Dick Allen

QUOTE (RockRaines @ Jul 29, 2013 -> 12:10 PM) Prepare to be underwhelmed by the return for Crain. Anyone who actually thought the Sox were getting anything can't miss even if he wasn't on the DL hasn't been paying attention, but something is better than nothing.

QUOTE (kwill @ Jul 29, 2013 -> 11:49 AM) Does anyone think we should hang onto Crain? I am actually not opposed to hanging onto him and trying to get an extension done. He has been one of the only guys to actually live up to his contract in a sox uniform. My thought is this, you should not trade him for a marginal prospect. I agree to trading him only if you actually get something that has value and not just a lottery pick. If you cant, see if you can get a deal done with him going forward. Look, if you are not going to do a complete rebuild with Sale then you are trying to compete next year or 2015. Reed,Jones and Crain are three tremendous assets to do that. The rotation figures to be pretty solid. It's our position players who are just awful. I am not saying don't trade him. I am saying just make sure you actually get value instead of trading him for the heck of it. The White Sox do that far to often. (Simon Castro)... He is most likely going to be extremely expensive and almost certainly not as good the next couple of years. The Sox need to move him. When he's a free agent, they can always re-visit and see if his price tag makes any sense.

QUOTE (southside hitman @ Jul 29, 2013 -> 10:20 AM) I would say have every indication you are planning on starting him, but ask for team's final and best offers Tuesday morning. If not what you have looking for, have him pitch and be done with it. If someone blows you away Wednesday before the deadline so be it. Sox could always trade him this winter to a team that doesn't want to part with the king's ransom that Price will demand. Actions speak louder than words. A week or so ago, Peavy not being a rental was one reason being pointed out he was more highly thought of than Garza. Now teams want the Sox to throw in money yada, yada...those are just words, negotiating tactics. Actually putting Peavy on the mound tomorrow if no team has stepped up enough is a clear indication if they want Jake, they better not screw around anymore as the games they are playing already cost them a start, and the White Sox won't settle.

QUOTE (CaliSoxFanViaSWside @ Jul 29, 2013 -> 09:45 AM) You show you're content with keeping him after 7/31 . There's no way you start him tomorrow. The only thing starting him tomorrow would show is the Sox are idiots. I think it would show they are desperate to move him, and if anything, encourage teams not to pay too much. The Sox need to keep the leverage. I think it will all be moot anyway.

QUOTE (GreenSox @ Jul 29, 2013 -> 09:29 AM) The Sox shouldn't start him tomorrow. It doesn't matter to us if we trade him Tue or Wed. By starting him, his value is decreased as teams will get 1 less start out of him (or 4/5 less of a start). He's had sufficient post-injury auditions. Starting him would also show the Sox would be content keeping him. If teams want to play games, play games right back. His value is decreased for the acquiring team this year by one start but the total package shouldn't change. I think while it won't be the original asking price because you should aim high, Hahn will ultimately get what he originally was willing to trade him for or more by tomorrow afternoon. If not, start him. Why settle?

Since Peavy is scheduled to start tomorrow, teams acquiring him should be motivated to make a deal before then. They could get an extra start out of him this season.

QUOTE (bighurt4life @ Jul 28, 2013 -> 06:17 PM) Does anyone think that he's already been told that the trade has gone down with team X but isn't announced yet and he's just holding his tongue. Is there any precedence for someone to clear out their locker like this in anticipation of a trade? That doesn't make any sense to me, I would guess that the trade has taken place and the league just needs to sign off on it before anything is announced. No, I don't think there is anything more to it than they are hitting the road and won't be back until after the deadline and is very likely to be moved.

QUOTE (Jake @ Jul 28, 2013 -> 06:29 PM) Any objective analysis of Nate Schierholtz would scream "fluke year" and "not good at baseball" Anyhow, this rumor is a dud. Hanson just took a long poop Of course, but that doesn't matter. Give me the guy that is going well this year. There were far better overall releivers than Cliff Politte and Neal Cotts in 2005, but if the Sox traded them for 2 other guys, it would have weakened them. Maybe the Pirates told this guy to go burn a mule for gamesmanship.

