witesoxfan

Everything's a smoke screen from this point forward until ink hits paper. This could just as easily be a ploy by the White Sox to attempt to drive the price down for the other teams so they can submit their original bid and hope to sneak away with him.

QUOTE (ewokpelts @ Jan 15, 2014 -> 03:27 PM) Well, he's a recovering addict, divorced, and likely paying child support. As much as I was pissed about his attitude in 2009-2010, I'm not going to be a dick and say "you should be able to handle that check,bobby". I'm also guessing, though I'm not certain on this whatsoever, that there is some sort of lesser health insurance policy set up by MLB in the event that you were injured as a player. I'm guessing that is helping to pay for some of it. Like I said, I sign him because maybe he has a chance to come back and be a valuable pitcher eventually. I'm not signing him because he's poor.

QUOTE (KyYlE23 @ Jan 15, 2014 -> 02:12 PM) fun fact, most restaurant guac is half cut with mashed peas So that's why I usually hate guac. We ate at a restaurant in Minneapolis where they actually made the guac at your table. It was amazing.

QUOTE (lasttriptotulsa @ Jan 15, 2014 -> 02:16 PM) I really think a lot of that you can throw out the window. Tanaka is probably going to go wherever the most money is. I agree. I also think that working out some sort of deal where he only gets 4 years so he can make more and sign another contract is out of the question, so long as Casey Close is smart. You have no idea how effective he is going to be, nor any idea of how long he will pitch while being effective. If the Sox offer 4/$80 and the Yankees offer 6/$120, you take that extra $40 million and run.

QUOTE (HickoryHuskers @ Jan 15, 2014 -> 02:01 PM) She's #4 on my list of chicks I'd like to bang, right behind Kate Upton, Kate Upton and Kate Upton. I think she's too hot for that. It'd be over in 10 seconds.

QUOTE (IowaSoxFan @ Jan 15, 2014 -> 12:21 PM) I think the Yankees are in for some dark times ahead. Too much money tied up in players that are not worth what they are paid. They still owe A-Rod ~$94M through 2017, even with him being suspended for this season. Add in Tex, McCann, Ellsbury, and Sabathia they are going to struggle to field competitive teams if they are going to continue and try and stay below the luxury tax. I knew Beltran wasn't the big outfielder I was thinking of. Not sure why I couldn't remember Ellsbury. They just don't have a lot coming up for infielders, and their current options are really poor. They have a lot of decent outfielders, but Beltran has to start declining eventually and the end of the Ellsbury deal could be ugly, plus McCann is going to have to move off catcher soon too. They are finding out very quickly that you can't simply just sign free agents to build your team. They need an infusion of talent very quickly from the minors.

QUOTE (SoxFan1 @ Jan 15, 2014 -> 12:19 PM) Never has a woman been more overrated in the history of mankind than Kate Upton. I would do anything she told me to.

QUOTE (lasttriptotulsa @ Jan 15, 2014 -> 11:55 AM) I just don't see the Dodgers signing Tanaka. Between the Kershaw deal, the desire to extend Ramirez and all the other albatross contracts they have on the books (Ethier, Gonzalez, Beckett, Greinke, Kemp and Crawford) I just don't see where the money is going to come from. Beckett comes off the books after 2014, but the rest of the guys I believe are locked up through at least 2017 at around $103 million just for those 5 players. Add in the Kershaw, Tanaka and Ramirez contracts and you're talking $175 million+ for 8 players. I know the Dodgers are willing to spend, but I just don't see how that's doable for any franchise. I actually agree. You need to leave yourself SOME room for flexibility. That team would be looking at the possibility of costing like $250-300 million in short order including luxury taxes. I still think he ends up with the Yankees. Their need is far greater than anybody else's and they can spend to make it happen. Personally, I think they'd be better allocating that money between Garza and Jimenez if they think they want to compete, but really, that team is closer to last place than they are first. I honestly think they'd be better tanking this year and trying to rebuild the team, but a 3 year contract to Beltran and a 5 year contract to McCann, along with all the other money tied up on the roster, prohibits that quite a bit.

QUOTE (bmags @ Jan 15, 2014 -> 10:17 AM) We are talking about an 8th starter. I think it's closer to 10th best, but the reason you add him is so you can call him up and not worry if you ultimately end up losing him on waivers while not burning options for guys like Beck or Snodgress. Basically, if they need a guy for 1 start, and he just so happens to be fresh for the start, you can call him up. It's about a 1% chance that he is even used this year. I do agree with Dick that it's pretty empty depth.

