Eminor3rd

I can't stress enough how little sense the Moncada "money we have invested in him" thing makes. I highly doubt that's a real holdup, because DD is smarter than that.

QUOTE (Dick Allen @ Aug 1, 2016 -> 10:17 AM) The Red Sox paid Moncada a $31.5 million bonus, and paid the league a $31.5 million penalty. They are invested $63 million. The Sox would pay him minimal amounts. It's Boston that doesn't want that $63 million investment to go away. If this is really the case, it's incredibly poor business logic by Boston. The money was gone the moment they acquired him; it's a sunk cost. If him and Benintendi turn into similarly productive players, it doesn't make Moncada more valuable because they spent more on him.

QUOTE (iamshack @ Aug 1, 2016 -> 08:31 AM) I understand the point you are making, but this really is not what many of us are saying. With threads titled "Sox are gonna blow this, aren't they?" and "Hahn," I must beg to differ my good man.

Soxtalk: SALE SHOULD BRING BACK EVERY TEAM'S TOP TEN PROSPECTS, EVEN IF THEY'RE ALL THE BEST IN THE GAME! DON'T WANNA PAY UP? TOUGH! YOU DON'T GET SALE THEN! *all reports indicate teams are interested but balking at Sox' high asking prices, deadline passes with no trade of Sale* Soxtalk: HAHN IS AN ABSOLUTE FAILURE FOR NOT TRADING SALE! THIS TEAM HAS NO CHANCE TO WIN EVER AGAIN AND NEEDS TO TRADE EVERYONE WHILE THEY STILL HAVE VALUE!

QUOTE (Chicago White Sox @ Jul 30, 2016 -> 11:40 AM) This team is jack with Sale though. What would you suggest they do? Hold pat? I don't see how gradual improvements over the next three years will be enough when Chris will be exiting via free agency in 2020. Starting over is really our only option. As I've said a bunch of times in several threads, if you look at the contract situations of the team, it lays out really well to "go for it" for one more season. Several of the most expensive core position players come off the books after next year, so if you're primed for an extremely active trade deadline in the event of a failure, and the prices on Sale/Quintana will be essentially the same (or perhaps slightly nearer the neighborhood of "we can actually put a prospect package together that approaches their real value without losing literally the entire farm").

I mean, if you assume the plan is actually to trade people vs competing next year, perhaps.

This team is jack without Sale. We simply don't have the depth to absorb the blow without starting over.

QUOTE (shipps @ Jul 29, 2016 -> 07:55 AM) I know a lot of you arent convinced by a lot of the Cubs guys but I will take a deal sending Q to the Cubs for Schwarber, Baez, Almora and a couple prospects you like. The reason why I would take that deal in a second is that I am convinced on those first two guys. They are sure bets IMO. They are both exactly what the Sox need. We will totally miss Q and will probably struggle for a while to find a number two equal to his quality, but damn, Schwarber and Baez would be the heart of our lineup for a long time. Their ability and their attitudes are ideal for this team right now. My heart would be absolutely broken to see Chris Sale or Jose Quintana pitch for the Cubs.

QUOTE (southsider2k5 @ Jul 28, 2016 -> 09:59 AM) Why would you settle for lesser return on a superstar pitcher with his contract? Either you get a ridiculous return, or you don't make a deal. Basically if you make a deal, you have to feel really, really good about the sum of the parts you get being better as a whole than Sale will be going forward. If the goal is to fill multiple holes, you have to feel pretty confident about getting at least two, if not 3 good starters out of this deal, with the chance at having at least one positional star come out of this deal. If not, why are you making the deal? That's EXACTLY what I'm saying. And that's why a deal is not going to get done.

QUOTE (Condor13 @ Jul 27, 2016 -> 02:09 PM) I'm almost positive you can trade a guy on the 60 day dl, that's why Yankees were trying to get Schwarber who is on the 60 day dl and there was no issue with that. Maybe it's 15 day then, not sure. There is SOME rule against trading injured guys, though.

QUOTE (bmags @ Jul 27, 2016 -> 01:28 PM) Can you do a PTBNL? Good question, not sure.

QUOTE (2Dbill @ Jul 26, 2016 -> 01:04 PM) What about trading Gonzalez to the Marlins for reliever Carter Capps. Since the Marlins appear to be" going for it" and can't really afford to trade any meaningful part of this years team to get talent- Capps would be an interesting alternative. I know that Capps had tommy john surgery in March of this year, but he was lights out as a reliever in the second half of last year.(1.16 era with 58k in 31IP) and is projected to be ready for the beginning of the 2017 season. Don't get me wrong if we could get Kolek ,I would be ecstatic but Capps would be an interesting option. I'm pretty sure you can't trade guys on the 60-day DL

QUOTE (shipps @ Jul 27, 2016 -> 11:49 AM) Shields can opt out after this year though right? If he keeps this up he probably will opt out. He wouldn't be opting out of $9m/year though, he'd be opting out of $22m/year.