QUOTE (Jake @ Jul 28, 2013 -> 06:20 PM) When one projects how the rest of the season will go, we wonder..."what is the likelihood this player continues this performance?" It would seem to be a very good bet that Rios outplays Schierholtz for the rest of the season. Schierholtz is in for a big raise next year in arbitration anyway. We'll kick in some cash There is a reason they scout these gys instead of just looking at their baseball cards.

QUOTE (Jake @ Jul 28, 2013 -> 06:16 PM) Schierholtz career WAR - 6.5 career high prior to this season - 1.3 this season - 2.1 Rios career WAR - 25.4 career high - 5.5 this season - 2.0 seasons over 2.1 - 6 (seventh in progress) They're not even in the same ballpark The past doesn't matter. It is this season that matters. Shierholtz is hitting better and makes 1/6th the paycheck.

QUOTE (fathom @ Jul 28, 2013 -> 06:13 PM) He is a strict platoon player. When is the last time a platoon player was traded for a top 50 guy? As I said, I don't know if that is even a deal, but it makes a lot more sense than for Rios which everyone thought was happening a week or so ago. I beleive the Pirates really want a LH bat.

QUOTE (Jake @ Jul 28, 2013 -> 06:10 PM) A long, long track record is relevant here The attractiveness of a guy like Schierholtz in the trade market is that you WOULDN'T have to trade a guy like Hanson to get him No its not, its for 2 months, and it isn't like Rios has a stellar track record. I don't know if that is going to be the deal, but it makes a lot more sense than trading him for Rios.

QUOTE (Jake @ Jul 28, 2013 -> 06:02 PM) Christ, Schierholtz is not a good baseball player. Paying a lot for a league average bat, at best He has an .876 ops. More homers, better batting average and better on base percentage than Rios and makes $10 million a year less.

QUOTE (flavum @ Jul 28, 2013 -> 05:28 PM) Sox 16-38 the last 54 games. That's two months of playing .296 baseball. But Ventura is doing a fine job. Yes, every manager should be judged on his win loss.

Rios postgame comment: To tell you the truth, I don't think there is much I could have done . Holland's postgame comment: I don't know what Rios was thinking but we got lucky there.

QUOTE (LittleHurt05 @ Jul 27, 2013 -> 09:47 PM) The White Sox are 9th in baseball in batting average with RISP. They are 27th in OBP. They are getting hits when runners are on, it's just that people aren't getting on base very often. I think WGN always has pcts and the Sox pcts are always higher than the league average for scoring guys on first with 2 out or guy on 2nd with one out. You are correct, they just aren't in that situation as much as other teams.

QUOTE (greg775 @ Jul 27, 2013 -> 09:35 PM) Somebody at work made an interesting point. They said it looked like Paulie swung at ball four and it coulda been bases loaded and nobody out. Interesting take from Royals' fans IMO. But I calmly polled everybody here and THEY ALL said Rios made the wrong call and he'd have scored easily whether the ball was caught or fell for a hit had he simply tagged up like I was taught to do in Little League. He would have for sure. He also might have if he went back to 3rd when the RF started to dive. Worst case scenerio if he tagged up, and the ball dropped and he couldn't score , which tonight with the guy on the ground he scores easily either way, would have been bases loaded one out instead of 2 out man on 3rd. It was a dumb display. I know there are some big Rios apologists on here, but if it was their job to scout him for another team and it was their reputation and job on the line, how do you ignore the loafing? How do you ignore sliding into second on a base hit on a hit and run because the SS is deeked you? How many fall for that? How do you ignore the less than .700 OPS the last 2 months? How do you ignore tonight's gaffe?

