Dick Allen

QUOTE (fathom @ Jul 12, 2013 -> 10:20 PM) Ha, Charlotte Is that where he lives? Wherever he lives is probably where they should send Mitchell.

Who will be the lefty in the pen the rest of the year? Is Veal comimg back? I am a big Thornton fan, but this is what happens when you play like this. It is a lottery ticket. I wonder whose ABs in Birmingham where I assume he will be sent, Jacobs will be taking.

QUOTE (witesoxfan @ Jul 12, 2013 -> 02:38 PM) No, not for Sale. If they actually trade him, they are trading him for prospects. If they hypothetically traded him for Sale, it would be Sale for Stanton straight up. You are not getting Eovaldi too. I don't know maybe not Eovaldi, but more than Stanton I would think. They would have a cost controlled guy for quite some time vs. a guy they would either have to trade for prospects or pay probably close to double what they would be on the hook for Sale, if not more, for the duration of the contract if they could keep him at all. And they could use the marketing of having Sale in their rotation instead of prospects. It would serve a couple of purposes for Loria.

QUOTE (Eminor3rd @ Jul 12, 2013 -> 02:31 PM) To me, both philosophies are wrong. You want to develop the things that you are good at developing, and trade that for the other things you need. #Barves and Rays build pitching, trade it for hitting. We're probably the same way. But all this Hawk crap about hitting or pitching or defense being "most important is BS -- a run created is a run saved and vice versa. One pitcher and some good defense can shut down the opposition. One hot hitter in your line up, and you still probably lose. The Sox have one or two guys hot at a time often this season. Defense (which pitching is a part ) has always trumped offense in sports. I do think that has changed in the NFL.

The contract with Sale is what gets you even more talent, although teams would probably site injury concerns to keep the offers lower. Assuming Sale remains an ace for the entire length of his contract, a comparable top hitter is going to have to be paid significantly more money. I wouldn't trade him unless it was a no-brainer, but I would make sure I gave teams the opportunity to make me a no-brainer offer.

QUOTE (caulfield12 @ Jul 12, 2013 -> 12:50 PM) And, if they had any type of solution that didn't involve Keppinger, Tyler Greene or Angel Sanchez, SS would be on that list too....probably they have no idea which way to go with Alexei Ramirez and are waiting to see if an attractive enough offer comes along. Hahn knows he has to have a decent SS to compete next season and/or the season after, and right now there isn't anything they have that is that close, so unless he can pick one up with another player, if he is trying to win next year, I really doubt he trades Ramirez.

I think one of the guys Ventura has the problem with is Flowers, and I don't think it has to do with his attitude per se. I think it has to do with his swing and approach. Hahn specifically mentioned CF and C as postions he was looking for when he addressed the media recently, so De Aza and Flowers are probably the problem children. De Aza has been doing pretty well offensively lately, but defensively has been a joke. If a ball bounces off a wall, he is going to have a tough time picking it up cleanly. He has also made some bonehead plays on the bases. It's hard to understand why this is happening.

QUOTE (Jillian Michaels' Abs @ Jul 12, 2013 -> 12:28 PM) I read through the WSI thread, and I can see why some of the folks there are peeved. Full year season ticket holders literally got no notice of the event at all. While that could be a legitimate gripe, I'm sure if they do go to the event they will have many more complaints about it. They complain about everything, from pre game videos to the usher doesn't smile at them. Now they are complaining about White Sox commercials and the font on Kittle's replica jersey. Seriously, I know baseball is a tradition passed down from generation to generation, but if every little thing bothers someone so much, and they go out of their way to find the smallest thing, why not find something else to spend your money and time?

QUOTE (IlliniKrush @ Jul 11, 2013 -> 10:06 PM) http://www.baseballprospectus.com/article.php?articleid=1477 You didn't read it did you? It says it wasn't covering injury likelihoods with extended oitch counts,and also this Since its introduction, PAP has proven popular as a way to assess a team's tendency to overwork its starting rotation. However, there hasn't been the solid sabermetric analysis to support any particular pitch count metric (including PAP) to date. We will try to rectify that situation this year. The article also admitted pitch counts affect each pitcher differently.

QUOTE (sin city sox fan @ Jul 11, 2013 -> 07:09 PM) If we add 4 or 5 more quality bats to our lineup, we can be favored in many of these games. This week's series shows we already have Detroit's number and that's the most important challenge to conquer. There's no reason we can't win this division if Hahn goes out and picks up 4 or 5 guys who can hit .300 and drive in 50+ runs after the break. I like how you think. Go get yourself a hooker.

If the Heat win again next year, wouldn't that lessen the chance of Lebron moving on? He couldn't leave a team going for 4 in a row could he?

