caulfield12

while blowing a .22 BAC...that AA, you can't stop him! You can only hope to contain him. If he battled Ditka, a hurricane and all the Transformers (minus Optimus Prime), AA would still come out victorious! KW has done this in the past when he had the surplus of starters. He's already offered Danks once (the Floyd deal) and was quickly rejected. As someone mentioned, he'll make a "public offer" for something like $39 million/3 years to PRETEND we want to keep him (it's usually about PR victories with the Sox in the typical offseason) when the educated baseball fan knows there's simply no way in hell that will get it done. Then he'll quickly be traded for the best package KW and/or the new G.M. can manage to get.

http://www.chicagotribune.com/sports/break...0,5861355.story This has to limit Danks to 5 and $70/75, doesn't it? Of course, he COULD get more on the open market, but that's a pretty strong deal for the Angels....as many were suggesting Danks would get almost as much as what Weaver ended up with. I don't you can make many arguments that Danks has been in Weaver's league the last 2-3 seasons as a pitcher. Not consistently. Danks has been close to a 3 ERA at times (mostly in 2008), but sub 2.00? No way.

Certainly, our starting line-up yesterday. Yet Lillibridge/DeAza/Flowers all bring new dimensions, approaches and "excitement" to what has been a season-long malaise. Viciedo will too, eventually.

Because KW talks to Ozzie and Cooper anytime they bring a pitcher up to the Sox. And he's surely never even heard of Reed (knowing Ozzie) and won't until he's on his 25 man roster and forced to used him.

Heck, if you could take Gavin Floyd's best streaks from 2008-2011, and stick one of them at the start of 2012...he might have the same acclaim as Jimenez. But Gavin's already been there, done that because of his age and busted status position...and not quite having the "big" fastball in the mid to upper 90's.

In fact, Flowers is making a pretty strong statement that we were ready to turn over the keys to him in 2012. Escobar could factor in as replacement for Vizquel....although one can't be sure how well he could play 3B or 2B. Lillibridge really needs to get some experience at 3B, IMO. With Viciedo/DeAza/Milledge/Danks all in the mix, as well as Lillibridge for outfield spots...we should be set there. The biggest question mark is whether Lillibridge only plays against LHP in a platoon, or he's an everyday player on the infield somewhere. That would mean a trade or "surrender" of Morel/Ramirez/Beckham though. None of those things are likely if they legitimately want to compete in 2012. They won't be spending their way into contention. Cuddyer already turned down $12 million and 2 years from the Twins. In all likelihood, he'll get $15-18 and 2 from the Yankees or Red Sox. The Yankees are finally tired of Swisher, supposedly. If Reddick's the long-term plan for the Red Sox, he makes much less sense there.

Ozzie loves his veterans. Enough said.

Do you really give Towers more credit than Byrnes for the DBacks? Would anything he did with the roster have mattered without that coaching staff in place? That's pretty powerful evidence that coaching/managing DOES matter AND significantly in this game. One veteran scout described their starting line-up as "7 utility guys and Justin Upton." That's being a little tough on Chris Young, but it's not too far off, either. A lot of Sox fans wanted Dan Evans and look how that would have ended...

QUOTE (southsider2k5 @ Aug 22, 2011 -> 07:01 AM) Perhaps I can interest you in "The kids can play!"? Only if Juan Pierre is back to lead the kids!!!

He was always the smartest baserunner on the Sox. Better than even AJ. Cannon for an arm, and great range. Good pop, too. Hated the day KW brought in Royce Clayton and moved (tried to) him to CF. Dumb, dumb move. Santurce (the Crabbers), by the way, was Roberto Clemente's former team. And it was hilarious that day when he mocked Sosa in the dugout.

Can't find anything about the renegotiation on-line. It might be like the Peavy insurance subsidy...where we'll never know the precise details. It should be possible to find about the Sox-USCF deal simply because it's public information SOMEWHERE.

