Eminor3rd

Sign any defense-first veteran, play Grandal at DH. Relegate the veteran to backup if Seby outplays him, DFA the veteran when Perez is ready.

Has he developed into a good defender? Legit question. I watched him every day when I worked at Lehigh Valley (AAA) and his arm was always a rocket, but he was like Gary Sanchez at blocking balls and calling games. But that’s been five or six years ago.

I read that. Law doesn’t come off well on that article. It’s one thing to say the Astro’s made a mistake and that Abreu is cooked, it’s entirely another to say that playing Andrew Vaughn at first base is a “rebuilding team move” and suggesting the Sox might try to sign fucking Josh Bell lmao. If you’re a professional pundit and there’s ONE thing you know about white Sox roster, it’s that they’re not in the market for a free agent first baseman.

I just worry about your larger point: if they need a lefty stick in the OF, why isn’t he good enough for them? They may not know what they have and there may be something about that clubhouse or city that doesn’t sit with him, but I think oftentimes the team that has the player has the most information, and this may be a case where there’s a good reason they want to move on from him, given he provides something they feel like they need. Could be a maturity issue, a long-term health issue, or that they think his defense is so bad that the bat isn’t worth it. Certainly it’s possible that a change of scenery or better coaching could fix any of that, but I think it’s more than fair to be skeptical of White Sox and clubhouse dynamics to do better than Seattle. Like the first on paper, but I’m wary because I agree with you: something seems fishy

Ahh, sorry, I was thinking it was $8m. Busy day at work, hadn’t kept up with the updates.

Best non-prospect acquisition the Sox made since the WS. Fun to root for since day one. One of the increasingly rare players that made me feel proud as a fan beyond what he produced, and one the extremely rare players who I wanted the Sox to find a way to keep even if it wasn’t the smartest way to win on paper. Hard to get that kind of reaction out of a numbers geek like me. Thanks for everything, Jose. Hope to see a statue in the park one day.

Here’s to hoping this was a signing they made aggressively because they have objective reason to believe they can unlock his old stuff, or that it’ll come back with improved health. If that’s the case, I like it. Unfortunately, it’s much more “Sox” to think that they made this move because they decided they liked him two years ago and so they were gonna get him no matter what if he became available in their budget. The price tag being lower than expected makes me more skeptical that it’s that kind of move, as I’m fearing he may have had few suitors because the health evals aren’t looking bright.

Hurts. Knew it was gonna happen, but still. I think this was the last free agent signing I was legitimately completely hyped about. The last one where I felt like the Sox were on the right track, making aggressive smart moves. I know it made sense on paper to move on, but I wish he could have retired here.

I’m with you, but the Sox have been obstinately refusing to build this kind of depth for decades. We’re gonna get exactly five starters, who will be expected to throw 180 innings based on the value of their Names(tm), irrespective of their actual current ability or level of health or the state of the game of baseball post-2010. Given that immutable axiom, which simply exists whether we like it or not, the fifth starter might as well be someone with upside like Clevinger.

Didn't click the link, but must be Bowden.

If they’re going to give up some okay prospects for a hitter, this would make a lot more sense than Kolten Wong, to me.

Pretty sure he was thinking of Keston Huira because of the Brewers…

Unless the cost is very low, this is just another instance of this front office being stuck in 1996. If you have limited resources, why tf would you spend it on a 1 win upgrade to the only spot where you actually have some depth? I’m not saying you can’t upgrade from what the white Sox have, but if you have three 1.5 WAR guys at a spot, but you literally don’t even have three actual outfielders on your 40 man, and only even have a full starting pitching staff if you assume 150 innings of Davis Martin and perfect pitcher health otherwise, you fucking can’t afford to blow your load on a 2.5 win second baseman with downside. And yeah, you can say that this wouldn’t have to be the only move they made, and wait for the whole offseason but how many times are we going to fall for that?

Slightly smaller, slightly tackier

Old, but relevant because against MLB hitters:

I’m in the minority, but at this point I’m almost more interested in the wbc than the MLB. Nothing intentional or penal like Ron or anything, I just think the sox have so consistently done things that make me feel negative for so many years in a row now, my lizard brain is just finally deciding to try to move on. I’m also a little drunk right now so I might regret saying this.

Looks like the posting is official.

Stone Garrett used to be a bit of a stick. EDIT: Hold up, he's coming off 27 games of 131 wRC+ for the Dbacks. Couldn't find spot or a taker?

Ahh, former Rakuten Golden Eagle, JT Chargois. Wondered what happened to him.

I think the Sox can put a package together. Rays love getting high quantities of very young very risky prospects with upside because they’re so good at identifying and developing them. Even the Sox have guys like that. But if Lowe is available (every Ray is every year, who am I kidding), I think a lot of teams would be interested in trying to buy low, meaning the price probably won’t actually be low. The fit makes sense, but I don’t know if it makes sense for the Sox to blow everything they have to spend on it.

Cubs just released Jason Heyward. Uh-oh

The team "on paper" going into 2023 isn't going to look better than the team "on paper" looked going into 2022. The best we can hope for is patching a couple holes with randoms and (hopefully) some shuffling of value from positions of depth to positions of weakness via trade. Then we roll the dice again and hope for healthy, productive season from the underperformers from last year.

I’m not saying he isn’t a net positive, I’m saying there are many other places on the diamond you can choose to invest to get that kind of offense, and you can focus on defense at C and get production that the white Sox haven’t seen. Playing time is a zero sum game, but production isn’t. Maybe @bmags is right and they don’t make the playoffs in 2021 without Grandals bat, but the option when designing the roster wasn’t necessarily “have it or don’t”. What if they had a high end bat instead of a black hole in RF? What if then they got much better production on the other side of the ball at C? It’s easier to buy a bat in RF than one at C, but you can’t get what the C provides on defense anywhere else. A more productive duo at those spots may have made so they not only made the playoffs in 2021 but also didn’t get embarrassed in them.

I'm here, 100%. At this stage of my fandom, I want literally nothing out of the C slot but excellent defense and the confidence of the pitching staff. Offense is bonus, and if you get a Realmuto, congrats on winning the lottery. But that type of guy is too expensive to buy and too hard to try to develop. This is why I disliked the Grandal signing the moment it happened. I assumed he was going to hit (and he generally has), but Grandal has always seemed like the prototypical example of the edge case where analytics fails you because you don't recognize that the value a player provides is often mostly CORRELATED with the things you can measure, as opposed to literally represented in those things. For example, catchers that are elite framers and have great arms aren't valuable only because of those two characteristics, but because guys with those characteristics tend to also be great blockers, game callers, and leaders. If you find an anomaly like Grandal, where he has the two things you can measure but every pitcher he's worked with hates him, and you know he can't block a ball in the dirt -- well there's a reason that the Sox were able to get him at the price they wanted to pay. Smarter organizations know how to interpret the numbers; they know what they say AND what they don't say. Rick Hahn seems like he just finally signed up for a FanGraphs paid membership and an intern gave him a StatCast login, and he's playing around for the first time, having to get things horribly wrong in order to learn how to make them right.

I'm trying to imagine what would be going on in KW/Hahn-land that would have them considering this. Given the scenario where the Sox are trying to reduce payroll, this move only really makes sense if they are planning to trade Vaughn for Murphy, let Abreu walk, and move Grandal to 1b. If you then don't sign any OF, you put Sheets in RF until Colas usurps him? That all makes a certain kind of sick, depressing logical sense for someone wanting to shuffle deck chairs while being cheap, and so I find it plausible for the White Sox braintrust.