, the GM, the owner, the Minor League Director and so on. To get rid of dysfunction you have to eliminate one side, and they did. Ozzie did plenty wrong. But the Sox hired him, knew he'd be wild, and couldn't work with him the right way. That's not being blameless. The fact that it worked well for awhile and then didn't means Ozzie wasn't a total trainwreck-- that one way or another there were problems adapting to changes. JR has brought us managerial choices like Manuel and Bevington, so I'm far from out of line when I say the Sox have something to prove with regard to making a mess and then having to clean it up.

Regardless of what one thinks about Cowley, it's still on the FO to prevent dysfunction like what we apparently had. If prevention is out then we're faced with 'cleanup'. Here's to another try at it.

QUOTE (iamshack @ Oct 6, 2011 -> 09:18 PM) Interesting comment from Steve Phillips...despite his sexual proclivities, I really respect his opinion...and the point about Martinez not having a real presence is one I hadn't thought of...but again, I'm not sure Ozzie had a real presence either...he tried to overcome that by being the class clown instead... It is a good point. All the things message board people respect about Maddon/Rays/Davey M -- it's going to mean nothing in a clubhouse. Ventura brings in the playing resume, so that's something they can respect. Potentially. It's not a repeat of what happened with Quade this year. Players just simply steamrolled him.

QUOTE (Balta1701 @ Oct 6, 2011 -> 09:05 PM) But there's a degree of experience going into how to prep different guys in the offseason and the spring to get different guys ready. Our last manager towards the end started refusing to adapt. Now we have a guy who hasn't been involved in the game since the steroid/amphetamine era. No way he has any way to adapt his preparation style to other guys. It's a roll of the dice about whether whatever style he has will break through to these guys before April. It's a roll of the dice how the players were going to react to Dave Martinez's preparation style. Or Sandy Alomar's. Some experience on a bench doesn't make the task anymore difficult starting anew. Hell, the same goes for TLR and Francona. They've been managing elite talent for so long that we can't pretend like we know what they'd have done with this bunch in April. Point being outrage isn't an option here. None of know what Robin will bring. We can imagine fanciful scenarios but that is about it.

QUOTE (Balta1701 @ Oct 6, 2011 -> 08:11 PM) If he's not Kennys choice... f***ing resign! Dont be surprised by this. JR has this thing with mgrs/coaches. I've heard that the hirings of both Del Negro and Thibodeau were more JR's call. As was the near hiring of Doug Collins and Pringles guy. There's no rule that the GM should be picking the managers. The owner can use his employees in any way that he wants. Obviously it's his call.

Maybe it's been discussed, but can we safely assume this is how KW got Ozzie out? Promising JR this transition...?

QUOTE (Kenny Hates Prospects @ Oct 6, 2011 -> 05:00 PM) BTW Hawk will ****NEVER**** stop talking about how much he loves this hire. NEVER EVER EVER EVER. unless we get Carlos Gomez

No one here has a legit reason to be mad. You're mad because it was a bad year, and because you wanted change; instead you got something familiar. Davey and Sandy would have been change, but you can't honestly draw a causal relationship between those two guys and their teams' recent success. They're a very minor part. As far as wanting a 'stats-mentality' you need that turnaround in your front office. In the dugout is another matter. Piniella took heat for choosing swing away over bunt, and it's not like he was some saber guy. You can be a good manager and just do smart things in the moment. The FO is the place where you should aim for sweeping, intelligent reforms

Screw experience if he knows the game. Plenty of experienced managers make the same ass-headed moves game in and game out.

Depresso bomb

I'm not an OV guy, but I've never really understood why people have this huge problem with someone saying "I want to play more." Everyone should want to play more. On top of it, this comes after the season is over. He probably felt during the year that -unlike Morel- he'd be up there taking a walk once in awhile, helping the team. Granted he probably doesn't clearly view where his own defense is now at, but it's at least possible he could've gotten more opportunities.

As notable as this was tonight, if it doesn't involve the Sox I'm left empty I dont care what that makes me - i cant control it.

QUOTE (daggins @ Sep 28, 2011 -> 08:13 PM) green Hitting Coach - FRANK /green we'd lead the league in green hitting, that's for sure

QUOTE (La Marr Hoyt HOF @ Sep 28, 2011 -> 01:02 PM) It's a complete rebuilding phase while paying out Dunn and Rios and using Paulie as the fan draw ... Manager not going to mean much for the next few years The bad contracts are partially mitigated by the promise of De Aza/Flowers/Viciedo. Production from those guys plus a creative/smart addition to the roster and we are back on track. A manager can still matter. Foremost of course is that he not be a total idiot, but then getting past that...there is still something at stake in 2012, especially in a division like ours.

Hitting coaches don't impact the game all that much. Those who are celebrating are just grasping at something to soothe their pain. We need people who can hit, and that trumps the minor concern of who their advisor is.

aren't white sox fans supposed to be above jinx-speak

QUOTE (mcgrad70 @ Aug 31, 2011 -> 03:29 PM) It's criminal the moronic manager allowed Peavy to stand out there and give up 6 runs in the first inning with his team on a win streak. So anytime your team is on a win streak, you should tax the bullpen in a losing effort?

Lets see if Hawk compliments Bert B Oh he did!

f***'s wrong with Morel.

That said, beautiful

I dont usually like pointless negativity here, but let me contribute some at this point: I only find it irritating that the team's best hitters were nearly all at AAA all year. Not enjoyable, just irritating.

rich people shouldn't have to eat Subway, c'mon

QUOTE (Balta1701 @ Aug 26, 2011 -> 08:57 PM) When Beckham was called up, ozzie personally announced it and said he needed Beckhams bat. With Beckham, Ozzie gave us his usual "if we are relying on him we're in trouble" schtick

Ozzie is always curt when pressed about a hyped young player. Nothing new here.

PK's running is one of those few things i'm sure i'll remember in 30 years