Would have to check, but doesn't seem like we've ever received that subsidy. Getting down to 1.5 million or less in attendance still probably wouldn't come close to being worth $2-3 million (basically less than they're paying Scott Linebrink not to pitch for the Sox this season). Bynoe said the 1988 agreement with the Sox could net the state and the authority $4 million a year during a 20-year lease. Under a ``worst-case`` scenario, Bynoe said, the authority would lose $5 million annually, according to projections. The projections of a yearly $5 million loss come from an annual $2 million subsidy and a requirement that the authority buy up to 300,000 tickets if Sox attendence does not reach 1.5 million fans in years 11-20 of the 20-year agreement. In the first 10 years of the lease, the White Sox will recieve an annual $2 million subsidy if attendance does not top 1.2 million, which Bynoe said is a break-even point for Sox owners. The agency had difficulty in complying with two new Sox demands: that it take title to homes of South Armour Square residents by October and that the General Assembly establish a continuing appropriation to ensure $5 million yearly payments for the stadium. Thomas Reynolds, authority chairman, said the Sox would accept an alternative that allows them to sue the authority if the legislature holds up payment. Reynolds also said both sides have agreed the authority must acquire the property by October.

QUOTE (fathom @ Aug 21, 2011 -> 05:57 PM) Can I use this thread to predict that Ramirez will be back next year, but Beckham will be traded in the offseason with Lillibridge taking over at 2nd next year? De Aza will be in LF in a platoon with someone we acquire with Rios in CF and Viciedo in RF. We have an obligation to give Beckham at least 1/2 more season with SOMEONE not named Greg Walker. Trading him for a bucket of balls would be almost more embarassing than just releasing him...except he'd probably end up doing well elsewhere, which would make KW look even dumber. But there's no doubt Lillibridge at even a 750 OPS (100 less than currently) would be better than Beckham at 630. The question, of course, is whether he could play everyday. If not, what LH hitter can take the other AB's? Just hate the idea of a platoon in the middle infield with how delicate the chemistry is there.

QUOTE (Chicago White Sox @ Aug 21, 2011 -> 05:41 PM) I'm sure it's just a reduction in rent. If we draw less than 2 million fans, we just pay the state less money. MARTY, YOU'RE WAY OFF....hopefully you really aren't joe cowley or you're tremendously misinformed about something that could be google'd in mere seconds. Can't wait for Rahn Emmanuel to get his $200 million for the Cubs boondoggle going. Now I'm really curious what the rent costs (that we're not paying) are...this would be a partial explanation of why we charge so much for tickets, because it actually saves money to stay under the 2 million target while bringing in the same ticket revenues as teams like the Twins or Tigers post because of significantly higher average and premium ticket pricing. GENIUS. White Sox Go Years Rent-Free At U.S. Cellular Field, the White Sox lease expires in 2011. According to Christopher Lackner, spokesman for the ISFA, which owns and operates the stadium, the White Sox have paid rent nine times since 1991, but only once since 2001, when the annual attendance target was raised from 1.2 million to 1.5 million (I'm assuming that the target number is now set at 2,000,000, the number MARTY is currently referencing). Total rent paid depends on total attendance. “For all practical purposes, the Sox don’t pay rent,” said Sanderson, because in most of the years when the Sox have paid rent, they have barely passed the rent threshold. U.S. Cellular Field originally cost $125 million to build, but enhancements have been made since the original construction, putting the total subsidy at more than $200 million, not including interest on the debt. $20 Per Ticket Subsidy In “What Do We Do With the Hotel Tax Now that We Don’t Need Any More Stadiums?” a report issued September 30, 2003 by MCIC, a not-for-profit research and information organization for the Chicago metropolitan region, the organization says under current projections, by the time the White Sox lease expires in 2011: “ ■The ISFA will have spent well over $200 million of public money to build the new stadium, the scoreboard, and other capital improvements on the site; “ ■The White Sox will not have paid a dime more in rent; “ ■U.S. Cellular Field will have attracted somewhere between a quarter million and a half million fewer spectators per year than ballparks with a similar capacity and teams with a similar won/loss record;“ ■Every person buying a ticket to attend a White Sox game from now on will have been subsidized by public money at the rate of about $20.20 per ticket.” The study argues almost none of the money spent by the teams or fans benefits the surrounding area, and that the stadiums therefore have failed to live up to promises that were made about economic development. --------------------------------------------------------------------------------

675 is more like a good month for Gordon Beckham the last 2 seasons. You have to get at least 725 out of him for him not to be hurting you.....assuming he's playing 2010 and not 2011 level defense.