QUOTE (IowaSoxFan @ Jan 15, 2014 -> 10:00 AM) Sanchez had a .424 OBP in AA, playing the level two years younger than Semien. Granted it is a small sample, but it amazes me how many people are willing to give up on Sanchez and proclaim Semien a better prospect. Sanchez also hit .370, and it was only over 30 games. For the year, his IsoOBP was .055 and IsoSLG was .070. If he's not hitting for average, he's going to be fairly unproductive. Think Placido Polanco. Semien's IsoOBP in the minors last year was .117 and his IsoSLG was .195. The differences between the two are vast. You can make a lot of comparisons, but his numbers are not that far off from Chase Utley's in the minors. I like Carlos Sanchez and I think he can be a good big league player, but let's put things in perspective.

QUOTE (Dick Allen @ Jan 15, 2014 -> 09:56 AM) Didn't Phil Rogers constantly cry about the Sox letting Ely get away? Then he just stopped. His first few starts with the Dodgers were incredible. Through his first 7 starts, he put up a 2.54 ERA in 46 innings. People were complaining on here that the Sox had let a stud get away for Juan Pierre. Plus the gave up Jon Link or something too. Over his next 11 starts, he threw 54 innings and put up an ERA of 8.00, and he's pitched 15.1 innings in the majors since 2010.

QUOTE (Dick Allen @ Jan 15, 2014 -> 09:50 AM) He surprised us with gems in May. Then June and familiarity came. He had a good start vs. Seattle, but that isn't very unique, and then the roof caved in. In his last 58 1/3 innings, he gave up 102 hits 52 ER, 22 BB, 32 K and 17 HR. No one was too upset when the Sox didn't offer him a contract. Now he becomes "depth". He's John Ely.

QUOTE (ZoomSlowik @ Jan 14, 2014 -> 07:06 PM) Or just scale back/eliminate the max salary restrictions. The current setup underpays the true stars while artificially creating a windfall for the other 90% of the league. It also makes it easier to create enough room for these guys when they can only make about $16 million under the new CBA. Let Lebron get the $25 million he's worth and suddenly he has to give up a lot more money to go play in Miami. I think this is the most important thing. You also see guys like Joe Johnson getting max contracts because teams need to spend their money somehow, Joe Johnson ends up being the best free agent on the market, and you have to offer a max to sign him. If you remove max contracts and allow teams to sign guys how they want and to what they want, suddenly your stars spread out and don't organize in one place. It'd be even better if they could make contracts non-guaranteed or partially guaranteed so you can release guys and only take on part of the hit. The value of an expiring deal then decreases because teams can just release the player, and it incentivizes players staying in shape rather than working hard for 1 big deal and then hitting the Krispy Kremes.

QUOTE (southsider2k5 @ Jan 15, 2014 -> 09:28 AM) Teams take flyers on pitchers all the time who have a fraction of the stuff that Jenks had. On an incentive laden minor league deal there is literally no downside here. The reason I'd be OK with it is because the Sox doctors could then oversee his rehab, making sure everything's going fine. QUOTE (ewokpelts @ Jan 15, 2014 -> 09:31 AM) I see the sox giving him a minor league deal, if only to help with his medical bills. Jerry has made comments in the past about being worried about bobby and his health/personal issues. Plus, he's a big reason why there is a WS trophy in the reception area at the cell. If Jenks handled his money well at all, he will need absolutely no help handling the medical bills.

QUOTE (The Ultimate Champion @ Jan 14, 2014 -> 09:31 PM) ZiPS is mental masturbation without a finish. They are some of the worst and most meaningless abuses of statistics. Apparently there's nothing that weighs proven talent above minor league fodder. Yes, if you take it literally and say "Oh, that's what these guys WILL put up." It's a projection - it's used as what should be expected under normal circumstances. As you are well aware, circumstances are not always normal. Thomas proved healthy and in relatively good shape in 2006 and absolutely tore the cover off the ball. There is nothing wrong with them at all. There are also different systems, and, if you order the full ZiPS projections, they will have high end and low end projections as well. As a fan, you don't have to pay attention to projections, but you still make projections yourself. They are just as useless but they set the framework for what you expect certain players to do on the baseball field. If you didn't make projections, the name Jose Abreu would mean nothing to you and you'd merely assume that he was another slap-hitting Dominican prospect.

