4 minutes ago, StrangeSox said:

Exactly. You want to talk about a rigged system, there you go. Strongly outvoted for the Senate, yet still almost kept control. Outvoted in the House by five million, yet still gained seats. Lost the Presidency by 8 million votes nationally, yet came within 40k across three states of winning it again. Taking measures to make a more representative and equitable system is the opposite of rigging.

 

The Senate was set up to be "rigged".  I get that.

1 hour ago, Chisoxfn said:

All I am saying is it is a slippery slope and you need to understand how things are perceived and that there are two sides to many arguments. The reason we are in this mess to begin with is multi faceted and more than just Trump being Trump. 
 

Trump had a huge leg to play in this - in my opinion the biggest - but in many ways he was the accelerant for the fire. 
 

And I don’t have a good enough opinion on PR yes or no but I know there are arguments for both and I don’t think my first order of business should be related to this. If you want to appease - you set up something to ensure more bipartisan watchers at polling booths and just tighter state documentation of voting guidelines (won’t do anything but perception is important) plus all of the damn focus should be on COVID and economic recovery anyway. 

The reason we are in the mess we are in today is because the conservative media apparatus, the President of the United States, and the majority of Republicans in the House and the Senate spent the time since November 7, 2020 amplifying conspiracy theories that the election had been stolen from Trump with no actual evidence of that fact.  And when the courts overwhelmingly rejected those claims, continued to amplify and push remedies outside the framework of the Constitution to prevent Biden from being seated as President.  So yes, it is more than just Trump being Trump - as Mitt Romney said on the Senate floor, if the majority of Republicans had told the American people the truth from the word go - that Donald Trump lost the election - we might not be in the mess that we are in today.

 

2 minutes ago, illinilaw08 said:

The reason we are in the mess we are in today is because the conservative media apparatus, the President of the United States, and the majority of Republicans in the House and the Senate spent the time since November 7, 2020 amplifying conspiracy theories that the election had been stolen from Trump with no actual evidence of that fact.  And when the courts overwhelmingly rejected those claims, continued to amplify and push remedies outside the framework of the Constitution to prevent Biden from being seated as President.  So yes, it is more than just Trump being Trump - as Mitt Romney said on the Senate floor, if the majority of Republicans had told the American people the truth from the word go - that Donald Trump lost the election - we might not be in the mess that we are in today.

 

And when in court, Rudy says it's not a fraud case. More than once.

 

There's no contrition or admission of wrong-doing by any of the people responsible. They're just on to trying to change the topic to whining about Twitter followers and how we all need to come together and unite (but if you try to hold anyone accountable there will be more violence).

Edited January 12, 20215 yr by StrangeSox

8 minutes ago, StrangeSox said:

 

 

There's no contrition or admission of wrong-doing by any of the people responsible. They're just on to trying to change the topic to whining about Twitter followers and how we all need to come together and unite (but if you try to hold anyone accountable there will be more violence).

Lindsey the snake, back at it again. 

Anyway, in continuing news:

 

36 minutes ago, Big Hurtin said:

Sounds exactly like terrorism to me.

We do not want to upset them so better back down. 

1 hour ago, StrangeSox said:

The "hypocrisy" in question here is giving every American citizen a voice in the federal government vs. violent insurrection to overturn the results of an election, don't forget.

If you ask me, a large part of the problem is the fact that people think last week's events and wanting to give all Americans a voice/representation are equally "bad"

12 minutes ago, Jose Abreu said:

If you ask me, a large part of the problem is the fact that people think last week's events and wanting to give all Americans a voice/representation are equally "bad"

 

Capitol Police, the FBI and the National Guard are briefing Democrats in Congress on upcoming security threats and measures for Biden's inauguration. This includes metal detectors for members of Congress. Because they're worried one of the lunatics in the House may try to assassinate Biden or Harris.

 

 

38 minutes ago, Quin said:

Anyway, in continuing news:

 

Don't you know if we call for unity, these guys will just stop

1 hour ago, Soxbadger said:

Those are 2 separate issues that should not be tied together. DC citizens shouldnt have their rights marginalized to make CA citizens less marginalized. The answer should be that we try and make all votes count equally in the House and Presidential elections, and that in the Senate is 2 per state irrespective of population.

The sad part is that as populations move, these ideas could burn Democrats in the future. But doing the right thing isnt about wins or losses. 

Isn't it the opposite - I see more population movements from liberal areas to conservative areas and thus potential shifting going the other way, whether changes are made or not. California in particular has plenty of people it could lose on the left (and remain left) while saturating Texas (and shifting texas more neutral) and potentially some other places.  Shoot - Look at what happened in Georgia & Arizona.  

29 minutes ago, Chisoxfn said:

Isn't it the opposite - I see more population movements from liberal areas to conservative areas and thus potential shifting going the other way, whether changes are made or not. California in particular has plenty of people it could lose on the left (and remain left) while saturating Texas (and shifting texas more neutral) and potentially some other places.  Shoot - Look at what happened in Georgia & Arizona.  

This idea presupposes that the Republican party will never be able to convince the majority of Americans to vote for it. Should we really be legislating based on the idea that one party isnt trying to gain more voters?

In my lifetime CA, IL and NY all have had Republican Governors and Texas has had a Democrat.  We should be creating rules that are fair, not that are to try and fix perceived issues for one party or the other. 

If PR/DC want to be states, they should have that right, irrespective of what way they may vote today or tomorrow. 

1 hour ago, StrangeSox said:

 

Capitol Police, the FBI and the National Guard are briefing Democrats in Congress on upcoming security threats and measures for Biden's inauguration. This includes metal detectors for members of Congress. Because they're worried one of the lunatics in the House may try to assassinate Biden or Harris.

 

 

And this is why they could consider holding the inauguration remotely.

 

Normal party

 

 

 

 

I am old enough to remember when elections had consquences... other than riots from the losing party.

 

 

https://www.cnn.com/2021/01/12/tech/deplatforming-trump-parler-effects/index.html

Pros and Cons of Deplatforming Trump, right wing extremism

Anyway guys...for those of you that think socialism is a dirty word:

I want an economy that works for everyone, no matter their minority or majority status. 

I want a government whose policies reflect the will of the people rather than those who can contribute the most money to campaign funds. 

To make a long story short. 

 

Edited January 12, 20215 yr by Jack Parkman

 

 

 

 

31 minutes ago, Big Hurtin said:

 

It is crystal clear to everyone what happened.  They need confirmation and proof of it, no doubt.  But that was a planned and attempted insurrection.   
 

and holy fuck man.  I just can't believe this shit.

35 minutes ago, Big Hurtin said:

 

And if we don't appease the President, it will happen again.

18 minutes ago, Kyyle23 said:

 

It is crystal clear to everyone what happened.  They need confirmation and proof of it, no doubt.  But that was a planned and attempted insurrection.   
 

and holy fuck man.  I just can't believe this shit.

That much, yes.  But what it sounds like to me is specific details of what some folks where doing when they got inside.