Dick Allen

So lets see, KW has a team that was 6 losses away from being the worst in baseball on the major league level. His farm system ranks next to last in baseball. He has the payroll up over $100 million, and he thinks the upgrade of Cabrera over Uribe, Quentin, Linebrink plus a CF like Crisp while taking away Garland from the rotation and putting Floyd and Danks in there for a full season will cure all that ails this team. He is arrogant I'll give him that. Probably not very smart either.

QUOTE(Punch and Judy Garland @ Dec 12, 2007 -> 10:30 PM) At this point I'm leery of any spin they put out there. No offense to some around here, but many overbought into the "grinder" garbage that came out in 06 and 07. I wonder if they will go back to that well once more There will be plenty of grinderness on the 2008 roster. KW called Quentin a grinder.

Andy Gonzalez has been non tendered. KW is trying to get some positive pub. I don't know why they didn't remove him from the 40 earlier. Maybe a trade is near.

QUOTE(WCSox @ Dec 12, 2007 -> 06:15 PM) It's disappointing that the Sox still have those holes in the OF, but I'm not super-upset about them not paying $90 million for Hunter or $50+ million for good-but-not-great players like Rowand or Fukudome. I'm more concerned about how Contreras and Floyd will pitch next year. The question is who will they get to play the OF in the future? It doesn't look like prices are going to come down anytime soon.

It will all be worth it if Roger Clemens makes the list.

I think there will be a lot of pitchers on the list.

QUOTE(beck72 @ Dec 11, 2007 -> 05:39 AM) Whether or not Danks and Floyd can be #1-3 starters is besides the point going into 2008. They need to be effective in the 4th and 5th spots. KW's "hype" is another man's confidence booster. Danks and Floyd can read KW's and Ozzie's comments about not worrying about the starting pitching and continue working out getting ready for the season. If both Danks and Floyd "trust their stuff" ie not nibbling, attacking hitters, not walking guys, they should be fine. My only concern is if they tire late in the year after racking up innings in the bigs. Yet Gio should be ready by late 2008 to come up if needed. Gio's not a bad backup plan. Not to mention Egbert or Broadway as 2nd or 3rd choices. I fail to seehow something that comes out of KW's mouth in December is going to help Floyd's and Danks' performance beginning next April. KW had the same rah rah stuff about the bullpen last year. He said the same things about Floyd and Danks last year, look what happened.

QUOTE(LVSoxFan @ Dec 12, 2007 -> 05:27 PM) Wow this is great. With all of Kenny Wannestedt's talk after the embarassing, pathetic 2006 season about being pissed off and going after the big fish, he not only doesn't come up with a medium fish, he doesn't come up with A fish. Had he gone after Rowand right away as a cheaper option (leave the Rowand arguments on other threads, I'm just saying) and not put all is eggs in Torii's basket only to be sniped by the Angels, he probably wouldn't that same egg all over his face now and helped drive Rowand's price up in the meantime. Oh, did I say Rowand? Don't worry: he won't be coming back now. Ever. Why bring back a guy from 2005--you do remember that year, don't you?--when instead you can bring back 2007 for a sequel: Corpseball II: No-Fundamentals Boogaloo. Mmm mmm. I can hardly wait. Fukudome? HAHAHHA. Yeah we were never even CONSIDERED by that guy because a) he could probably smell the stink over there and B) unlike us, the Cubs have a chance in 2008. We did, however, get a nice rental in Cabrera, who should have absolutely zero impact seeing that he's surrounded by the same aging, lumbering, station-to-station team that floundered through 2007, setting new lows and I believe having the worst batting average in the conference AT LEAST. Oh, but the good news doesn't stop there! To get our rental, we traded away one of our proven starting pitchers, who's now probably going to have a career year and remember once again what it was like to be something we won't be for years: a contender. Ho, ho, ho! Merrrry Christmas Sox fans! And to prove that he's on the ball and not in dreamland, he publicly stated that the Tigers, after their mega-trade, are merely now able to compete with us--LOL--when the reality is they're going to make us their prison b**** for all of 2008. And a Happy New Year! Usually when something's broke, you fix it. What you don't do is give it a new paint job and shove it right back in front of us and expect to be applauded. I've seen this movie before. In 2nd half of 2006. In all of 2007. Nobody asked for a 2008 sequel. The biggest slap is KW bettered the Cubs offer but still was rejected.