QUOTE (Buehrle>Wood @ Jan 15, 2014 -> 09:13 AM) I have nothing really to add other than that I think it's funny I'm defending Flowers roster spot and you're giving it away. It is ironic, but I grew pretty tired of him this year. He's proven he's a capable backup, but he barely holds a shred of value any more and he's getting to the point of being a AAAA player. I have worded the past two posts poorly though too. Initially, I want to see if they can keep Nieto and option him to the minors. However, I still think Phegley has a chance to be a nice catcher in the majors, even after his terrible performance during his call up last year, and I think he can be a .750 OPS kind of guy, and I don't think they are giving Nieto back. That leaves Flowers as the odd man out because they can't afford to keep 3 s***ty catchers. It'll go until about the last week of Spring though, so there will be plenty of time to make the proper decision. Maybe someone gets hurt or Phegley proves he is completely incapable of handling the job full time.

QUOTE (Buehrle>Wood @ Jan 15, 2014 -> 08:48 AM) I agree with the latter. I think there's a definite chance he sticks with us even if offered back. That would be ideal. We don't have to hide him and he immediately becomes our top catcher prospect. As for the former, whose spot do you have him taking? Flowers. There'll be a team's catcher that gets hurt in camp and the Sox will offer him for an A-ball arm or a guy out of options that they think they can keep. I think they'll try and work out a deal with Washington for Nieto prior to that to keep him in the system, in which case they'd go Flowers/Phegley, but I honestly don't believe they'll offer Nieto back.

QUOTE (Harry Chappas @ Jan 15, 2014 -> 08:47 AM) He had a back issue that was screwed up and now is corrected. Bullpens are a crapshoot, taking a flyer on Jenks could be helpful, I do not see how it would hurt. He had a fusion surgery. Peyton Manning had a fusion surgery on his neck in May of 2011, had to have additional surgery after that in September, and wasn't able to even begin doing any work whatsoever until December. He wasn't 100% until probably 18 months after the surgery (and really, he's probably never going to be a full 100%). The issue is not fully resolved yet. I still have no problem if the Sox sign him to a minor league deal. They can then control his rehab and maybe get him some late season work in the minors with the hopes that he might be able to get back some sort of effectiveness by 2015.

QUOTE (Buehrle>Wood @ Jan 15, 2014 -> 08:42 AM) Unless Flowers or Phegley suffer a long term injury I can't see us trying to hide a catcher for an entire 162 game season. It's not like he's that great a prospect where it would be worth it. Phegley is much more deserving of MLB ABs and not sure what Flowers option situation is. Either way it would still be hiding him since he hasn't appeared above A ball. So yeah I think we offer him back. That's most likely at the start of the season but if not then, then some point later. I think Nieto will break camp with the Sox almost no matter what, and I think he will have to show true, pure, 100% incompetence to not make the team. I also think the Sox will try and work out a deal with Washington to keep him either way. It's obvious Washington wasn't high on him, but the Sox scouts saw something they like (though who knows if that's a good or bad thing).

I feel the same way about signing Jenks as I do about signing Grady Sizemore. I wouldn't count on anything, but having a guy who was as talented as he was in his prime is not a bad thing. If you can rehab them and get them back to productivity, then great, wonderful, what a story. If not, you tried and it cost next to nothing.

QUOTE (Leonard Zelig @ Jan 14, 2014 -> 04:31 PM) Thats no sillier than assuming red is due. Of course, because it's going to land on green.

QUOTE (Eminor3rd @ Jan 14, 2014 -> 03:48 PM) That is some really bad gambling advice. It's landed black 8 times in a row. You know it's going to land black again.

QUOTE (ptatc @ Jan 14, 2014 -> 03:46 PM) They will not sign a major free agent pitcher if it's not tanaka. Oh I know. I'm glad they don't. The only one that is mildly interesting to me at all is Jimenez just because he has ace potential, but his floor is also very, very low and he's going to cost a ton. And again, I was just joking with that comment, given that Axelrod blows.

QUOTE (HickoryHuskers @ Jan 14, 2014 -> 03:03 PM) Those are relievers, and not even closers at that. I'd be shocked if Coop hasn't been asked for input on whether or not to give a starting pitcher $100M+. Point being, I think the White Sox scouts find guys that they like that they feel Cooper can work with. They may consult him, but overall, his job is to turn the crap they give him into gold. Sometimes it works, sometimes it doesn't.

QUOTE (pittshoganerkoff @ Jan 14, 2014 -> 03:34 PM) I agree. If he wants a chance, why not sign him to a minor league deal. I know there were reasons for adding pitches to his arsenal, but he was never as effective as he was with the high 90s fastball and devastaing curve. I can still vividly remember the Bagwell at-bat when he fired those three fastballs right by him. I remember being scared because that was such a perfect situation for a dramatic homer from Bagwell. Then Bobby threw him 1 fastball and I knew how the at bat was going to end.