QUOTE (Marty34 @ Jul 27, 2013 -> 01:32 PM) Throughout his career he's been a 60 inning pitcher and as such needs to be handled with great care. They very fact that he landed on the DL with a "tired" shoulder tells you he was overworked. 60 innings a year and averages about a month on the DL. Guess what 60/5=? That is what he averages a month, which is what he is averaging this year. Where was it reported he has a tired shoulder? Give me a link.

QUOTE (fathom @ Jul 27, 2013 -> 09:02 PM) He would have been safe if he tagged up. I agree with you about the play not being an easy decision for him. I was sitting behind the Sox dugout. Rios went halfway down the line and froze. It was very apparen5 if the ball was going to be caught the RF would have to get on the ground.i know a few thousand people were telling him to tag. 3 stupid plays by him the last 2 weeks. Jaking it to first. Getting deeked by the SS and this. He is a talented but dumb player.

QUOTE (SoxPride18 @ Jul 27, 2013 -> 04:47 PM) I'm getting the feeling that nothing is going to happen from now to the deadline. I really doubt the Sox would have sent out that survey if they aren't going to be dropping some guys. Hawk elued to fans understanding if the team decided to play for 2015. It woulld be shocking if nothing happened, but Hahn has to hold oit for the best package. He can't get ansy and settle for something when other teams may offer more as the deadline nears, or another layer or 3 may go down.

QUOTE (ChiSox59 @ Jul 27, 2013 -> 04:31 PM) I am not denying Rios plays with no fire, but I must have missed those comments. He is very talented and a graceful athlete. It could appear he looks like he isn't maximg effor pt when he does, but it's been pretty obvious after a great start, he's pretty much checked out the last 2 months. He's been just another guy in June and July. A guy a team can acquire who carries a far smaller price tag. I really think his comments about being benched hurt his value as well. He knew it was wrong and unacceptable, yet didn't think he had to pay the consequences. The fact is Robin could have embarrassed him far more than he did, and the guy who really embarrassed Rios was Rios.

QUOTE (ChiSox59 @ Jul 27, 2013 -> 04:20 PM) How did he rip Robin? His initial comments were that he should have been hustling. He said Robin handled it wrong and embarrassed him. Robin shouldn't have pulled him, but talked to him about it after the game. Lou Piniella used to say he yanked guys from games who dogged it down the line because he just assumed if they couldn't run hard , they must be hurt. Rios" half efforts drag down his value.

QUOTE (Marty34 @ Jul 27, 2013 -> 01:18 PM) I don't think you understand the game all that much if you a.) don't believe Crain was overworked and b.) if you don't think his being overworked led to him being placed on the DL. He wasn't overworked. If he can't pitch 12 innings a month as a middle reliever, and he makes $4-5 million, you aren't getting anything worthwhile back for him. Look at the gamelogs and explain how he was overworked.

QUOTE (Balta1701 @ Jul 27, 2013 -> 12:36 PM) A couple of those you've assumed guys stay healthy (Tampa, David Price hasn't been there all year) and you've neglected the NL/AL transition (Cincy, Pittsburgh). The usual rule is subtract something like 0.75-1 from a guy's ERA if they switch leagues, although that might be a bit smaller now that the full interleague schedule has started. In the NL he'd probably be putting up an ERA close to 3.25, maybe even 3 if he was pitching somewhere like San Fran. Keep in mind Peavy pitched 2 games with a broken rib and was hit hard. His ERA for his other starts is right about 3.00 and that is pitching with a terrible defense. I thin Sox fans are really underestimating how good he has actually been this year and last.

QUOTE (Marty34 @ Jul 27, 2013 -> 08:52 AM) Like when they are on the DL. Using that logic, anyone the Sox are thinking about trading needs to be riding pine. They might get hurt. Considering how many you want them to trade, they wouldn't be able to field a team. Just take forfeits until they can I guess. But I am well aware you are just trolling.