QUOTE(Chisoxfn @ Dec 12, 2007 -> 04:31 PM) Would one of those guys alone get a deal done for Hamilton or are we talking about a ridiculous package. I'd consider dealing Hamilton for one very good prospect but I don't know if I'd start going crazy packaging people. I'd prefer to put up an offer of one of the starting pitching prospects (preferably one not name Gio/Danks but I'd probably give up Gio before Danks) as well as Sweeney or Anderson. I know talent for talent wise it isn't a great deal from the Reds side of things but I just can't see giving up a ton of talent for a guy with that type of checkered past. However, I would be incredibly excited if the club picked Hamilton up since he is a super talented player. I agree it would be a huge risk. Not to be insensitive, and kudos to him for getting clean, but a lot more addicts fall off the wagon than stay on. One fall and he's probably done.

QUOTE(santo=dorf @ Dec 12, 2007 -> 05:12 PM) Where did you hear that? Suntimes.com. According to his agent.

Its now being reported the Sox actually bid higher than the Cubs for Fukudome.

Jose Canseco

QUOTE(Balta1701 @ Dec 12, 2007 -> 03:32 PM) But, here's the one part of that point. Teams like the White Sox, the Cardinals, and even the Red Sox are winning series now not because they try to fix all their holes through FA, but because they've made a number of smart moves that sneak around guys like Rowand who go for top dollar off of a career year. The Red Sox have picked up guys like Ortiz, Lowell, and Beckett and signed them to affordable deals well before they hit FA, and they've plugged in a few intelligently developed pieces like the rookies we saw this year. The Cards struck gold with some pitchers no one would come close to. The White Sox got a bunch of guys in at well below market price due to injuries, attitude, or Kaz Matsui. If the White Sox signed rowand, it might have increased our chances of making the playoffs this year by 1-2%. Even with Rowand, we'd still need an awful lot of other stuff to go right. That's, quite simply, why I really dislike the idea of trying to fix last year's debacle through FA. Play the kids, and at least see if you get lucky. If you do, then at worst you've got cheap talent or trade bait, and if you don't, then you see which holes you still need to fill. You make a great point. It just doesn't fit with KW's win now approach. The White Sox don't like to pay full price. It can be argued the only one who is getting it now would be Linebrink and they have a $100 million payroll and still stink.

I think Dye and Buerhle may be the last "hometown discounts" KW will ever get done.

QUOTE(southsider2k5 @ Dec 12, 2007 -> 02:11 PM) Serious question here... because so many people seem to have this opinion, would you all rather return to the Ron Schuler years where we'd maybe make one decent trade a winter, but you could pretty much be assured that we wouldn't be after any major players? I know the knock on Kenny is all of the sudden is that he is "missing" on all of the players, but the fact that he is chasing them, even when the odds are against him in all of these cases just tells me he is willing to try to do whatever it takes to try to improve. Think about it. Torii Hunter was supposedly going to get blown away from this huge offer from Texas. You all heard the impression Kenny made on Hunter, and how close he was to coming here. Miguel Cabrera was supposedly going to the Angels. In steps Kenny, and he was leading the race, until Florida changed the terms and insisted we take on Dontrelle Willis. Fukudome was supposedly only going to consider the Cubs, yet Kenny goes out and matches the Cubs offer, only to fail because the guy wanted to pad his own ego with the #1 and having to play RF, plus being the #1 Japanese player on the northside. What do these all have in common? Kenny fought for all three of the guys dispite the odds. A guy like Ron Schuler would have never been heard from on any of these stages. He would have been happy to plug in some rookies, and some type b/c free agents, and move on having no expecations of anything for the next season. Its insane to hold someone's work ethic against them. Its almost like people would be happier if we weren't ever mentioned at all in connection with players. Give me the guy going for the gold ring, instead of the guy who is content to see how long he can go around on the merri-go-round. KW has never signed a big time full priced free agent from another team. If the standard is Schueler, we obviously don't expect much. KW's problem has never been effort, but effort means little at this stage, results matter. KW needs to have a plan that actually has a good chance of occurring. Hunter's praise, while nice, matters little. He praised just about everyone and took the Angels money. Fukudome was going to the Cubs. Nice effort, but maybe that's what they want you to think. He promised a dynamic offense. The offseason isn't over yet. If he doesn't deliver, something needs to be done.

QUOTE(iamshack @ Dec 12, 2007 -> 12:05 PM) Fair enough...I was just rehashing what the brilliant BRUCE! Levine said... I know. Bruce likes to make things a little dramatic.