I want the same thing as you guys do, but I really don't think the Red Sox are giving up both Moncada and Benintendi on top of several other top 100 prospects. Everyone agrees it's too much. "WELL THEN THEY DON'T GET SALE. SIMPLE AS THAT." Exactly. There are many other options on the market. They aren't as good as Sale, but if the cost is too high, they'll settle for less. And that's fine -- I want to keep Sale personally -- but my point is this: we aren't getting Moncada and Benintendi, so don't let your heart move that direction.

Best wishes

Or he had a bad stretch followed by a good stretch.

QUOTE (SouthSideSale @ Jul 26, 2016 -> 04:03 PM) IMO, considering the trade value we've seen for the likes of Shelby Miller in the off-season, recently Pomeranz and Chapman, Sale and Quintana BOTH should net those two. Now maybe you could argue for Quintana, after those two monster prospects, there may be a drop off of prospects to finish the deal. Whereas, trading Sale you'll land all of their top 4-5 prospects not just 2-3. What I mean is say: Sale equals Moncada, Benintendi, Devers, Kopech and Swihart. Maybe you wouldn't get Devers and Kopech as well so would have to settle for one or the other and Swihart. I don't know man. I wish I was in the know so I could figure out what each might net from Boston. Just my two cents if that makes sense. Couldn't explain it that well lol sorry. I mean, I certainly hope you're right. I just don't think Boston would take that kind of risk. That package, in current value, might be the largest collection of prospect talent to ever be traded.

QUOTE (Chicago White Sox @ Jul 26, 2016 -> 03:53 PM) For Sale? If Chapman & Pomerez are worth top 20 prospects (plus some for Chapman), you're telling me Sale isn't worth two top 10 prospects? I'm definitely not dealing Sale to the Red Sox without both Moncada & Benintendi in the deal. Anything less is a huge undersell IMO. I think that it is a common fallacy among fans to assume the extent that previous trades for given player archetypes "set the market" in the MLB. This is due to two factors: (1) the buyer is who determines the maximum price paid, since the deal isn't made if the seller's demands aren't met, and (2) every time a deal is made, it removes a team from the running in future deals, and the team that just got removed just so happened to be the one that was willing to pay the highest price for the similar player.

QUOTE (Special K @ Jul 26, 2016 -> 02:25 PM) I like the idea of holding on to 1 or both unless we get something decent. We just may given the way they've both pitching and the state of the market. (plus we quietly sneaking back to .500) If the Sox hold onto the core pieces, I would agree. But if they move Sale and/or Quintana, there's no reason not to trade everyone IMO.

No chance we'd get both Moncada and Benintendi, but either is perfectly reasonable as a centerpiece if the other pieces are strong. Benintendi is going to be an absolute monster. The contact rate is good, the plate discipline is good, and I've seen the power with my own eyes -- he played our team the year he was drafted, and hit two homers, one of which is the only ball I've ever seen clear the fence, the road, and land in the water outside the Staten Island Ferry. The pop is legit.

QUOTE (greg775 @ Jul 24, 2016 -> 02:04 PM) Great post again. You are on fire lately. I am not raging mad, but I don't think he should have been suspended at all. Make him pay for the uniforms. What the hell did he do that was so bad? He asked the team to not wear them. They should have figured something out at that point. I know you can't be bigger than the team, but don't forget you are dealing with an inept organization. Everybody in baseball with half a brain knows Ventura shouldn't still be manager and it's a joke he is. Cmon. Ventura has shown "beyond a shadow of a doubt" that this hasn't worked out. The way the Sox play, the clownish way the Sox have dropped games the last two seasons at least, has to be maddening to a competitor like Sale. Just maddening. The guy is so good compared to the rest of the bums on this team (apologies to Anderson, Abreu, Eaton, Robertson, Q, maybe Frazier) I think it's ok he freak out. He made the reasonable request and they denied it and he destroyed the jerseys. Fine. Make him pay for them. He's Chris Sale ... he should freak out having to work for these inept clowns. Repeat: Any organization that still has Robin managing at this point is not to be taken seriously. Case closed. Is this a joke post? Any organization whose player's are allowed to literally destroy jerseys in temper tantrums and NOT be punished shouldn't be taken seriously. That behavior is completely ridiculous and wouldn't be tolerated anywhere.

QUOTE (Special K @ Jul 26, 2016 -> 01:12 PM) What does that say about our GM who made that deal that we are desperately trying to unload him because of the money we took on... That being said, if we try to compete next year, I don't mind the idea of a Sale, Q, Rodon, Fulmer, Shields rotation. But it may make sense to hold on to Gonzalez as the 5th if we can trade Shields for something decent. Save money and also probably not going to notice much difference between those 2 over the course of the year (not enough that it's worth the $ we're saving) Tells you things didn't go according to plan.

poop

QUOTE (GreenSox @ Jul 23, 2016 -> 06:25 PM) The only elite prospect that the Rangers have is Gallo, and, imo, he isn't that elite. They have to put someone like mazara in there and that really isn't enough. Gallo is Russell Branyan. Mazara is so much better.

I just turned on the game and Matt Albers is pitching. What is life