QUOTE (Marty34 @ Aug 21, 2011 -> 05:33 PM) I don't think the Sox will do a total rebuild. I think Buehrle comes back, but their going to have to find money to do that. Ramirez, Quentin, Danks, and Floyd should all be options to trade. As far as season ticket sales go, the lease affords them the protection of 2M in ticket sales. 2 million at what price? GA or the cheapest upper deck seats? Certainly not premium or box seat rates. What does that even mean? So if the overall attendance was 1.8 million, they would have to recompensate the Sox for an additional 200,000 tickets? Then why do they even have to worry about trading Ramirez, because ticket sales are only about 25% of their total revenue these days. That's a counter-argument for why they should actually try to be as competitive as possible in 2012....instead of carving $20-30 million off the payroll. You're arguing for having a younger and possibly more competitive team in the future. Certainly more profitable. But in all probability nothing resembling a very good team unless absolutely everything possible breaks the right way for the Sox with underperforming players regressing to their expected means.

If Lillibridge joins the Sons of Anarchy in a patch-over, I'm ALL IN. Seriously, Brent has made himself into quite a valuable player. That we're even talking about him as a potential starter after the way he looked 2-3 seasons ago (both putrid and horrific) is amazing in and of itself...Walker has to get some of the credit for that, doesn't he???

Laughing that his hand-crafted "offense max" line-up pulled off a huge blowout against a pitcher who hadn't lost in his previous 8 starts? Well, at least we finished 4-4 against the defending AL World Series team. You have to take that.

If it's the Lillibridge with a line-drive/ground ball swing, maybe. If it's the "Hey, wow....I hit more homers than Adam Dunn" version who's constantly swinging for the fences with the big/long swing and striking out too much for someone so small, well, we've got 2/3rd's of our line-up already doing that. Short and compact, good. Whether he could hold up over 150+ games and against a steady diet of tough RH pitching, I doubt we'll ever have the opportunity to find out. If Dunn/Rios/Peavy are all coming back, Buehrle and/or Danks are gone (along with Quentin) and Lillibridge is the annointed SS...how many season tickets will that sell Mr. Smarty Marty Pants Rowland? 5000? 7500? It will be a dramatic falloff.

Does anyone hear a tree falling in the forest? Well...as soon as it's 3 or 3 1/2 GB again, some of the newly-lost fans (plus the football fanatics and back-to-schoolers) might come back. Once again, the consistency thing. Back and forth like a yo-yo or ping pong ball. Hard to get excited about any streaks unless it reaches 4-5 games.

It's a bit sad that we couldn't even consider going after the big names...whereas we're going to be considered quite lucky to be "stuck" with Rick Hahn if the Cubs aren't interested in pursuing him with all the other nationally-hyped entities in play.

And we don't have many of those "interesting to follow" players, lol.

Putting Eduardo Escobar out there wouldn't kill the defense. But Beckham and Morel might actually need to hit at 700 OPS clips to make it feasible. 600-635 won't do it for both those guys. DeAza, LillyBOMB and Flowers have all looked stout when they've had opportunities this last month. Another shutout by the Sox pitching staff. It's another offday and on to So Cal. Tigers get the Mariners. That's not good....the could reach their high point of 11 games over 500 on the season.

QUOTE (Balta1701 @ Aug 21, 2011 -> 03:03 PM) And there's another pitch Brent could have turned on and driven down the LF line. Lift and pull Brent! Open up those hips more and try to pull the ball! Did Greg Walker hack into your SoxTalk account during the game??

At least Greg will be happy for Juan Pierre's June-August success.... One hopes it's not like Kotsay late in 2009 and it ends up getting Pierre another contract with the Sox. Lilly, DeAza and Flowers (896) all over 800 OPS numbers. Amazing what a little offense can do for the pitching staff. And it's gotten us all of a .500 record.