QUOTE(iamshack @ Dec 12, 2007 -> 09:35 AM) Levine just stated that the Rangers made the best offer at over $50 million, while the Sox and Cubs both came in at 4/$48 million. Apparently, Fukudome wanted to play RF. Out of respect for Jermaine Dye, he did not want to cause Jermaine to play a different position on account of him. Basically, it sounds as if he did not want to play CF for us. Another factor was that he wanted to be the first Japanese player to play for the Cubs. Thus, he requested uniform #1. I think the real reason Fukudome requested #1 is because that is the number he wore in Japan.

QUOTE(sircaffey @ Dec 12, 2007 -> 11:13 AM) At this point, I would much rather go into the season with this failed attempt at competing. I do not want a rebuilding process to start now for one reason, and one reason only. KW is still here. Let the season play out, and then after we lose another 90 games KW will be fired. If KW is heading a rebuilding process we will not be rebuilt before 2015. I don't see anyway JR doesn't give KW a shot at rebuilding. The only way he leaves is if he quits, at least for a few years IMO.

QUOTE(RockRaines @ Dec 12, 2007 -> 10:07 AM) Sooooo. Kw offers the exact same amount of money as the cubs, wants to put him in cf like all of you do, and fukudome decides he'd rather play for the cubs because he wants to be in rf, and be the first japanese player for the franchise, and your reaction is of disgust and anger towards kw? At least be a little rational in your thoughts. There appears to be either a lot of sexual frustration going on, or a lot of misinformed angry little kids lashing out. What would be troubling is if he's offering the same amount as other teams, that the targets are choosing the other teams. Fuk to the Cubs has been a foregone conclusion for a while.

QUOTE(NorthSideSox72 @ Dec 12, 2007 -> 08:19 AM) The funny thing about that headline is, the only reason Hendry has "deep pockets" is that he is spending someone else's money. Its an odd position to be in, but there it is. He basically has NO pockets, just a pile of phantom cash to spend. The next owner of the Cubs is going to face some awful choices in a couple years - raise ticket prices in a huge way, or become the Baltimore Orioles, saddled with those long term, overpaying contracts. They jacked up ticket prices over 20% this year, but because they had their playoff money in and only 1 playoff game was played at home, Cub fans didn't notice. The White Sox raised prices after a horrible year. They really have their work cut out for them.

QUOTE(Texsox @ Dec 12, 2007 -> 08:17 AM) When every single CF signs and is "over paid" guess what? That's the market. That isn't overpaid, that is the current price. Anderson and count the money! Rest easy we're in fourth place but haven't signed any bad contracts To put some more wood on the fire, Steve Stone said Cleveland is the frontrunner for Haren.

QUOTE(CWSGuy406 @ Dec 11, 2007 -> 10:47 PM) It's okay, fellas, this just puts the Cubs in a better position to compete with us. I'm thinking more and more about the Garland-Cabrera trade. I'm thinking Kenny acted much too quickly. He said he had deals on the table where we would've gotten prospects back -- hell, I don't think it's a stretch to say the Sox could've gotten Milledge for Garland and somebody else (or some cash). We're so f***ed right now. I'm gonna laugh when Kenny tries to tell the fans we're going to compete in 2008 with Jerry Owens in CF. The plan will soon be revealed.

QUOTE(frankie5angels @ Dec 11, 2007 -> 10:45 PM) It doesn't matter to those teams if they are set in the outfield or not. If the guy was thought of as a can't miss type of guy who was gonna come here and be a stud, both the Red Sox and the Yankees would have made a play for him. Money is no object to them. How come they didn't get Ichiro? What about Miguel Cabrera? Torii Hunter? Why aren't they after Aaron Rowand?

QUOTE(jenks45monster @ Dec 11, 2007 -> 10:42 PM) Not to mention Curt Schilling as an inning eater for at least one more season. I forgot about Schilling. For some reason I don't think Theo has Danks and Floyd as top of the rotation guys.

QUOTE(NorthSideSox72 @ Dec 11, 2007 -> 10:41 PM) You think they will be keeping Santana around? Or extending him? Its possible, but it seems unlikely to me. What's sad is Pohlad has more money than anyone. I think they will deal him. They should be real good in a couple of years. It kind of reminds me of when Cleveland rebuilt and dealt Colon. I think the Twins have a head start on that team.