Eminor3rd

Brutal

At this point I think I'm a bigger fan of this board than the actual team.

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All three of the big trades were fine to me, practically everything that happened afterwards has been botched.

We are now out of the "Rebuild Era" and back into the "Mark Teahen is our offseason acquisition Era"

Yeah, I can see the sheets/Grandal move as much more plausible. Perhaps that was even the thought process in kicking the tires on Sean Murphy. In fact, the presence of Grandal just makes me think they won’t spend that money. The logic being that there’ll be another Josh Bell available next year when Grandal walks. Again, this is what I think the Sox will/would do to Sox, not what I think is best.

My point wasn’t that it couldn’t make sense, but just that if the Sox were willing to pay that kind of free agent money to have a veteran 1B, they would definitely have preferred Abreu. Letting him walk was a signal that they intend to reallocate the money for that position by handing it to an internal option.

You don't let Abreu walk at 3/58 if you're just going to sign Josh Bell. If they were open to moving AV for an OF, they would have re-signed Abreu.

I’m not saying he isn’t still good, just in decline. By which I mean his batted ball data and the delta in traditional results are both consistent with someone who is adjusting to a decrease in bat speed.

It’s not ageist, greg. It’s about being up against the limit of what your owner is willing to set your payroll, and having your best hitting prospect waiting to replace and expensive piece that is clearly in decline. The only depth the team has is decent bats that play first base and low ceiling second base utility players. They can’t afford to commit significant resources to more players on those spots.

I’m not saying you don’t give Colas a shot, I’m saying you cannot afford for it to be your only solution. Eloy has proven that he can outhit his bad defense and provide positive value, at least. Colas’ floor is way, way lower, and he’s much more likely to be down near it. But you can have your cake and eat it too in this case. You give $3m to whichever one of like, Jake Marisnick or Guillermo Heredia or Kevin Pillar or Aledmys Diaz or whatever is still available, and give Colas every opportunity to play him out of a job.

Yeah, I mean. It hasn’t been a serious attempt at contention. You don’t cut payroll 15% three years into your “window” with your core still in place, if you actually give a s%*#.

Yeah I think everyone is just aiming higher than I am when I'm talking about a hedge. As for a starter, the trade market is still open, and I don't think Eloy's days in the OF are over. I'm hoping Gavin's are. But if you find a way to get one starter, you can get a scrap heap guy as a 4th, that gives you Robert + starter you traded for or maybe signed + Eloy job split with hopefully a scrap heap guy (there's 4) and then maybe Colas comes up and takes time from the scrap heaper or gets Eloy to permanent DH. Don't forget they can and probably will stick Leury in a corner sometimes and probably think Sheets could do it in a pinch. I'm not saying it's good, I'm just kind of trying to come up with a realistic scenario I think Hahn could/might potentially engineer

I'm not totally sure I agree. Or, maybe I do, but I think there will be some $1 - 6M veterans available in February to get to be the hedge. Remember, the Sox need to add more than one OF if you think Eloy should spend a lot of time at DH and Sheets should spend a lot of time not on the 25-man roster. The second guy they add need not be all that good, just above replacement level.

Well, a guy like Benintendi is much more than a "substantial hedge." There will be serviceable but boring OFs available in their budget closer to ST. That's what I mean -- a guy with an above replacement level floor but that can be cast aside or shifted to 4th OF if Colas outplays him. FWIW, it' just my hunch/opinion, but I don't think the $180M is a hard limit. I think they'll be shopping for an OF all offseason and will be willing to go at least IN to the 180s to get it done if they find a guy they like. I don't think 2B will be addressed at all -- and honestly, given the constraints, I wouldn't address it either. I'd prioritize a decent OF first, then buy some scrap pitching depth, C depth (perhaps), an maybe even a fringey 4th OF with whatever was left.

It’s not a service time thing, it’s that it’s rare that players are immediately consistent key contributors upon their first taste of the big leagues. It would just be a very bad plan to go into the season where you’re “expecting to compete” completely reliant on a rookie who is statistically more likely to fail a time or two than to succeed. Even if you think the kid is special and very ready, you AT LEAST have to have a substantial hedge. That’s no indictment on Colas; for every Juan Soto, there are like 20 Aramis Ramirezes

Alright, that squares with what I had thought.

Yeah I mean, you’re gonna need another lefty in there quite a bit, and I’d rather he not actively harm the pitching staff while he’s at it. If he can’t manage to outhit Gavin Sheets, then DFA him. Just my opinion, but I think Grandals defense behind the plate hurts more than Eloys in LF or whatever. Certainly if either can’t stay on the field if they’re out there at all, it shifts the calculus.

Sign any defense-first veteran, play Grandal at DH. Relegate the veteran to backup if Seby outplays him, DFA the veteran when Perez is ready.

Has he developed into a good defender? Legit question. I watched him every day when I worked at Lehigh Valley (AAA) and his arm was always a rocket, but he was like Gary Sanchez at blocking balls and calling games. But that’s been five or six years ago.

I read that. Law doesn’t come off well on that article. It’s one thing to say the Astro’s made a mistake and that Abreu is cooked, it’s entirely another to say that playing Andrew Vaughn at first base is a “rebuilding team move” and suggesting the Sox might try to sign fucking Josh Bell lmao. If you’re a professional pundit and there’s ONE thing you know about white Sox roster, it’s that they’re not in the market for a free agent first baseman.

I just worry about your larger point: if they need a lefty stick in the OF, why isn’t he good enough for them? They may not know what they have and there may be something about that clubhouse or city that doesn’t sit with him, but I think oftentimes the team that has the player has the most information, and this may be a case where there’s a good reason they want to move on from him, given he provides something they feel like they need. Could be a maturity issue, a long-term health issue, or that they think his defense is so bad that the bat isn’t worth it. Certainly it’s possible that a change of scenery or better coaching could fix any of that, but I think it’s more than fair to be skeptical of White Sox and clubhouse dynamics to do better than Seattle. Like the first on paper, but I’m wary because I agree with you: something seems fishy

Ahh, sorry, I was thinking it was $8m. Busy day at work, hadn’t kept up with the updates.

Best non-prospect acquisition the Sox made since the WS. Fun to root for since day one. One of the increasingly rare players that made me feel proud as a fan beyond what he produced, and one the extremely rare players who I wanted the Sox to find a way to keep even if it wasn’t the smartest way to win on paper. Hard to get that kind of reaction out of a numbers geek like me. Thanks for everything, Jose. Hope to see a statue in the park one day.

Here’s to hoping this was a signing they made aggressively because they have objective reason to believe they can unlock his old stuff, or that it’ll come back with improved health. If that’s the case, I like it. Unfortunately, it’s much more “Sox” to think that they made this move because they decided they liked him two years ago and so they were gonna get him no matter what if he became available in their budget. The price tag being lower than expected makes me more skeptical that it’s that kind of move, as I’m fearing he may have had few suitors because the health evals aren’t looking bright.