QUOTE (IlliniKrush @ Jul 11, 2013 -> 03:55 PM) Says who? Is 134 no different than 124 because it's only 10 pitches? 144 to 134? Sale is fine going 110-115. 124 isn't much more than that. Maybe 2 or 3 batters and the all star break is coming up so he gets a longer rest. Its not a big deal. If you were driving 35 mph in a 25 zone you probably wouldn't expect a ticket. 45 or 55 and you know you are doomed. I would like to know who came up with 120 as the pitch count which causes problems? And where is the study proving it? Guys on tight pitch counts seem to get injured just as much as those who are not. If they made it 125 no one would have a gripe. Another interesting thing is Ventura is constantly ripped here and Joe Maddon is the gold standard. Has anyone ever checked out the pitch counts of David Price and when he had him, James Sheilds? Always hovering around 120.

Reading what an awful time the members of that site have going to the game, it seems they have to interact heavily with ushers every visit, it is incredible they still want anything to do with the team. They actually complained about the stripes on the pants earlier this season.

QUOTE (ChiSox_Sonix @ Jul 11, 2013 -> 03:14 PM) Acting like the manager isn't the one who decides when pitchers come out and go into the game is idiotic If there was a mandate not to have Sale throw a certain number of pitches, he wouldn't throw a certain number of pitches. I think it varies from start to start as he has some off time coming up now. The difference between 114 and 124 is really nothing.

QUOTE (Noonskadoodle @ Jul 11, 2013 -> 03:05 PM) Tidy 1-2-3 for Matty. Avisail Garcia for Matt Detroit what ya say? ....or you can keep trotting Coke out there. I understand people don't care if Detroit wins the WS if the Sox are out of it, but maybe they should. Winning a WS or advancing deeply in the playoffs means increased revenue. I read yesterday that the Ilitch gravy train is starting to dry up. Money is starting to become a factor.

The Sox had no problems scoring runs this series.

All Star break coming up, a few extra pitches isn't a big deal.

We may overvalue Sale but that's how the White Sox have to think. They don't have to trade him, but if someone wants him the price has to be silly. And if someone is willing to pay a silly price for Sale, Hahn should at least listen.

QUOTE (LittleHurt05 @ Jul 11, 2013 -> 02:12 PM) I hear ya, he's not doing it in every start, so it shouldn't kill him. But when your season is down the drain already, it just seems better to be cautious with your most valuable asset. I'm sure the Sox will be very careful with him in the second half. He will probably skip a couple of starts or more. The last thing this season needs is a Sale injury.

QUOTE (ChiSox59 @ Jul 11, 2013 -> 02:09 PM) He was hit earlier in the game, as was Tank. Just a high up and in pitch when he started towards the mound. Would a pitcher really be afraid of the Grace Jones lookalike Alexei coming after him?

QUOTE (LittleHurt05 @ Jul 11, 2013 -> 01:59 PM) So what you are saying is that Sale is throwing too FEW pitches? So Robin needs to get him closer to the 140 pitch mark more often, to up his chances to be the next Randy Johnson. I wish, I just don't see what throwing 120 pitches vs. 113 a couple of times a year destroys a pitcher as is characterized as abuse. When some were complaining about Santiago not being stretched out, I mentioned he was able to throw 100 pitches in a start and the response I received was he should be able to get to 110-115. That's basically what Sale is averaging.

QUOTE (Jake @ Jul 11, 2013 -> 01:38 PM) I still think that Miggy isn't smart, he's just too supremely talented to hardly ever look fooled up there. I think his pitch recognition is simply other-worldly and his ability to convert the recognition into a result is just as impressive. I don't think he has to try hard at all to be this good. Watching him go to RF last night showed he's a magician with the bat, and a very clever hitter. I wouldn't want him taking a calculus test for me, but he's a hitting genius.

QUOTE (LittleHurt05 @ Jul 11, 2013 -> 01:33 PM) Sale is one of 2 or 3 pitchers to throw 120+ pitches twice this season. (Or something like that) Robin Ventura = white Dusty Baker In 1993, Randy Johnson went over 120 21 times. He went over 140 9 times over 150 once. He was really good for a long time after that.

QUOTE (caulfield12 @ Jul 10, 2013 -> 11:29 AM) The most interesting discussion would be Wong vs. Garcia. Frankly, I'd go with Garcia because he has more upside...and we theoretically will need to replace DeAza and Rios in the next two weeks, if not the offseason. I have no great hope that Carlos Sanchez is going to be a starter someday, but I'd rather wait more on him...and find an outfielder under cost control who would fit more appropriately with our rebuilding efforts. Now if you package Crain and Alexei together, you can improve your return, but still no Castellanos unless Illitch is REALLY desperate. If Peralta's only suspended 50 games, then they'll get him back in September and I'm guessing that he would also be included on the playoff roster (not how that works with suspended players and their status on Sept. 1, might need to be negotiated with the player's assocation)...so that would make them not quite AS desperate to trade for Alexei. They could get by with Santiago, unless the Indians really start putting the pressure on them and/or Verlander goes on the DL. I've read with the appeals process, the suspensions will all probably happen in 2014.

If the Sox were to trade Sale, you would need a top 2 or 3 prospect in all of baseball, plus a couple of other high end minor leaguers plus some quality major league starting players . It would have to be an overpay, but the contract would call for an overpay.